"I am He"

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Sep 16, 2014
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#61
Genesis 1:26-27 (KJV)
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

God is not a single entity with three or more names. Does anyone actually think God was making man and woman according to His multiple names not yet revealed in Genesis? More than one separate Being was involved in the making of man. The three revealed Persons in perfect unity as though ONE supplied Body (Jesus is the godhead bodily), Spirit (by way of the Holy Spirit) and soul, the manner of human life gifted by the Father.

That triparate relationship was very well defined in
Mark 1:9-12 (KJV)
9 And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan.
10 And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:
11 And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
12 And immediately the Spirit driveth him into the wilderness.

I ask did one of the names of God drive Jesus into the wilderness, or was it a separate entity of the Godhead? Is not Jesus the bodily form of the Godhead?
Colossians 2:9 (KJV)
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

There was a brief time of maybe four years when the entire Godhead was bodily present on earth among men, from that earthly form praying to Heavenly Father, hearing what He said, doing what the Father did. Long before it was only the Spirit hovering, then the bodily presence such as for Moses and the 70 elders, then the voice of the Father from Heaven at His baptism by a MAN, then the body of Jesus who was intimately connected to the Spirit and the Father, then the sacrifice of the Son of the Father, then the Holy Spirit alone left with men until the bodily form (Jesus) returns, who a thousand years later shall present all His fruit to the Father's Kingdom of God.

So it is why the Jews in general resisted the New Testament confessions to this day.

Be not so suddenly disarrayed by false (ignorant) teachers and wolves who seek the blood and flesh of believers to fill their bellies of desire for conquest.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
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#63
God is one......manifested three ways......

It stands to reason, that we in our finite minds, which can barely grasp the simple truths of the bible without help and insight from the Holy Spirit, will always fall short when trying to put the Infinite Multi-Dimensional Spirit God into our nice little box of confused, extrapolated near sighted view that lacks the depth of knowledge and understanding to imply anything about God......To whom will we liken HIM...........NO ONE.........to do such is to bring him down to our level understanding!
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
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#64
The Father of Eternity does not increase or diminish the title 'Father', He is still the Father and one of His other title in the same verse is Mighty God. So, yes, He is God the Father of eternity if you like. But it doesn't matter, He simply is the Father, Hebrew or not.

One more title in the same verse is wonderful counselor ; aren't you aware that this means He is the Holy spirit?
Complete and utter nonsense!

You're view on the Godhead was long ago condemned as destructive heresy, the holders of such a view being excommunicated from the Church and labelled as "destructive heretics!"

Truth does not change (no matter how much you insist on twisting the Scriptures), the doctrine of The Trinity is the ONLY truth revealed in Scripture in regards to the Godhead!
 

wolfwint

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2014
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#65
Fair comment. All I was saying, as I am sure you understand, is the just as Henry Ford the father of the company humbled himself to become John Doe, so it was with God the Father who humbled himself to become Jesus.
Thats fits not the point. How Jesus can say he is sent from the father,if he is the father? The gospel of John is full of examples that Jesus is not the father and also not the Holy Spirit. As the Holy Spirit is not the father and not Jesus.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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#66
Complete and utter nonsense!

You're view on the Godhead was long ago condemned as destructive heresy, the holders of such a view being excommunicated from the Church and labelled as "destructive heretics!"

