I don't understand some Bible verses.

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Nov 23, 2013
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#65
I do not think this is a metaphor, however the language is figurative, figurative language is still truth just stated in a more expressive format to enhance the impact of the words.
I agree it’s not metaphor but it’s not figurative either. It’s a straightforward statement. Both Eve and the serpent have seed.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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#66
What say you @KJV1611 ... ready to correct yourself??
Ok I’ve read everything and I don’t see where I need to correct myself.

I think it may be just terminology, I call it parable or symbolic language where you call it metaphor.

But the point that I was making before this was that “Ye are of your father the devil” is not a metaphor, it’s a straight forward statement that means what it says.

That statement means that either Satan is literally their earthly father or Satan is their, to use your words, their metaphorical father.

We have an earthly father and we have a Heavenly Father. They had an earthly father (not Satan) and they had a spiritual father (Satan). And I think Satan being their spiritual father means that they were not saved.
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
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#67
A metaphor is a figure of speech applied to an object or action to which it is not literally applicable.... In other words a metaphor is a BIG FAT LIE.

I hope that you don’t think God uses lies to teach spiritual lessons.
Metaphors are used in parables to teach spiritual lessons. Metaphors give the hidden understanding. They are used in the doctrines of God that fall from heaven like rain or dew upon the grass In that water like blood are both metaphors are used to represent the unseen work of the Spirit of God.

They can be used to expose a lie but they themselves are simply a manner of prophecy. Without metaphors used in parables Christ spoke not hiding the meaning of the metaphors from natural man (No faith)

To hate in the Bible is to not bless or obey, To love is to bless.

We withhold the blessing that belong to our father on earth not giving them to our father of earth. Call no man father on earth is one way. Whatever we eat drink or do we so it to the father unseen ,Call no man teacher master on earth one is our teacher, our father in heaven.
 
Aug 14, 2019
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#68
When people read the message of Jesus and decide to believe Him and trust in the Atonement He secured on the cross they will face opposition from friends and relatives they know who have rejected the message of Jesus and do not trust in the atonement He secured on the cross... Thus we are from that point on divided from them in this critical area of our existence.. In the early church Jews who believed Jesus and trusted in His atonement often faced being shunned by their Jewish families and faced not only rejection but sometimes death.. We know Paul was a Jew who persecuted Christians before He became a Christian himself..

I have also personal experienced this division with my own dad and some of my brothers and sisters in the flesh. I was born into a catholic family but upon reading the Bible i renounced that religion trusting only in the Word of God and the Atonement He secured for me on the cross.. This divided me as a sword from some of my family.. Yes it was and is a case of me being against my devout catholic dad and him being opposed to my beliefs.. So the Word of Jesus is just as true today as an ex-catholic just as it was for the ex-Jews in the days just after His assention into heaven when they where divided from their families because of the Word of Jesus..




Do i detest the fallen unsaved state of being of my dad and mom and some of my brothers and sisters??? Yes indeed i hate their state of being.. Do i detest my own sin nature.. Do i wish i was already a transformed. resurrected. perfected eternal being.. You bet i do.. I detest my current imperfect state of being.. All of us who know about the wonderful will of God and the future transformation into perfect beings we yearn to have happen to us will detest our current condition with our sins and failures..




Ok i think i have answered without ignoring any of the words in the verses you quote..


I hate every part of myself that continually exalts itself against the knowledge of my Savior.
Its anti-Christ working in me trying to bring me into subjection. The ONLY hope I have is the grace of God.
It is a battle I fight every day and I hate this part of me. I hate it because it constantly is trying to separate me from the love of Christ.

How can I hate this evil that is constantly working in me and not hate it as it works in others?
We have to be able to discern what we are hating. I love my family but I hate every evil force that is trying to separate them from God.
There was a time in my life when my family turned their back on me because I became to "religious".
It is by the Spirit we should view all things. Our siblings are no exception. Nether our father or mother
My father died at age 46. He was an alcoholic . He was found in a ditch on a cold winter night. He never was a father to me or to the rest of my family. How am I to judge this man before God? I can only view Him in light of the Kingdom of God. Does my heart break for Him?
No. I have made a decision in my life and that is nothing is going to stand in the way of my relationship with Christ ,nothin and no one.
And I do mean NO ONE. The Kingdom of God is greater than family ties.
"
 
Jun 30, 2015
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#69
Ok I’ve read everything and I don’t see where I need to correct myself.

