How old is our creation really?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Fundamental

Active member
Aug 10, 2020
376
151
43
#1
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.

Yet science had me almost convinced our earth is billions of years old. But knowing they lie and mock anyone raising serious questions I denounced science when it comes to our origins. I was really devoted in my studies but all I found was slander, corruptions, half truths to sell a full lie...

Yet my own mind raised a serious question last night: If our God is infinite, why would He only start creating roughly 6000 to 10000 years ago?

Maybe I should rewatch my beliefs on this and only see human life as a young creation? Any insight in this is very welcomed.
 
Jan 25, 2015
6,357
1,166
113
#2
The question is valid and need further investigation.

If we read the Bible carefully we will find that time is part of the creation.

God created time, so why would God only started with His creation 10 000 years ago? Because He is outside of time and it doesn't actually matter to Him. It is like asking the strongest man in the universe why he is doing one finger pushups... because he can :)

Science can do accurate carbon dating for the last +-10 000 years but older than that is all guess work and they admit it.

The reason why I do belief earth is not older than 6000 years is because of the cycles explained to us in God's word. He is clear that there is order in His creation. A little study on this subject goes a long way.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
3,090
963
113
#3
We know as a certainty that scripture gives us truth, and we also know that sometimes we do not understand the truth that it gives us. Science sometimes helps us understand the truths of scripture. Man simply knew the earth was flat because scripture spoke of the four corners. Science showed us the meaning of that scripture.

Because science has found that the earth is older than 6,000 years and is probably correct, many have turned from the Lord saying the Lord cannot be relied on as truth. I feel certain God only speaks truth, I am not sure we understand the scripture that gives tells us it is 6,000 years old.

Genesis 1:2 Now the earth was formless and empty. Couldn't this mean that there was something here when God began created the earth for us?

One thing I am certain of, and that is that it is a wrong conclusion to decide God is not absolute truth based on interpretation of scripture and deciding it is impossible for science to be wrong.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
14,951
8,063
113
#4
The Bible is not a science textbook. It was written by people who did not have a 21st-century understanding of science, or even of the scientific method. It is unwise to take somewhat nebulous statements about the natural world from Scripture and make scientific declarations from them. However, there are many very clear statements in Scripture that can be used to provide some understanding of the earth's age. Discoveries have confirmed the biblical text, rather than refuting it.

It's the speculative "sciences" that contradict the Bible. Geologic ages, for example, are based on presumptions, not experimentation. Fossils are dated from the rocks in which they are found, which are dated by the fossils found in them... etc. Even radiometric dating is highly speculative and fraught with self-refuting inconsistencies.
 

bojack

Well-known member
Dec 16, 2019
1,929
829
113
#5
I used to believe ''billions of years'' but now I believe you can add up dates given in the bible and come up with about 6 thousand yrs .. And evolution is absurd and completely out of the question
 

Corban

Active member
Jun 11, 2020
508
217
43
69
#6
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.

Yet science had me almost convinced our earth is billions of years old. But knowing they lie and mock anyone raising serious questions I denounced science when it comes to our origins. I was really devoted in my studies but all I found was slander, corruptions, half truths to sell a full lie...

Yet my own mind raised a serious question last night: If our God is infinite, why would He only start creating roughly 6000 to 10000 years ago?

Maybe I should rewatch my beliefs on this and only see human life as a young creation? Any insight in this is very welcomed.
The answer is that the Bible does not tell how long ago God made the earth. But what can be gleaned from the account is that it is much older than Adam. The Hebrew of Genesis 1:1 is a complete thought. That is, God made the heaven and the earth - period. Two things should be taken into account in this matter;
  1. In Job 38:4-7 the angels rejoiced when God made the earth. That must mean that the heavens, the dwelling of angels, was made before the earth and that the angels were already made when God made the earth. This of course is the death-knell for the big bang theory, but it still does not give an age to us.
  2. In Isaiah 45:18 and 1st Corinthians 14 we are told that God is not the author of confusion. So what happened in Genesis 1:2 was not of God's making. The literal Hebrew confirms this. The literal rendering of Genesis 1:2 is, "And the earth BECAME without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters." The Hebrew word "haya" appears 75 times in the Hebrew. It is rendered "was" only 7 times. It is rendered "come to pass" 21 times, "become" 32 times and "were happened" 6 times. Its true meaning is "became", showing a process of change. It comes from a root word that means "coming into existence". This means that after God created the earth in verse 1, something dramatic happened to cause the earth to become a chaos. God cannot look at chaos, so He covered the earth with water, as He did at Noah's time. Darkness is a further proof of God's judgment.
So what we can glean from the available evidence is that the heavens were made first, for God would not make angels without a dwelling place, and He would not make a creature without having a separation from Himself from them. Then He made the angles. Then, some time later, He made the earth. The earth was in good order until something catastrophic happened. God judged the event by covering the earth in water. How long each period was, we cannot tell. And that is the point! When God covered the earth at Noah's time, when Noah came out of the Ark, it was still the same earth but all evidence of the evil done on it was wiped away. In 1st Peter 3:20-21 we learn that the waters cleaned the earth like a man's conscience is cleaned after he forgets all that went before. It says that the "substance" is still there, but memory of what went before is not. So also does the purging of the earth by fire at the end of the millennium wipe all memory of went before (Rev.20:11, 21:4-5).

