How Old Is The Earth?

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Mar 23, 2014
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Frederick Temple (1821-1902)When Temple spoke the words, “God does something much more wonderful than make the world. He makes the world make itself”
I have a side note on that statement. I believe we were visited by aliens from another world; galaxy and they visited us very long ago and planted the seed that eventually evolved into Us. And they pass by from time to time just to see how we have grown and into what-? They do not interfere with our lives, just watch as we do our thing. The choice as to what we do is ours alone, right or wrong
 
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I have a side note on that statement. I believe we were visited by aliens from another world; galaxy and they visited us very long ago and planted the seed that eventually evolved into Us. And they pass by from time to time just to see how we have grown and into what-? They do not interfere with our lives, just watch as we do our thing. The choice as to what we do is ours alone, right or wrong
That's a really different outlook. May I ask what you base ot upon?
 
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Tintin

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I have a side note on that statement. I believe we were visited by aliens from another world; galaxy and they visited us very long ago and planted the seed that eventually evolved into Us. And they pass by from time to time just to see how we have grown and into what-? They do not interfere with our lives, just watch as we do our thing. The choice as to what we do is ours alone, right or wrong
That 'belief' was birthed from a science fiction novel that was a sequel to the American rip-off of "War of the Worlds" by H.G. Wells. It was meant to be an interesting "What If?" scenario, not something to be taken seriously (sorry, so-called History Channel). I guess people start to believe any old nonsense, if they don't know God's Truth. (Love your avatar by the way. Very classy). :)
 
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wordhasit

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The age of the earth is hotly debated among Christians today. Secular scientist insist the erath is millions or even billions of years old. Many Christians agree. How old do you believe the earth is and what do you base your belief on?
If the earth is billions of years old it is rather strange that human civilization in contrast is not far from being a mere 6000 years old. A figure that is consented to by most if not all historians, with the geographical area that was Mesopotamia showing the first signs of complex human society. Can't be coincidence that the bible also pinpoints this as the very place where people began to build the first cities, some time after they had descended from the mountain range on which Noach's ark had stranded. That's a neat bit of information that the bible has got absolutely right, mentioning cities like Ur of the chaldees thousands of years before they were found again by archeologists in the 19th century. Thus confirming that civilizations, even older then Egypt, that the world only knew from the biblical record, had really existed. The holy scriptures have evidently given us tremendously accurate historical insights. Is it then wise to think of the earth as being billions of years old while the Genesis account points to a much shorter timespan? To reemphasize, the bible was right about where to find the first civilization. Therefore it is not unreasonable to point out that we should seriously consider what's been presented to us within its pages concerning the very history of the earth itself. Whoever wrote Genesis obviously had some reliable connections with access to first hand witnesses.....like God himself.
 
Aug 25, 2013
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No, you cannot make sense of it because you attempt to bring human intelligence to bear on the text and try to understand the text based on human experience and scripture cannot be read in this way.
Oh, but I think it can. Though perhaps a theist is prevented from comprehending in the same way that a Muslim cannot understand that not even Mohammed’s horse can fly. The truth of the Koran is that once one divorces Allah as the causative agent it becomes impossible to believe Mohammed flew to Heaven on a winged horse. You as a Christian, and I as an atheist, understand what a Muslim can’t; and it would seem that I understand what you can’t.
 
Aug 25, 2013
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That 'belief' was birthed from a science fiction novel that was a sequel to the American rip-off of "War of the Worlds" by H.G. Wells. It was meant to be an interesting "What If?" scenario, not something to be taken seriously (sorry, so-called History Channel). I guess people start to believe any old nonsense, if they don't know God's Truth. (Love your avatar by the way. Very classy). :)
My understanding is that Scientology was born from a sci-fi novel. :)
 
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wordhasit

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Oh, but I think it can. Though perhaps a theist is prevented from comprehending in the same way that a Muslim cannot understand that not even Mohammed’s horse can fly. The truth of the Koran is that once one divorces Allah as the causative agent it becomes impossible to believe Mohammed flew to Heaven on a winged horse. You as a Christian, and I as an atheist, understand what a Muslim can’t; and it would seem that I understand what you can’t.
It is somewhat incomprehensible that an atheist can hold that a Christian cannot comprehend that the earth could be made by anything other then God, while an atheist himself evidently cannot understand how it could have been made by other then 'nothing'. Where is the rationale in all that?
 
Aug 25, 2013
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I have a side note on that statement. I believe we were visited by aliens from another world; galaxy and they visited us very long ago and planted the seed that eventually evolved into Us. And they pass by from time to time just to see how we have grown and into what-? They do not interfere with our lives, just watch as we do our thing. The choice as to what we do is ours alone, right or wrong
This idea of yours has potential as a sci-fi story, but I think it has already been used in one of the Star Trek episodes. What reasons have you for believing it is true? While I suppose it might be true I see no reason to come to this view. Humans of course are not born from seeds, so your statement to that effect you must have meant as a metaphor. How do you suppose our lineage was introduced to this planet?

