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Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
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I have often pondered that the 3rd Temple may be Believers.
The OT describes the Third Temple giving dimensions and design details.. So for me i believe the 3rd temple will be an actual structure.. Built during the future 1000 year reign of the LORD Jesus in Jerusalem.. You can read the description of the temple In Ezekiel chapters 40 to the end of 48..
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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The OT describes the Third Temple giving dimensions and design details..
That is not the third temple but the FOURTH temple.
Temple #1 -- Solomon's temple
Temple # 2 -- Ezra-Nehemiah's temple later modified by Herod
Temple #3 -- That which will be built by Orthodox Jews in the near future, but will be hijacked by the Antichrist.
Temple #4 -- Ezekiel's temple after the Second Coming of Christ

Jerusalem and Mount Zion feature prominently in Bible prophecy. And that is why God's hand remains on the unbelieving nation-state of Israel. Trump was 100% right in wanting Jerusalem to be the capital of Israel.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,577
3,614
113
That is not the third temple but the FOURTH temple.
Temple #1 -- Solomon's temple
Temple # 2 -- Ezra-Nehemiah's temple later modified by Herod
Temple #3 -- That which will be built by Orthodox Jews in the near future, but will be hijacked by the Antichrist.
Temple #4 -- Ezekiel's temple after the Second Coming of Christ

Jerusalem and Mount Zion feature prominently in Bible prophecy. And that is why God's hand remains on the unbelieving nation-state of Israel. Trump was 100% right in wanting Jerusalem to be the capital of Israel.
So where in the Bible is this temple # 3 prophecized ?
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,532
87
48
I have often pondered that the 3rd Temple may be Believers.
Ask your self, if your theory is correct, how can the Beast enter it, put an end to sacrifice, and sit on HaShem's thorn?
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,532
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recognizing and believing the scripture is not a "cop out"

Moses smashed the tablets.
did God not know this would happen?
is God ignorant?
is God stupid?
why didn't God make them from something unbreakable?

Do you want me to spell it "Moshe" before you will give an honest response?
you do everything your OP complains about. "you who accuse.. you yourself"
it is the same every time.
so.
do not judge.


be real.

address this.
for a person that has not given an answer to a dicret question, you sure do like to demand them.
Is HaShem all knowing YES.
So why did he not write His laws on a Diamond? You will need to ask him, he never told us why.
Now can we get back to you giving an answer as to your understanding of Mat. 5:17-18? Or is that a question you are unwilling to answer?
As for me judging, I can only work with I see. When a person tells me they never said the Law was removed, then turns around and says it was nailed to the cross, and so on, what can one think? I sure would never draw the conclusion that your saying the Law is still at work, doing as it was made to do, opening the eyes of all of us to the sin our life.
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,532
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this seems like a cop out to me because the scripture says explicitly that i have died, but you insist i have not.

because you say we are under the Law and God says we are not.

You insist the scripture is wrong,

and you want to change the subject to a hypothetical 3rd temple instead of talking about your open rejection of the plain Word of God.

again, to me? the real cop out is evident.
Ok so if you are dead, may I ask how you know anything at all?

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

As for us being under the Law of HaShem, it is after all what we will be judged by. As I made clear in post #367, I think it was.
The 3rd Temple isn't hypothetical. It is based in Prophecy. This is made clear in the following.

2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Now I know full well this isn't the Heavenly Temple. I mean for real, can you see the beast going into heaven and removing HaShem from his Thron? So what other Temple can it be? Will he sit in side of you to make the claim? most likely not, as he will be killing us that believe. at lest the ones that are still living.
Please by all means show me just once that I said Sripture is wrong, and I will walk away from this. Oh that's right I never said that, EVER. I have however done my best to get you to explain your understand and keep it in line with the Whole of Scripture. The reason for me pushing to get a direct answer on Mat. 5:17-18 is that it is on those 2 that most disagreements are based. If we can look at just them, and work out the truth from what only they say, then we will have a level field. That is unless you change your mind as you seem to do a lot.
Keep in mind I have held to my understanding through all of this. Never changing, or saying one thing then another. the same can't be side for at lest one other.
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,532
87
48
Regarding the first covenant… Jesus Christ FULFILLED it for whoever will believe and receive HIS HUMAN FULFILLMENT of the Law for us.

His Body is the human fulfillment of obeying the Law; and

His Blood is the human fulfillment of disobeying the Law.