The point is that the two coverings of water, one before Adam, and one at Noah's time, wiped out evidence of what went before, so no attempts by man to discover the age of the earth will succeed.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
2,039
652
113
#7
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.

Yet science had me almost convinced our earth is billions of years old. But knowing they lie and mock anyone raising serious questions I denounced science when it comes to our origins. I was really devoted in my studies but all I found was slander, corruptions, half truths to sell a full lie...

Yet my own mind raised a serious question last night: If our God is infinite, why would He only start creating roughly 6000 to 10000 years ago?

Maybe I should rewatch my beliefs on this and only see human life as a young creation? Any insight in this is very welcomed.
The Bible clearly teaches of a young Creation.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,462
113
#8
How old it is does not matter....the deeper question is WHY this grand experiment under the sun..........

I believe there are clues as to the why, but a cursory read of the bible and or even a haphazard, skim of scriptures will not reveal these clues....it takes years of intensive study.

EVEN Jesus, disrobed his glory, took flesh, was tempted, tested, tried and had to chose between God's kingdom and the fallen Kingdom of the kosmokrator (Satan as world ruler) which he is called in Ephesians.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
1,998
474
83
#9
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.

Yet science had me almost convinced our earth is billions of years old. But knowing they lie and mock anyone raising serious questions I denounced science when it comes to our origins. I was really devoted in my studies but all I found was slander, corruptions, half truths to sell a full lie...

Yet my own mind raised a serious question last night: If our God is infinite, why would He only start creating roughly 6000 to 10000 years ago?

Maybe I should rewatch my beliefs on this and only see human life as a young creation? Any insight in this is very welcomed.
There are lots of ' why ' Questions. But it of course has to come down to scriptural authority first. The damage to the plain reading of the text is done once ' billions of years , Local flood , death before Adam ect are introduced to accommodate something that cannot be proved either way scientifically. You cannot prove from science the age of the earth , but certainly the evidence in support of a worldwide flood and a young earth is in abundance. ' proving ' the evidence by the scientific method ( observable, repeatable ect ) is another matter. The biblical evidence for a young earth is rock solid .
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
1,998
474
83
#10
I'd say that if a believer holds to billions of years its not because of the bible .
 

oldethennew

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2016
10,637
2,529
113
#11
GEN. 1:1.
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
the time space between Gen. 1:1. and !.2., is 'unknown!
(our, opinion is that it would seem to be a very LONG TIME,
simply because there is 'other evidence' that God is not 'the author of confusion',
He is always The God of complete order'...
2.
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep.
And The Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
2,039
652
113
#12
How old it is does not matter....the deeper question is WHY this grand experiment under the sun..........

I believe there are clues as to the why, but a cursory read of the bible and or even a haphazard, skim of scriptures will not reveal these clues....it takes years of intensive study.

EVEN Jesus, disrobed his glory, took flesh, was tempted, tested, tried and had to chose between God's kingdom and the fallen Kingdom of the kosmokrator (Satan as world ruler) which he is called in Ephesians.
I believe the age of Creation is a major issue.

It's the world and liberal secular humanist that want to remove God from the world.

What better lie can you give the world than to quote (Billions) of years ago, a God forgotten?

The oldest life form in California the (Bristle Cone Pine) is dated to be around 5,000 years old, putting it in line almost perfectly with Noah's Flood, in agreement with the Holy Bible

Wikipedia: Bristlecone pine covers three species of pine tree (family Pinaceae, genus Pinus, subsection Balfourianae). All three species are long-lived and highly resilient to harsh weather and bad soils. One of the three species, Pinus longaeva, is among the longest-lived life forms on Earth. The oldest Pinus longaeva is more than 4,800 years old,[1] making it the oldest known individual of any species.


Great Basin bristlecone pines in the Ancient Bristlecone Pine Forest of the White Mountains, California
 

Runningman

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2020
492
435
63
#13
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.