I think it may be just terminology, I call it parable or symbolic language where you call it metaphor.
Metaphors are used in parables to teach spiritual lessons. Metaphors give the hidden understanding. They are used in the doctrines of God that fall from heaven like rain or dew upon the grass In that water like blood are both metaphors are used to represent the unseen work of the Spirit of God.

They can be used to expose a lie but they themselves are simply a manner of prophecy. Without metaphors used in parables Christ spoke not hiding the meaning of the metaphors from natural man (No faith)
A metaphor is simply a comparison made without the use of "like" or "as". If you say, "the snow was a blanket on the ground", you're employing a metaphor... the snow is compared to a blanket.

"Water like blood" is a simile, not a metaphor.

Parables and metaphors are both literary devices found in Scripture, but they are not the same thing and they rarely, if ever, overlap.
 
May 8, 2016
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#70
Ok I’ve read everything and I don’t see where I need to correct myself.

I think it may be just terminology, I call it parable or symbolic language where you call it metaphor.

But the point that I was making before this was that “Ye are of your father the devil” is not a metaphor, it’s a straight forward statement that means what it says.

That statement means that either Satan is literally their earthly father or Satan is their, to use your words, their metaphorical father.

We have an earthly father and we have a Heavenly Father. They had an earthly father (not Satan) and they had a spiritual father (Satan). And I think Satan being their spiritual father means that they were not saved.
It is a metaphor it has to be because if it was literal it would mean the the devil is his physical, literal father?
 

garee

Senior Member
Mar 28, 2016
10,807
918
113
#71
A metaphor is simply a comparison made without the use of "like" or "as". If you say, "the snow was a blanket on the ground", you're employing a metaphor... the snow is compared to a blanket.

"Water like blood" is a simile, not a metaphor.

Parables and metaphors are both literary devices found in Scripture, but they are not the same thing and they rarely, if ever, overlap.

Thanks, rarely. . . sounds good.

Are similes and metaphors used together in parables as a signified language or found in parables even separately? .

Are parables spoken without similes and metaphors ?

Still leaning. Love the parables. Much hidden richness. like "honey" the taste of manna, or its color used as a metaphor to represent a pearl of hidden value Christ , the gates of pearl by which we enter into fellowship by a faith not of our selves... Called hidden manna in Revelation 2. He warns us not to eat to much or we will lose the little we think we have as always he must increase.

I would offer. Manna a word meaning... "What is it?" not the bread of familiarity as if God was a man as us . I think he calls that lukewarm when things are taken for granted second guessing leaving the first love. . . desiring to know more intimately.. He came to his own and proved their manner of spirit not walking by faith walking by sight as if the kingdom did come by observation . Having to do with the flesh of nations as if he was served by human hands .Jews have the same status as a gentile. All of mankind of any nation must be born again. Their false zeal even today that looks for familiarity of the flesh. It breeds contempt for all the nations in the world.

Romans 11:31-33 (ERV) And now they are the ones who refuse to obey, because God showed mercy to you. But this happened so that they can also receive mercy from him. All people have refused to obey God. And he has put them all together as people who don’t obey him so that he can show mercy to everyone.

Praise to God

33 Yes, God’s riches are very great! His wisdom and knowledge have no end! No one can explain what God decides. No one can understand his ways.

He gives the parables the hidden understanding..

Both similes and metaphors are used to make comparisons used in parables .Bring one thing along side of another. The difference between similes and metaphors comes down to a word. Similes use the words like , as, or unto to compare things— “Life is like a box of chocolates.”... "Jesus sweat as if it was blood" to represent the unseen work of the Spirit. In contrast, metaphors directly state a comparison—“Love is a battlefield.” "God is love". Unless I wash you feet you have no part with me. . . as a parable representing the gospel .

Without parable Christ spoke not hiding the spiritual understanding . Not hiding the historical accuracy. Two levels of meaning when and if one does mix faith a metaphor for the unseen eternal in what they hear or hear . He that has ear let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches .God working to give his understanding hid from those who walk by sight.

Jesus in the last days, the father speaking though His actions used to represent different parables using his life seen, or not seen hid as a parable in that way .

