"I am He"

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PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#41
And what is your problem EG?
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#42
Its not the same

Now if three men had equal rule of ford. And one of them came into the shop acting like one of the workers. That would be more applicable.

Because when you say the name ford. It represents all three men. But one
Ford is One. God is One.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#43
Like I said to someone in another thread. The only things these types of examples do is convince themselves that they are right, they are not helpful nor will they convince other people they are right. Because the examples do not fit..

The bible does not say God is one person

It says God is one God

Huge difference;
Henry Ford is ONE even though he took another I.D. Although they appeared to be two men, they were actually ONE man in two persons, the same as God is One God in three persons.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#44
I look at it this way
What makes God God. Is it not his essence?


Eternal. Omniscient. Omnipresent, Perfect. Spirit. Creator, etc etc etc..All thes things,

So when you think of God. You think of someone with all these characteristics.

Its what makes them God.

Just like our human characteristics make us human we are one race with many

God is one, yet three..because of his essence

They also have different jobs,so they are unique induviduals which are completing an aspect of the plan the father designed,

,
Two complicated. It would be nice to put it simply so we are not accused by our enemies as having three gods.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#45
Well, people just don't understand the Triune God, especially when we talk of three persons.

Let me see you do better. Make it clear and plain, so that everyone knows instantly who Jesus is.

"God with us" does admirably in my view. The above was a simple illustration taken from real life.
No one 'instantly knows who Jesus is', it takes a work of God's Spirit illuminating their understanding...

Matthew 16:16-17 NASBS
[16] Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." [17] And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

...even now, we are still learning.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
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#46
The purpose of this post is to give all Bible believing Christians a new insight into the person of Jesus, or refresh our memories of what we once new about him.

See, we have always known that Jesus is God, the one true God; the one who came and died for the sins of the world, but we just didn't know how to say it. But now we do. But even today, after 2000 years, hardly anyone believes it.

So let's look at one Scripture from the writings of David and you will see what David knew. He said in Psalm 27:1, "The Lord is my light and my salvation." But Paul, who was very familiar with the Psalms, said in Romans 10:9 that Jesus is the Lord David is talking about.

And that's what the name Jesus means: salvation or the Lord is my salvation. It can also be translated "The God who saves."

See David is preaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ long before it took place: that the Lord he knew as YHwh God in the Old Testament is the New Testament Jesus, the same one who gives us salvation and the one we Christians name ourselves after.

A famous songwriter says it best:

When on the cross of Calvary the Lord was crucified
The Mob stood about him and mocked until he died.
Two thieves were nailed besides him to share the agony.
But one of them cried out to him O Lord remember me.

O what a shame to kill him there on that rugged cross,
but such a death was needed to rescue all the lost.
His blood was a ransom to set the captive free,
I know that I am included and that's enough for me.

See God didn't send a substitute. He came himself. And he called himself the Son or the Son of God to account for his human birth, or to show that he was human too.

He said it this way in Zechariah 12: 9,10:

And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for me, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for me, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem. …. King James Version (KJV)

See there is only one being called God. (Deut 6) If this is not so we are claiming that God is polytheistic and this cannot be so. And that Abraham and the prophets too worshiped more than one God, as the nations around them did. The confusion come when we see references to the Father and the Holy Spirit as Jesus speaks about himself. These are his other two names. He is introducing them to us so we an see the full extent of his love. As Jesus said in John 10:30, "The Father and I are the same me." And the same is true of The Holy Spirit.

So we call him Jesus in obedience to what God himself said in Isaiah 43:10-11:

"You are my witnesses, declares the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe that I am he: besides me there is no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the Lord Jesus; and beside me there is no savior.

But as I said, even today hardly anyone believed this truth. So all I ask is that you give it your condideration, even if you disagree. And let Jesus lead us back to the simple truth of Christ we once knew of him, and to the faith once delivered to us as believers in Christ Jesus.


God bless you,

Rev Autrey
This is an interesting proposition. But if Jesus was God the Father in human form, who was speaking on the mountain
of transfiguration?
John the baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit inside his mother, yet he baptised Jesus, which according to your
proposition is impossible.