Yet science had me almost convinced our earth is billions of years old. But knowing they lie and mock anyone raising serious questions I denounced science when it comes to our origins. I was really devoted in my studies but all I found was slander, corruptions, half truths to sell a full lie...

Yet my own mind raised a serious question last night: If our God is infinite, why would He only start creating roughly 6000 to 10000 years ago?

Maybe I should rewatch my beliefs on this and only see human life as a young creation? Any insight in this is very welcomed.
Take the average birth rates, mortality rates, lifespans, and age of reproduction then take into account how that has changed over time. Calculate deaths from wars and other large scale disasters.

You should be able to produce an equation and make a pessimistic and optimistic estimation for what the present day population of the Earth should be after 6,000-10,000 years.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
2,039
652
113
#14
Take the average birth rates, mortality rates, lifespans, and age of reproduction then take into account how that has changed over time. Calculate deaths from wars and other large scale disasters.

You should be able to produce an equation and make a pessimistic and optimistic estimation for what the present day population of the Earth should be after 6,000-10,000 years.
I agree 100%!

Another fact that proves a (Young Earth) is earth's sea floor sediment.

Given natural erosion, the model of sediment on the sea floors today are in perfect agreement with a (Young Earth) very little, as compared to the claim of (Millions) of years that would see massive amounts deposited.
 

Fundamental

Active member
Aug 10, 2020
376
151
43
#15
Awesome guys, nice to read this all. Thank you.

The question is valid and need further investigation.

If we read the Bible carefully we will find that time is part of the creation.

God created time, so why would God only started with His creation 10 000 years ago? Because He is outside of time and it doesn't actually matter to Him. It is like asking the strongest man in the universe why he is doing one finger pushups... because he can :)

Science can do accurate carbon dating for the last +-10 000 years but older than that is all guess work and they admit it.

The reason why I do belief earth is not older than 6000 years is because of the cycles explained to us in God's word. He is clear that there is order in His creation. A little study on this subject goes a long way.
I have studied both, bible and evolution and I found myself to be in a situation like Spike Psarris, if anyone knows who I’m refering to? I saw a video on youtube of him “our created solar system” and I was simply blown away. I may not have agreed with everything he said, but sure he raised serious question and issues that are reasonable for debate.
Yet debate always seems to turn into looking down at the creationist mocking them and creating a scene where another monkeys see and does.

It was quite clear to me many people hanging on the old model refuse to see the flaws.
I am convinced life is created and human beings (as we are now) don’t roam this earth too long. But does that really make our entire creation young?
 

Fundamental

Active member
Aug 10, 2020
376
151
43
#16
We know as a certainty that scripture gives us truth, and we also know that sometimes we do not understand the truth that it gives us. Science sometimes helps us understand the truths of scripture. Man simply knew the earth was flat because scripture spoke of the four corners. Science showed us the meaning of that scripture.

Because science has found that the earth is older than 6,000 years and is probably correct, many have turned from the Lord saying the Lord cannot be relied on as truth. I feel certain God only speaks truth, I am not sure we understand the scripture that gives tells us it is 6,000 years old.

Genesis 1:2 Now the earth was formless and empty. Couldn't this mean that there was something here when God began created the earth for us?

One thing I am certain of, and that is that it is a wrong conclusion to decide God is not absolute truth based on interpretation of scripture and deciding it is impossible for science to be wrong.
Why do you think science has it correct when they count our earths age to 4.5 billions year old? Scripture gives some insight in it counting bloodlines from Adam on.
Giving my own reason place I can see why we got to an old model. It does not necessarily exclude God. But the entire story the way it is taught now (even in schools) should imho be placed in psuedoscience. We simply do not know.

Proven science is when we can test the theory and get the same results over and over again. We can not test our creation or evolution. Even radiometric datings give different readings on several tests. The danger of an old model (and excluding contradictory observations) is narrowing the research. research will always be pushed in one place and when taught in schools it will become reality. While reality the way it’s sold today has become utter insanity. And those lies, the lies.
The old model serves the theory of evolution just right while we should also investigate our younger observations.

Science we see today is not the science we had few decades ago. Those science nobelpricewinners where more creationists in the past. Now who gets nobelprices? These people have induced a different set where ideologies are overthrown and our Lord is faded.
 
Jun 24, 2020
1
0
1
#17
While the Bible is known to make gigantic leaps in time without specific details. It seems at first sight Abraham was born about 2000 years after Adam. This would show us a young creation according to our Bible.
PERSONAL OPINION: Since the "WAS" in Gen 1:2 can also be rendered "Became", there arises a possibility of an unknown amount of time between Gen 1:1, and gen 1:2, and gives rise to "The Gap Theory", which has always been MY working hypothesis about the creation. We MAY be living in the 100th creation that's taken place on this dirt ball. ANd there's some Biblical evidence that there were things going on BEFORE Adam was created (like satan's fall, and WAR in the heavenlies - etc).
 