Truth does not change (no matter how much you insist on twisting the Scriptures), the doctrine of The Trinity is the ONLY truth revealed in Scripture in regards to the Godhead!
You'll do good if you take your time to address issues, maybe a counter verse or an explanation as to why you think i'm wrong.
I quoted a verse, i did not twist scripture - it is clear you are having a problem with that verse not me.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#67
Thats fits not the point. How Jesus can say he is sent from the father,if he is the father? The gospel of John is full of examples that Jesus is not the father and also not the Holy Spirit. As the Holy Spirit is not the father and not Jesus.
Not the Father on earth, but pre-incarnation before he became flesh, he was the creator. Wonder of wonders, we have creator God with us in human form on earth. God is ONE.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
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#68
Now I understand what you are saying. I don’t believe there is reason to think the burning bush is Jesus. I believe it was the Father. BOTH are the “I AM” but I think when Jesus manifests in the OT it is in bodily form, whereas the Father cannot be seen by human eyes .
Just saying....the Heavenly Father chose to reveal himself through the Son....in the VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME....MY VIEW...every theophany is the Heavenly Father being revealed through JESUS.........
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
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#69
Notice, I was first referring to the fact that no one INSTANTLY knows Jesus, and somehow you turned it to Jesus being Deity must be the Son of God for the Jews.
My point is is that people don't naturally think that God has a Son...it must be revealed to them.
Amen........Jesus even told Peter what it was exactly that revealed unto him whom Jesus is.....!!!!!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#70
There was a brief time of maybe four years when the entire Godhead was bodily present on earth among men, from that earthly form praying to Heavenly Father, hearing what He said, doing what the Father did.
was Jesus not God before His flesh was baptized?
wise men worshiped Him while He was an infant.. were they not actually so wise after all? and John called himself unworthy even to tie his shoes, beforehand. John, who was full of the Spirit even before birth.


i think God is still God even when He isn't currently showing me fantastic miracles. that Jesus Christ is never not God. so here's this unfathomable mystery, the person of Christ, the exact representation of the Father, God manifest in the flesh, the same yesterday today and forever. and He is the man, Jesus of Nazareth ((?!?!?!?!))
i figure if i think i fully understand the nature of God, how He has revealed Himself to us, i'm fooling myself.


He is God, yet He prayed to God, calling Him Father. God is One, and there is no other, but Christ is seated at the right hand of the Father in heaven - how many thrones are there in heaven?? there is one God, and one Lord - is He not the Lord God? Jesus is worshiped and says worship no one but the Father. Jesus is good and says no one but God is good.

not trivial.

such knowledge is too wonderful for me, too lofty for me to attain.
(Psalm 139:6)
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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#71
Amen........Jesus even told Peter what it was exactly that revealed unto him whom Jesus is.....!!!!!
No question understanding the Trinity, and how each Person of the Trinity interacts separately, yet as One is a difficult, if not impossible, concept for humans to grasp. However if we accept that there are 3 Persons, then we need to acknowledge that they operate in differing ways toward humanity.

God the Father is unapproachable, and can't even be beholden by sinful man. Aside from the burning bush, where even the image of that affected Moses countenance, we have THIS:

Exodus 33:20 But He said, "YOU CANNOT SEE MY FACE; FOR NO MAN SHALL SEE ME, AND LIVE" 21 And the Lord said, “Here is a place by Me, and you shall stand on the rock. 22 So it shall be, while My glory passes by, that I will put you in the cleft of the rock, and will cover you with My hand while I pass by. 23 Then I will take away My hand, and you shall see My back; but My face shall not be seen.”

We cannot see the face of Jesus? How could this be the Son?

Here we see where it was INDEED Jesus:
Genesis 18 New King James Version (NKJV)
18 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day. 2 So he lifted his eyes and looked, and behold, three men were standing by him; and when he saw them, he ran from the tent door to meet them, and BOWED HIMSELF TO THE GROUND,and said "MY LORD, if I have now found favor in Your sight, do not pass on by Your servant. 4 Please let a little water be brought, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree. 5 And I will bring a morsel of bread, that you may refresh your hearts. After that you may pass by, inasmuch as you have come to your servant.”