Welcome to the forum. :)
 
Aug 25, 2013
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It is somewhat incomprehensible that an atheist can hold that a Christian cannot comprehend that the earth could be made by anything other then God...
You've jumped into the discussion at the end of the conversation and I think you've misunderstood. I have frequently stated that millions of Christians accept the theory of evolution. They also accept that the solar system formed from a cloud of gas and dust. Note the words of a former head of the Anglican Church: “God does something much more wonderful than make the world. He makes the world make itself.” Even the Pope accepts evolution.

Welcome to the forum Wordhasit.
 

nl

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Jun 26, 2011
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Evidence shows that Mars once possessed shallow seas. There is even speculation that Venus once possessed oceans, as of yet unconfirmed – but don't rule it out. The comets are covered in ices, some of it water, and it looks as though Europa, a moon of Jupiter, has a large ocean beneath its frozen surface. In other words it seems as though water planets may be very common in the universe.


What I should have said earlier would be more like an estimation of less than one in a "million billion gazillions" that any other planet would have an ocean like earth's.

Mars and Saturn are dark and cold. Venus has high atmospheric pressures and high temperatures that would crush and cook life as we know it. Jupiter is a gaseous planet but massive and its gravity would crush us if we got near to it. Wind speeds on Uranus can exceed 500 miles per hour (mph) while wind speeds on Neptune can reach 1300 mph.

Earth is a wonderful place.
 
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wordhasit

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You've jumped into the discussion at the end of the conversation and I think you've misunderstood. I have frequently stated that millions of Christians accept the theory of evolution. They also accept that the solar system formed from a cloud of gas and dust. Note the words of a former head of the Anglican Church: “God does something much more wonderful than make the world. He makes the world make itself.” Even the Pope accepts evolution.

Welcome to the forum Wordhasit.
Thanks Cycel, it's nice to be on the forum! Anyway, seems like I didn't get the full picture of what you wrote. Fortunately, the beauty of a discussion site is that when something is misunderstood we can enlighten each other and take it from there.


So I take it that in this instance you categorize between Christians who can't and Christians who do understand what you understand. The latter being those who accept the theory of evolution, etc. Personally I think it makes no sense for a Christian to take that position. Is a world that makes itself really the most wonderful thing that God could bestow on his creation? A system that depends on the survival of the fittest where millions of creatures brutally devour each other daily? No way! Even the supernatural mind would want to follow logical pathways. It is puzzling to me how a Christian can choose to believe in God working through a concept such as evolution. If anything the world bears the marks of 'devolution'. Biblically that should make more sense to a Christian than evolution. That's because God cursed the earth when the highest form of life in this world chose to step out of his design for creation. The default position at that time couldn't have been evolutionary though. How could you possibly curse something that already exists in a state of death, destruction and fight for survival? Of course not, it was as God had said, a world that he saw as very good. In contrast, the world today is not wonderful, although Beauty can still be found. But, far from evolving into a better world it is actually a worse place to live in for many life forms. Polluted oceans, melting ice caps, an increase in natural disasters, extinction of many animals, Incurable diseases like HIV and the savagery of warfare that's still among us after years of civilization. A creation that according to Romans 8 was subjected to frustration, waiting for the day that everything will fit in with God's design again, when everything is finally subjected to Christ who is the beginning of the new creation, (1 Corinthians 15:28). I would have loved to have gone into some explanatory notes, but that would have made it too long.
 

TheAristocat

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Oct 4, 2011
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The theist typically relies on scripture written in antiquity to prove his case, but those of us in the modern era have no way of confirming the claims.
There have been plenty of claims the Bible has made that have been confirmed by the science of archaeology. For example, the existence of the Canaanites, the name of Goliath, the dynasty of King David. Recently they discovered that the Hebrew language was about 400 years older than previously thought. The Hebrew writing was found on a 10th century BCE potsherd and regards topics and principles that can be found in Exodus, the Psalms and Isaiah. There's reason to believe in the prophecy regarding the fall of Tyre as well. Archaeology is a relatively new science, and we've already discovered so much with it. So I'm hopeful for the future. I just wish the Temple Mount could be excavated.

The theist cannot, and does not, rely upon experimentation.
That's a rather safe statement, since there's not a lot of experimentation involved in archaeology, anthropology, exegesis, or philology. But of course that's somewhat beside the point. I think in any field of science it's best to use procedures that bear results. Just as it would be rather fruitless to carbon date quarks, so it's not very feasible to try to conduct an experiment on an omniscient God's personality and predict his reactions based on what we consider to be moral criteria. Especially since opinion on that, as you note, differs from person to person. However, we can dig up the past and inspect the Bible's claims.

In science disagreements there are, but they are followed by examination of the physical evidence, experiments, and more discussions until everyone is in agreement about the observed data.
And thus far science confirms many biblical claims. But it's also important to note that neither atheists nor scientists are "science." Scientists make mistakes sometimes. Atheists leap to conclusions sometimes. As do theists.

