Holy Flesh Is Surely Possible

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rachelsedge

rachelsedge

Senior Member
#21
Oct 15, 2012
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#21
Question for you, Jon4TheCross: If Christ's flesh was dead, then how or why was He tempted? It wouldn't have even affected Him if His flesh was dead, right?

Hebrews 4:15
"For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin."
 
Jon4TheCross

Jon4TheCross

Senior Member
#22
Oct 19, 2012
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#22
SarahM777 said:
Within the context of the passage

Matthew 19

19 When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. 2 Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there.

3 Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?”

4 “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’[a] 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? 6 So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”

7 “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”

8 Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. 9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”

10 The disciples said to him, “If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry.”

11 Jesus replied, “Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12 For there are eunuchs who were born that way, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others—and there are those who choose to live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.”

First the Pharisees were asking about divorce. Jesus refutes that. Next the disciples then get to the point that NO ONE should marry if that is the case. Verses 11-12 are Jesus rebuttal to their comment and points out that only those who it was given should not marry. Within the context of the passage t has nothing to do with dead flesh what so ever but with marriage.The danger comes when you take outside of what is clearly being stated and try to make say something it never did
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All cannot recieve this saying includes those who cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven, correct? You're making excuses. Are you saying it's impossible for every single born again spirit to recieve what is most assuredly possible for us to recieve?

1Co_10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Mat 7:21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:


Mat 19:11 But he said unto them, All mencannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.
Mat 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Joh 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Joh 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#23
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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#23
nathan3 said:
Never is dead flesh in connection with God.
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only thing i can find is Him saying it's awful - yucky.

Numbers 19:11
The one who touches the corpse of any person shall be unclean for seven days
 
Jon4TheCross

Jon4TheCross

Senior Member
#24
Oct 19, 2012
1,864
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#24
rachelsedge said:
Question for you, Jon4TheCross: If Christ's flesh was dead, then how or why was He tempted? It wouldn't have even affected Him if His flesh was dead, right?

Hebrews 4:15
"For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin."
Click to expand...

Jas_1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

The 40 days in the wilderness was there for us, so we could see the proof that the flesh of God has always been dead.
 
Jon4TheCross

Jon4TheCross

Senior Member
#25
Oct 19, 2012
1,864
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#25
zone said:
only thing i can find is Him saying it's awful - yucky.

Numbers 19:11
The one who touches the corpse of any person shall be unclean for seven days
Click to expand...
Y'all are speaking from the perspective of the flesh, correct?

Joh 6:58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
Joh 6:59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
Joh 6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
Joh 6:61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
Joh 6:62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and theyare life.
 
N

nathan3

Guest
#27
#27
Jon4TheCross said:
All cannot recieve this saying includes those who cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven, correct? You're making excuses. Are you saying it's impossible for every single born again spirit to recieve what is most assuredly possible for us to recieve?

1Co_10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Mat 7:21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:


Mat 19:11 But he said unto them, All mencannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.
Mat 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Joh 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Joh 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
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You actually kinda did it again ..... : /
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#28
#28
Jon4TheCross said:
We are going to all be eunuchs for all eternity, and previous scripture points out that we should receive this commandment from Christ if we are able. All things are possible, and eventually we are able, even if it takes literal death of the flesh.

Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

I'm already not male or female, if you understand what I'm saying (according to the perspective of the flesh I am male, but I do not live according to the perspective of the flesh, I only use it for the sake of this world).
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People are telling you that you not using scripture wisely, and your not.
Your missing the intent.

For instance in your above post apply the part about not bond or free part to heaven.
how do u apply that to earth will a slave become free by dying to his what?
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#29
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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#29
jon4:

did Jesus Christ come in the flesh or not?
real, literal, actual human flesh?
was He fully human?

after being born from above (you said you're only an hour old, but you said that a month ago, so i don't know....did you enter a time warp or summink?), were you glorified in your flesh?

are you actually speaking to me from heaven at the moment?

not knowing what you are saying.
please clarify: over.

losing contact...plea....bssst...zzzt...
 
SarahM777

SarahM777

Banned
#31
Dec 26, 2012
5,853
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0
#31
Jon4TheCross said:
All cannot recieve this saying includes those who cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven, correct? You're making excuses. Are you saying it's impossible for every single born again spirit to recieve what is most assuredly possible for us to recieve?
Click to expand...


Are you asking about celibacy? If so most people are to be married except those who it has been given to.

Question for you If Jesus was dead in the flesh as you say He was how then was He tempted in every way that we are and yet did not sin? Dead flesh can not be tempted. His flesh was perfect in every way but He did not sin.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#32
#32
Oh, my, Jon. Someone has to learn to read the Bible in context. God made us male and female, and male and female we'll remain in Heaven. But that verse is talking about people from every race, nation, gender being equal in his eyes, if they're united in Christ.
 