John described Jesus as being Gods word, His message, His commands, His creative action.
The Holy Spirit is the essence of God, His heart, His presence, His communion.
So they are one in being yet 3 in separate expressions.
They are not 3 Gods, but 1 God, who expresses himself in 3 different ways.

Jesus describes that only the Father knows the appointed times for the ending of the world and
who will sit on which throne and why. Now if Jesus was actually the Father, then there would be
no distinction.

Jesus describes having to learn the ways of the Father and to listen and obey. So He was fully human
and restricted though His heart and Spirit were eternal. Jesus's Spirit was the Holy Spirit, but in a
different way than we experience it. For whatever reason the Holy Spirit could not be fully expressed
while Jesus was on earth, which I have never heard someone suggest why this was a problem.

Maybe the sense of intercession and standing before the Father to talk about the church was Jesus's
ministry, while the Holy Spirits ministry was to convey the Heart of Jesus and the Father to His people.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
693
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#47
No one 'instantly knows who Jesus is', it takes a work of God's Spirit illuminating their understanding...

Matthew 16:16-17 NASBS
[16] Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." [17] And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

...even now, we are still learning.
The Jews properly thought that to be the Son of the living God, was to make a claim to deity itself. (David Guzik) Hence Simon Peter's response. :)
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
14,592
6,850
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#48
Jesus is Imanual (God with us) Elsewhere we read they are One, not two and not three.
GOD IS ONE AND ALSO THREE. THAT IS THE MYSTERY OF GOD.

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name [SINGULAR] of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost (Mt 28:19)

For the sake of reverence for the name of God (not taking His name in vain) devout Jews substitute HA SHEM for "God" and "Adonai" (lORD) for YHWH. HA SHEM means "THE NAME". And that is what we find above.

But there are a multitude of Scriptures which show that the Father is YHWH and the Son is also YHWH. God told Moses that His name was also " I AM" (or I AM THAT I AM). But Jesus told the Jews that He is also "I AM". In fact this is very plainly revealed in Exodus 3.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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#51
Henry Ford is ONE even though he took another I.D. Although they appeared to be two men, they were actually ONE man in two persons, the same as God is One God in three persons.
What?

So you believe there are three different persons of the godhead?
 
Mar 14, 2011
73,921
16,578
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#52
Two complicated. It would be nice to put it simply so we are not accused by our enemies as having three gods.
I never claimed three gods.

And it is not complicated. It just makes it easier to explain what is meant.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#53
GOD IS ONE AND ALSO THREE. THAT IS THE MYSTERY OF GOD.

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name [SINGULAR] of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost (Mt 28:19)

For the sake of reverence for the name of God (not taking His name in vain) devout Jews substitute HA SHEM for "God" and "Adonai" (lORD) for YHWH. HA SHEM means "THE NAME". And that is what we find above.

But there are a multitude of Scriptures which show that the Father is YHWH and the Son is also YHWH. God told Moses that His name was also " I AM" (or I AM THAT I AM). But Jesus told the Jews that He is also "I AM". In fact this is very plainly revealed in Exodus 3.
Thank you. Here is another

Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. (Isa 44:6)

One God in two persons. The LORD is the King of Israel, and his redeemer is the LORD of hosts. I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. (Singular)
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
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#54
What?

So you believe there are three different persons of the godhead?
No. In my illustration Henry Ford was both the Boss and briefly the shop-floor Worker at one and the same time. Yet he is ONE.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
29,593
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#55
The Jews properly thought that to be the Son of the living God, was to make a claim to if deity itself. (David Guzik) Hence Simon Peter's response. :)
Negatory, it takes the illumination by the Spirit for ALL people...(If I looked up Guzik, I'd probably find that you are putting a spin on his words as well)

What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes. Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. (Rom 3:9-19 KJV)
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#56
Negatory, it takes the illumination by the Spirit for ALL people...(If I looked up Guzik, I'd probably find that you are putting a spin on his words as well)

What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes. Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. (Rom 3:9-19 KJV)
i. The Jews properly thought that to be the Son of the living God, in a unique sense, was to make a claim to deity itself. (David Guzik exactly as written.)
.
Mat_16:16
And Simon Peter answered ... - Peter, expressing the views of the apostles, with characteristic forwardness answered the question proposed to them by Jesus: “Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

The Christ - The Messiah, the “Anointed” of God. See the notes at Mat_1:1.