Here we see that Abraham WAS able to see the Lord's Face. Has to be the Son here. So either we do accept modalism, or we accept that the 3 distinct Members of the Godhead appear to men differently.
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
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#72
Now I understand what you are saying. I don’t believe there is reason to think the burning bush is Jesus. I believe it was the Father. BOTH are the “I AM” but I think when Jesus manifests in the OT it is in bodily form, whereas the Father cannot be seen by human eyes .
Actually the burning bush is not Jesus, the burning bush is just that a bush. It was the angel of the Lord who appeared in the "midst" of the bush and the angel of the Lord is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. You are also right that the "I am" at Exdous 3:14 is the one God, i.e. God the Father and God the Son. So, it has to be Jesus Christ in the burning bush because as you rightly say the Father cannot be seen just like the Holy Spirit cannot be seen. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
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#73
Actually the burning bush is not Jesus, the burning bush is just that a bush. It was the angel of the Lord who appeared in the "midst" of the bush and the angel of the Lord is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. You are also right that the "I am" at Exdous 3:14 is the one God, i.e. God the Father and God the Son. So, it has to be Jesus Christ in the burning bush because as you rightly say the Father cannot be seen just like the Holy Spirit cannot be seen. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
I think you are right. Good correction on the Burning bush.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#74
Actually the burning bush is not Jesus, the burning bush is just that a bush. It was the angel of the Lord who appeared in the "midst" of the bush and the angel of the Lord is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. You are also right that the "I am" at Exdous 3:14 is the one God, i.e. God the Father and God the Son. So, it has to be Jesus Christ in the burning bush because as you rightly say the Father cannot be seen just like the Holy Spirit cannot be seen. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
It would be good if you would kindly give us an exegesis on the passage.

Exo 3:1-6
(1) Now Moses kept the flock of Jethro his father in law, the priest of Midian: and he led the flock to the backside of the desert, and came to the mountain of God, even to Horeb.
(2) And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
(3) And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
(4) And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.
(5) And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.
(6) Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.


Also this commentary by Albert Barnes:

What Moses saw was the flame of fire in the bush; what he recognized therein was an intimation of the presence of God, who maketh a flame of fire His angel. Compare Psa_104:4. The words which Moses heard were those of God Himself, as all ancient and most modern divines have held, manifested in the Person of the Son.

Thanks.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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#75
No. In my illustration Henry Ford was both the Boss and briefly the shop-floor Worker at one and the same time. Yet he is ONE.
Well then your wrong

Once again, My army example is a better example. It is one unit, but many in person.

God is one unit, but three in person.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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#76
Good explanation. The trouble is, and not trying to be difficult, the army is made up of many persons, while God is One and so is Henry Ford the big boss who humbled himself and became the same as his men while remaining the big boss who would one day return to his posh office.
God is one, but three in person.

Your henry ford example is wrong

Jesus was SENT by the father, and the HOLY SPIRIT empowered him

Jesus prayed to the father, o that he would send the Holy Spirit

Jesus after baptised, had the HS come into him as a dove, while the father said this is my son.

Far to many examples to deny the trinity
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#77
God is one, but three in person.

Your henry ford example is wrong

Jesus was SENT by the father, and the HOLY SPIRIT empowered him

Jesus prayed to the father, o that he would send the Holy Spirit

Jesus after baptised, had the HS come into him as a dove, while the father said this is my son.

Far to many examples to deny the trinity
The Father in my example (Henry Ford) sent the shop-floor worker, by his will (spirit). They are One.

Henry Ford represents the Father, the shop-floor worker represents the Son. They are One.

Anyway, I'm not going to talk to you. All you do is give me red crosses, which I can do as well.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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#78
The Father in my example (Henry Ford) sent the shop-floor worker, by his will (spirit). They are One.

Anyway, I'm not going to talk to you. All you do is give me red crosses, which I can do as well.
You can believe that all you want.

Your example does not fit. And its funny how you refuse to acknowledge my examples of scripture of all three working in tandem as different individuals.

I do mor ethan give a mark of disagreement, I back my mark by showing you HOW and WHY i disagree.


Your example is wrong. Because it does not resemble what scripture says.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#80
You can believe that all you want.

Your example does not fit. And its funny how you refuse to acknowledge my examples of scripture of all three working in tandem as different individuals.

I do mor ethan give a mark of disagreement, I back my mark by showing you HOW and WHY i disagree.

Your example is wrong. Because it does not resemble what scripture says.
"Houston is one is one state" is an early example of mine. It is still better than yours.


Elizabeth Queen of England is Commander of the Canadian Forces, the Duke of Lancaster, and Head of the New Zealand Defence Force. She is One person.
.
 

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