B

BarlyGurl

Guest
#33
#33
SarahM777 said:
Are you asking about celibacy? If so most people are to be married except those who it has been given to.

Question for you If Jesus was dead in the flesh as you say He was how then was He tempted in every way that we are and yet did not sin? Dead flesh can not be tempted. His flesh was perfect in every way but He did not sin.
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Sarah... he isn't talking about celibacy.... The thinks God is a EUNUCH as in SEXLESS. He ignores that the scriptures say "God made man in his image, then created woman for man, then told them to be fruitful and multiply and it was good" and twists the scriptures to say to mean he has reached some supremely enlightened spiritual status to have become a eunuch himself as God is in heaven and that we will all be sexless in heaven, never mind that there is no evidence of that (vain imagination) or that God and the Holy Spirit and angels are ALWAYS described, depicted, language tense use as MALE in the bible and the Church, Isreal, the bride are FEMALE... and GOd the Father says I am married, and Jesus is betrothed.... on and on... I think you get the picture.
 
P

Powemm

Guest
#34
#34
I still stand in agreement with John 4 the cross...

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
 
P

Powemm

Guest
#35
#35
Gods word is never wrong :)
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#37
#37
Jon4TheCross and Powemm im wondering are U2 mormons?
 
rachelsedge

rachelsedge

Senior Member
#38
Oct 15, 2012
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#38
Jon4TheCross said:
We are going to all be eunuchs for all eternity, and previous scripture points out that we should receive this commandment from Christ if we are able. All things are possible, and eventually we are able, even if it takes literal death of the flesh.
Click to expand...
Where does Christ command men to be eunuchs? I still don't see it.

Jon4TheCross said:
If our goal is to be like Jesus, then we must understand that He is a eunuch, and try for it eventually (the quicker the better for all). There's nothing wrong with being married of course, and having sex while married, but eventually you will be able to try for it if you really want to (perhaps when you get old and don't need sex anymore ;)
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Wait, so you're saying that married Christian men need to be castrated once they "don't need sex anymore"? Can you tell me when a married couple "doesn't need sex"?
 
tribesman

tribesman

Senior Member
#39
Oct 13, 2011
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#39
"Holy Flesh Is Surely Possible"

The next thing to be said is probably something like the flesh is not evil. If its not assumed already in that "possibility".

More people ought to have smelled the rat...

 
P

Powemm

Guest
#40
#40
What are two
Main. Ways we respond to difficulties?

In the spirit - Based on Gods Love
In the flesh - based on reason, emotions, opinion, philosophy, habit , impression, self pleasure, circumstances, legality , religion, ethics, pragmatism...


Some fleshly responses to difficulties
Question Gods character
Seeking ungodly solutions job 36:21
"""anger"""
Bitterness- Hebrew 12:15
Actively resist God. Romans 8
Fall away Matthew 13:21
Increased problems
Increased symptoms
Increasing fear( I'm in trouble )
Self condemnation and pride

Ultimate results of faith responses ---
Joy- 2corintjoans 8:4 great is
My confidence in you; great is
My boasting on yoir behalf, I am filled with comfort ; I overflowing with joy in all our affliction....

Praise- psalm 74;21. Let not the oppressed return dishonored... Let tue afflicted and needy praise yoiir name .

Draw near. -- job 37:15 "he delivers the afflicted in their affliction, and opens their ear in oppression...


The lie -->I need to do something
The truth -->I need to give up

The lie --> I am to weak
The truth --> I bead to lean on God

The lie--> I need to learn to cope
The truth --> I need to trying

How do we try to use the flesh to evaluate and meet our basic needs?
We perceive others after the flesh , not
The spirit ...
We put our confidence in the flesh
We try to perfect ourselves after the flesh
We attempt "to find glory" after the flesh
We attempt to do "battle" after the flesh

Since the
Mystery of vhrist in us has now been revealed ;we are to therefore no
Longer walk in the futility of our minds

We exhorted to "lean" not on our "own understanding"
We try to follow after the way tjat "seems" right
(flesh reason) the end of that way is death ....

As shown in this discussion with accusations of being Mormons .... Can you see it ? Its a learning process as we are all learning .... :).

What are some of the results of walking after the flesh?
It is " the spirit" who "gives " life... Never condeming ....
If wensow to the flesh we reap corruption ...
To be carnally flesh minded is death
[[[[Do you see relationship in this
Discussion thriving ?]]]]. Or have people
Left frustrated??! Much flesh walking it's desires out ... Remeber the
Spirit gives and brings life ...


Will continue in a
Moment
...
 
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