The first covenant is completely fulfilled IN CHRIST ALONE for every believer.

Regarding the Second covenant of Grace, simply requires faith to believe and understand and live by God’s Grace…

knowing we are forgiven, loved and accepted and ushered into a relationship with God - the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
As we know, Yeshua made it clear that until Heaven and earth are done away, (not exact wording) not one jot or tittle will pass from the law. So I ask, how does the understanding of the Law being removed follow those words from Yeshua?
There is however one thing that may work here, do you know of what Law He is speaking? Trust me it isn't the whole of the Torah. As I will make clear in my next post tomorrow.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,770
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So where in the Bible is this temple # 3 prophecized ?
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand) (Mt 24:15)

Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
(2 Thess 2:4)

And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. (Rev 11:1)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,703
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Now can we get back to you giving an answer as to your understanding of Mat. 5:17-18? Or is that a question you are unwilling to answer?
for like the 15th time...

Romans 7:6​
we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not [in] the oldness of the letter.
as a Christian i am not under the Law of the covenant with Israel made at Horeb. my High Priest is not of Levi.

am i saying the Law of the old covenant with Israel is taken away? no. i am saying whether it still exists or not has no bearing on me because that law has no jurisdiction over me; it isn't the covenant into which i was adopted.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,703
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As for us being under the Law of HaShem, it is after all what we will be judged by.
John 5:24​
Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
18,819
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Ask your self, if your theory is correct, how can the Beast enter it, put an end to sacrifice, and sit on HaShem's thorn?
Which would mean it has already occurred.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
59,751
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John 5:24​
Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has
everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

John 5:24-25
:)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,703
13,516
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Please by all means show me just once that I said Sripture is wrong,
well,
see below:

Romans 6:3
do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?

Colossians 3:3
ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
Wrong, as you now live and breath you are still living.
the gospel says i have died, and you say i have not.

when i showed you two witnesses attesting to this fact, you replied "wrong"

what is this except for you saying scripture is wrong?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,703
13,516
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you have never answered me on Mat.5:17-18. Even when placed as a direct question you don't.
**ahem**

Romans 7:1​
do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law has dominion over a man as long as he lives?
Romans 7:6​
now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not the oldness of the letter.
Galatians 3:10
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written,
"Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,703
13,516
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so if you are dead, may I ask how you know anything at all?
by faith :)


Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Solomon speaks under the sun of the physical death of the body, saying truly that those in the grave have no more part of the things of the physical world - and he speaks also truly in spirit of those who have not the Son, that not having the true Life ((Who is Christ)) in their souls, they have no part in the knowledge of God - c.f.e. John 17:3
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,879
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That is seems like a cop out to me. As we know the Temple is going to be built, it has to be for prophecy to be fulfilled.
just reading your responses to other people seems like you never have any response to the point but just immediately go to carnal arguing yet never touching the point the other person is making it seems like a circular argument no matter who you are discussing with
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,879
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**ahem**

Romans 7:1​
do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law has dominion over a man as long as he lives?
Romans 7:6​
now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not the oldness of the letter.
Galatians 3:10
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written,
"Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."
a amen when a sinner is executed for thier sin the law is now fulfilled upon the sinner it has nothing to say to the dead sinner but that the sinner is accursed of God and condemned to death when a person dies the law ends

“Know ye not, brethren, how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?

…. Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:1, 4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Paul began explaining these things here
Telling us how we have died through baptism into Christ

“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:3-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

then he continues explaining how this affects the law and the believer who died in Christ first he established this idea “ you have died through baptism with Christ by faith who died for your sins “

then he continues explaining how this affects us believers within the body of Christ who died for our sins and we died in him to them …

…..Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; “

It was actually against us he delivered us from the law because it held all sinners to death

“For when we were in the flesh, ( before we got baptized and received the spirit ) the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

This means the law which says “if you commit this sin you must die “ is fulfilled for the believer in Christ who dies with him through baptism because they believe in another epistle here he’s discussing the same thing with different words

“And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:10-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“the handwriting of ordinance that was there for accusation against all sinners

“Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭31:26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

jesus removed the accuser and witness against us and gave us the gospel in its place becoming our advocate we’ve been delivered from the law because it condemned every sinner to death no one could have been saved because once you break the law it’s done

This isn’t our law and can’t save

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The gospel we’re told to hear and believe is our law of faith ……

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:21-