Fundamental

Active member
Aug 10, 2020
376
151
43
#18
How old it is does not matter....the deeper question is WHY this grand experiment under the sun..........

I believe there are clues as to the why, but a cursory read of the bible and or even a haphazard, skim of scriptures will not reveal these clues....it takes years of intensive study.

EVEN Jesus, disrobed his glory, took flesh, was tempted, tested, tried and had to chose between God's kingdom and the fallen Kingdom of the kosmokrator (Satan as world ruler) which he is called in Ephesians.
Well would it not be boring if there was no creation? That’s the biggest why to it I think. But I’m only human.

The answer is that the Bible does not tell how long ago God made the earth. But what can be gleaned from the account is that it is much older than Adam. The Hebrew of Genesis 1:1 is a complete thought. That is, God made the heaven and the earth - period. Two things should be taken into account in this matter;
  1. In Job 38:4-7 the angels rejoiced when God made the earth. That must mean that the heavens, the dwelling of angels, was made before the earth and that the angels were already made when God made the earth. This of course is the death-knell for the big bang theory, but it still does not give an age to us.
  2. In Isaiah 45:18 and 1st Corinthians 14 we are told that God is not the author of confusion. So what happened in Genesis 1:2 was not of God's making. The literal Hebrew confirms this. The literal rendering of Genesis 1:2 is, "And the earth BECAME without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters." The Hebrew word "haya" appears 75 times in the Hebrew. It is rendered "was" only 7 times. It is rendered "come to pass" 21 times, "become" 32 times and "were happened" 6 times. Its true meaning is "became", showing a process of change. It comes from a root word that means "coming into existence". This means that after God created the earth in verse 1, something dramatic happened to cause the earth to become a chaos. God cannot look at chaos, so He covered the earth with water, as He did at Noah's time. Darkness is a further proof of God's judgment.
So what we can glean from the available evidence is that the heavens were made first, for God would not make angels without a dwelling place, and He would not make a creature without having a separation from Himself from them. Then He made the angles. Then, some time later, He made the earth. The earth was in good order until something catastrophic happened. God judged the event by covering the earth in water. How long each period was, we cannot tell. And that is the point! When God covered the earth at Noah's time, when Noah came out of the Ark, it was still the same earth but all evidence of the evil done on it was wiped away. In 1st Peter 3:20-21 we learn that the waters cleaned the earth like a man's conscience is cleaned after he forgets all that went before. It says that the "substance" is still there, but memory of what went before is not. So also does the purging of the earth by fire at the end of the millennium wipe all memory of went before (Rev.20:11, 21:4-5).

The point is that the two coverings of water, one before Adam, and one at Noah's time, wiped out evidence of what went before, so no attempts by man to discover the age of the earth will succeed.
Wow Corban! Great answer! Water wiped out evidence, but we still see there were dinosaurs before the flood. A lot of clues are left behind and then it is our nature to discover what went on. But what really went on is being pushed out of sight imho.
 

Fundamental

Active member
Aug 10, 2020
376
151
43
#19
Take the average birth rates, mortality rates, lifespans, and age of reproduction then take into account how that has changed over time. Calculate deaths from wars and other large scale disasters.

You should be able to produce an equation and make a pessimistic and optimistic estimation for what the present day population of the Earth should be after 6,000-10,000 years.
These models are relative and change big deals by changing the fertility rate by simply low numbers.
Yes we can come to a young generation. But inducing “elements” it can go any direction.
We don’t know the fertility rate of many lost civilizations and those of the past still alive living in isolation or gone after genocide.
 
Jan 25, 2015
6,357
1,166
113
#20
The moment we leave open a possibility for a universe zillion of years old, we accept that evolution is possible and then I can become an atheist telling everybody there is no God.

If we look at the creation account and the gap theory, God needed a long time to create heaven and earth and then a day each to do the rest of the creation :unsure: think about the implication, we were rushed together in 5 days but the rest of creation, the Creator took His time to create. I don't know. The God I serve is a God of order and He will be consistent.

Just like I don't believe I was an after thought when Israel divorced Abba Father, I won't believe I was rushed together by my Creator. We are not His dirty little secret in the corner of His creation that took 5 days to create. We are the crown of His creation and that is why He took one day to design and build Adam before he seized and enjoyed His work.