Like the parable in Luke one of a series used to represent those who refuse its understanding . If they will not hear the law and the prophets as metaphor (sola scriptura) then neither would men believe even if one like Jesus rose from the dead. Many parable are simply made to no effect by literalizing the hidden understanding . it makes me wonder when he comes on the last day will he find faith mixed with what men hear and see .Or will everything be literalizes away and chalked up as experience . No faith coming from God not seen .

He called, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me! Send Lazarus to me so that he can dip his finger in water and cool my tongue. I am suffering in this fire!’ Luke.16

Dead people do not suffer. Its for those on the green side of the grass. . . The wrath of God being revealed from heaven, the greatest tribulation suffering the pangs of hell "death".

To begin with dead men do not talk, think or have a tongue, or require water (gospel) or move. Dead people have no desire.

Imaginary conversation used as a parable..

The moment dead men like the Rich man as those spiritual bankrupt. He was buried (could not breath) .The poor man Lazarus not buried living on the green side of the grass suffering. For a taste of the bread of life that the rich man saw no value in .

The spiritually bankrupt man gave up the corrupted spirit as the wage of sin. (deader than a door nail, no literal tongue, no desire. ) It returned to the father and the dust returns to the field of clay.

The key to understanding the series of parables beginning in the previous chapter. is that kind of crumbs or food that works in the believer to both will and do his good pleasure as our imputed work . The kind of bread the disciples at first knew not of Christ built their confidence by giving the understandings . The food Jesus are of was to do the will of the father and finish as the work of both . our Emmanuel

Luke 1629 -31“But Abraham said, ‘They have the Law of Moses and the writings of the prophets to read; let them learn from that.’
“The rich man said, ‘No, father Abraham! But if someone came to them from the dead, then they would decide to change their lives.’
“But Abraham said to him, ‘If your brothers won’t listen to Moses and the prophets, they won’t listen to someone who comes back from the dead.’”


Law of Moses and the writings of the prophets to read; the water that cools the tongue of the believer .The gospel

If a person is given a new spirit not subject to the letter of the law (the killer). It will rise on the last day . The phrase last day a metaphor that means the end of time. . . . time for the new incorruptible to begin.
 
Jun 30, 2015
10,210
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#72
Thanks, rarely. . . sounds good.

Are similes and metaphors used together in parables as a signified language or found in parables even separately? .

Are parables spoken without similes and metaphors ?

Still leaning. Love the parables. Much hidden richness. like "honey" the taste of manna, or its color used as a metaphor to represent a pearl of hidden value Christ , the gates of pearl by which we enter into fellowship by a faith not of our selves... Called hidden manna in Revelation 2. He warns us not to eat to much or we will lose the little we think we have as always he must increase.

I would offer. Manna a word meaning... "What is it?" not the bread of familiarity as if God was a man as us . I think he calls that lukewarm when things are taken for granted second guessing leaving the first love. . . desiring to know more intimately.. He came to his own and proved their manner of spirit not walking by faith walking by sight as if the kingdom did come by observation . Having to do with the flesh of nations as if he was served by human hands .Jews have the same status as a gentile. All of mankind of any nation must be born again. Their false zeal even today that looks for familiarity of the flesh. It breeds contempt for all the nations in the world.

Romans 11:31-33 (ERV) And now they are the ones who refuse to obey, because God showed mercy to you. But this happened so that they can also receive mercy from him. All people have refused to obey God. And he has put them all together as people who don’t obey him so that he can show mercy to everyone.

Praise to God

33 Yes, God’s riches are very great! His wisdom and knowledge have no end! No one can explain what God decides. No one can understand his ways.

He gives the parables the hidden understanding..

Both similes and metaphors are used to make comparisons used in parables .Bring one thing along side of another. The difference between similes and metaphors comes down to a word. Similes use the words like , as, or unto to compare things— “Life is like a box of chocolates.”... "Jesus sweat as if it was blood" to represent the unseen work of the Spirit. In contrast, metaphors directly state a comparison—“Love is a battlefield.” "God is love". Unless I wash you feet you have no part with me. . . as a parable representing the gospel .

Without parable Christ spoke not hiding the spiritual understanding . Not hiding the historical accuracy. Two levels of meaning when and if one does mix faith a metaphor for the unseen eternal in what they hear or hear . He that has ear let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches .God working to give his understanding hid from those who walk by sight.