October 2018 is the planned launch date for the James Webb space telescope.
I've been waiting for quite a while on this. 2018 I think is too far away. I want it now. :( I've heard that it'll be able to take images of extrasolar planets. Which would be impressive. I was very impressed when they sent a probe to Titan and recorded the sound of the methane atmosphere. It's not much, but it's enough to leave you with the profound realization that you're listening to an alien world's atmosphere.

You never see those of faith making scientific predictions, unless I am mistaken. Am I mistaken?
When it comes to most scientists I'm not well acquainted with their personal lives. And while that doesn't change for Georges Lemaitre, I am familiar with the fact that he was a Catholic priest and instrumental in the development of the Big Bang theory.
 
Mar 4, 2013
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Post 545 on thread "talking against the law is dangerous."

There is no age that can be calculated on something that doesn't exists. :confused::p

Now I have heard just about every argument in the book. But I'm sure I will hear something else to defunct the law of God as time passes. LOL
 
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Again in the specific debate of Old Earth vs Young Earth, if we put aside theology (meaning theories be they Christian theroies or Atheist theories) for a moment and go with what we do know, we come up with a Young Earth only on the scale of thousands of years. Let's go back to the 3000 BC. Again this is not the first day of days, even according to the Bible. However it is the earliest date mankind can make an educated guess or Theory based off of hard evidence both historical written evidence (such as the Bible and other non-biblical histories) and archaeological evidence.

Using hard evidence, both archaeological and historical we come not only to a conclusion that Earth is only thousands of years old, but also that the Near East is the cradle of post-Flood civilization. Unlike Old Earthers who can only make models that conflict with eachother and theories of their Old Earth's past, we Young Earthers can give you models that have a basis in proof and do not contradict eachother and furthermore the evidence harmonizes together with the Bible's book of Genesis which is fairly enough the most scrutinized and doubted book of all the collection of books in the Bible. (don't worry Old Earthers, I once was an Old Earthers too and scrutinized Genesis just as much as anyone I know.)

Here's an observable demonstration that some person made a slide show of various historical maps starting at our baseline guess of 3000 BC following through to 2014 AD (note: keep in mind we're just starting simple so we start at 3000 BC, the Bible and history and archaeology imply a slightly older Earth than this, but this is merely the best educated starting point for which there is secular proof):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3QOjM53rSU
[video=youtube;Z3QOjM53rSU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3QOjM53rSU[/video]

Now note there is still room for a little debate here since we can't give exact date for any of these empires, merely the best guesses are rounded to 3000 BC with a margin of error on the scale of a few centuries as opposed to Old Earth models where their "geologic ages" have margins of errors of millions to billions of years (yet for some reason Old Earthers don't find this to be completely absurd.)

Now anyone scholarly on history whether Christian, pagan, or atheist knows all ready that the Middle East region is indisputably the Cradle of Civilization. At the 3000 BC mark two empires exist the Sumerian Empire and the Egyptian Empire (though the Egyptian Empire at this point is not a true Empire being divided into the two kingdoms of Lower and Upper Egypt). With the Egypt uniting into one Empire and the Akkadian and Elamite Empires rising shortly thereafter in the fertile crescent and today's persia.

Now returning to the Bible we have to keep in mind that the Bible, post-Flood there is an age of early humanity that we will arbitrarily say lasted for a few centuries where the 3 tribes of Shem, Ham, and Japheth spread out over the globe founding cities and civilizations as we know it today. So keep in mind that when we start at 3000 BC the Post-Flood Earth is still a bit older than 3000 BC, merely the 3000 BC model is the most hard secular evidence for where written history as we know it begins. Starting at 3000 BC we see that few cities have been founded and empires have begun to emerge complimenting quite nicely the history recorded in post-Flood and post-Tower of Babel account of Genesis.


Exactly what time in Genesis all this is going down I cannot honestly say myself with any certain fact so we must turn to Theology and Theory. If we analyze the Bible as a historical document I personalyl would theorize that 3000 BC is either during the time of Abraham or is a few generations before the patriarch of Israel. My reasoning is due to the fact Abraham is said to have been born/lived in the city of Ur (considerred by scholars and historians to be among the oldest of all cities and one of the main cities of the Sumerian Empire.) This would naturally imply Ur was in existence in Abraham's time and sldo existed before him thus implying the existence of the Sumerian Empire being in existence during this time. Either way though, be this pre-Abraham or during his lifetime, the surrounding evidence of the Bible coupled with history and archaeology proves even Genesis, the most unbelievable of all biblical books is in fact a bit more literal and true than one might first imagine! Plus if we put aside Genesis for a moment, this slide show is a good demonstration of the geo-political environment after Genesis which is much more well confirmed in history and archaeology and therefore no one really has any good reason to doubt any of the books after Genesis which are much easier to confirm, such as book of Kings, Judges, Joshua, Samuel, etc.
 
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jamie26301

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It is puzzling to me how a Christian can choose to believe in God working through a concept such as evolution. If anything the world bears the marks of 'devolution'.
Evolution does NOT mean that creation is getting "better" with time. That's a spin on the theory that creationists put on it to discount it. Evolution simply means that organisms adapt to their environment, and over time, it leads to great changes in the organism as it's environment changes - some die out, others adapt.