The Son - That is, the Son by way of eminence - in a special sense. See the notes at Mat_1:17. This appellation was understood as implying divinity, Joh_10:29-36.

Of the living God - The term “living” was given to the true God to distinguish him from idols, that are dead, or lifeless blocks and stones. He is also the Source of life, temporal, spiritual, and eternal. The word “living” is often given to him in the Old Testament, Jos_3:10; 1Sa_17:26, 1Sa_17:36; Jer_10:9-10, etc. In this noble confession Peter expressed the full belief of himself and of his brethren that he was the long-expected Messiah. Other people had very different opinions of him, but they were satisfied, and were not ashamed to confess it.

Mat_16:17
And Jesus answered, Blessed art thou ... - Simon Bar-jona is the same as Simon son of Jona. Bar is a Syriac word signifying son. The father of Peter, therefore, was Jona, or Jonas, Joh_1:42; Joh_21:16-17.
Blessed - That is, happy, honored, evincing a proper spirit, and entitled to the approbation of God.

(Albert Barnes)
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
29,593
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#57
No one 'instantly knows who Jesus is', it takes a work of God's Spirit illuminating their understanding...

Matthew 16:16-17 NASBS
[16] Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." [17] And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

...even now, we are still learning.
The Jews properly thought that to be the Son of the living God, was to make a claim to deity itself. (David Guzik) Hence Simon Peter's response. :)
i. The Jews properly thought that to be the Son of the living God, in a unique sense, was to make a claim to deity itself. (David Guzik exactly as written.)
.
Mat_16:16
And Simon Peter answered ... - Peter, expressing the views of the apostles, with characteristic forwardness answered the question proposed to them by Jesus: “Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

The Christ - The Messiah, the “Anointed” of God. See the notes at Mat_1:1.

The Son - That is, the Son by way of eminence - in a special sense. See the notes at Mat_1:17. This appellation was understood as implying divinity, Joh_10:29-36.

Of the living God - The term “living” was given to the true God to distinguish him from idols, that are dead, or lifeless blocks and stones. He is also the Source of life, temporal, spiritual, and eternal. The word “living” is often given to him in the Old Testament, Jos_3:10; 1Sa_17:26, 1Sa_17:36; Jer_10:9-10, etc. In this noble confession Peter expressed the full belief of himself and of his brethren that he was the long-expected Messiah. Other people had very different opinions of him, but they were satisfied, and were not ashamed to confess it.

Mat_16:17
And Jesus answered, Blessed art thou ... - Simon Bar-jona is the same as Simon son of Jona. Bar is a Syriac word signifying son. The father of Peter, therefore, was Jona, or Jonas, Joh_1:42; Joh_21:16-17.
Blessed - That is, happy, honored, evincing a proper spirit, and entitled to the approbation of God.

(Albert Barnes)
Notice, I was first referring to the fact that no one INSTANTLY knows Jesus, and somehow you turned it to Jesus being Deity must be the Son of God for the Jews.
My point is is that people don't naturally think that God has a Son...it must be revealed to them.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#58
The US army is one. But many
Good explanation. The trouble is, and not trying to be difficult, the army is made up of many persons, while God is One and so is Henry Ford the big boss who humbled himself and became the same as his men while remaining the big boss who would one day return to his posh office.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#59
Notice, I was first referring to the fact that no one INSTANTLY knows Jesus, and somehow you turned it to Jesus being Deity must be the Son of God for the Jews.
My point is is that people don't naturally think that God has a Son...it must be revealed to them.
Sorry, you are right. I particularly like these two passages with regard to Jesus:

Col 1:15-18
(15) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
(16) For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
(17) And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
(18) And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

1Ti 1:17

(17) Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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#60
Just think. The people who were in the presence of Jesus were in the presence of Almighty God.

Lights out.