Jesus in the last days, the father speaking though His actions used to represent different parables using his life seen, or not seen hid as a parable in that way .

Like the parable in Luke one of a series used to represent those who refuse its understanding . If they will not hear the law and the prophets as metaphor (sola scriptura) then neither would men believe even if one like Jesus rose from the dead. Many parable are simply made to no effect by literalizing the hidden understanding . it makes me wonder when he comes on the last day will he find faith mixed with what men hear and see .Or will everything be literalizes away and chalked up as experience . No faith coming from God not seen .

He called, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me! Send Lazarus to me so that he can dip his finger in water and cool my tongue. I am suffering in this fire!’ Luke.16

Dead people do not suffer. Its for those on the green side of the grass. . . The wrath of God being revealed from heaven, the greatest tribulation suffering the pangs of hell "death".

To begin with dead men do not talk, think or have a tongue, or require water (gospel) or move. Dead people have no desire.

Imaginary conversation used as a parable..

The moment dead men like the Rich man as those spiritual bankrupt. He was buried (could not breath) .The poor man Lazarus not buried living on the green side of the grass suffering. For a taste of the bread of life that the rich man saw no value in .

The spiritually bankrupt man gave up the corrupted spirit as the wage of sin. (deader than a door nail, no literal tongue, no desire. ) It returned to the father and the dust returns to the field of clay.

The key to understanding the series of parables beginning in the previous chapter. is that kind of crumbs or food that works in the believer to both will and do his good pleasure as our imputed work . The kind of bread the disciples at first knew not of Christ built their confidence by giving the understandings . The food Jesus are of was to do the will of the father and finish as the work of both . our Emmanuel

Luke 1629 -31“But Abraham said, ‘They have the Law of Moses and the writings of the prophets to read; let them learn from that.’
“The rich man said, ‘No, father Abraham! But if someone came to them from the dead, then they would decide to change their lives.’
“But Abraham said to him, ‘If your brothers won’t listen to Moses and the prophets, they won’t listen to someone who comes back from the dead.’”


Law of Moses and the writings of the prophets to read; the water that cools the tongue of the believer .The gospel

If a person is given a new spirit not subject to the letter of the law (the killer). It will rise on the last day . The phrase last day a metaphor that means the end of time. . . . time for the new incorruptible to begin.
Jesus begins many of the parables with "The kingdom of God is like..." - making those parables similes. However, the parable is within the simile, not the other way around.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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#73
A metaphor is simply a comparison made without the use of "like" or "as". If you say, "the snow was a blanket on the ground", you're employing a metaphor... the snow is compared to a blanket.
I agree it’s a comparison that doesn’t use “like” or “as” which makes the metaphorical statement a false statement.

“The snow was a blanket on the ground” isn't a metaphor because the word “blanket” is an adjective describing the snow. A blanket when used as an adjective means to cover something completely. The snow did completely cover the ground. This is a true statement.

"Water like blood" is a simile, not a metaphor.

Parables and metaphors are both literary devices found in Scripture, but they are not the same thing and they rarely, if ever, overlap.
I see parables, similes and symbolic language all over the Bible but I’ve never seen the Bible use a metaphor. I could be wrong but I doubt it because God doesn’t use untruths to teach truth... it goes against the character of God
 
Jun 30, 2015
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#74
I agree it’s a comparison that doesn’t use “like” or “as” which makes the metaphorical statement a false statement.

“The snow was a blanket on the ground” isn't a metaphor because the word “blanket” is an adjective describing the snow. A blanket when used as an adjective means to cover something completely. The snow did completely cover the ground. This is a true statement.


I see parables, similes and symbolic language all over the Bible but I’ve never seen the Bible use a metaphor. I could be wrong but I doubt it because God doesn’t use untruths to teach truth... it goes against the character of God
I see little point in trying to explain reality to someone who has chosen to reject it.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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#75
It is a metaphor it has to be because if it was literal it would mean the the devil is his physical, literal father?
But your missing another option, which is the correct option. The devil isn’t his physical father he’s his spiritual father. Satan fathered the lying, hateful, murderous condescending spirit in them. That’s why I said Satan was their spiritual father.