Is Baptism necessary for Salvation?

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Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
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Just wondering if you have ever noticed this:


“The apostles and the elders were gathered together to consider this matter. And after there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us, and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:6-9‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/59/act.15.6-9.esv

Doesn’t this passage show that the elders present received the Holy Spirit in the same manner as the Apostles and the house of Cornelius? It says no distinction was made between any of them.

“As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?””
‭‭Acts‬ ‭11:15-17‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/59/act.11.15-17.esv

In this passage “us” and “we” refer back to the circumcision party. Also, here we see that the Holy Spirit was received upon belief by the circumcision party and the house of Cornelius.

Is there any other way to see this?
Consider what Peter meant when he said, Who was I to stand in God's way? (Acts 11:17) What did Peter do in order to not stand in God's way AFTER seeing the group filled with the Holy Ghost? He commanded they be baptized in water in the name of the Lord Jesus.
 

DJT_47

Well-known member
Oct 20, 2022
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Just wondering if you have ever noticed this:


“The apostles and the elders were gathered together to consider this matter. And after there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us, and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:6-9‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/59/act.15.6-9.esv

Doesn’t this passage show that the elders present received the Holy Spirit in the same manner as the Apostles and the house of Cornelius? It says no distinction was made between any of them.

“As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?””
‭‭Acts‬ ‭11:15-17‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://www.bible.com/59/act.11.15-17.esv

In this passage “us” and “we” refer back to the circumcision party. Also, here we see that the Holy Spirit was received upon belief by the circumcision party and the house of Cornelius.

Is there any other way to see this?
Here's the KJV which doesn't read the same at all nor makes such an implication by its wording.
Acts 11:17

17Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

Also, the interlinear in the Greek reads very similarly to the KJV and mot at all like the translation you posted.
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
897
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If we truly love God, then we will obey "Every word" that proceeds out of his mouth (Matthew 4:4). Baptism is one of those words. In order to be baptized, certain events must take place: You must give up a lifestyle where sin has dominion, (ruler ship) over you. Sin according to 1 John 3:4, Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression (breaking) of the law. You must be taught "The Word", before you can adhere to God's commandments (judgments\statues). These laws are found in the Holy Bible; beginning with Genesis and ending with Revelation. You must believe what the bible says and finally, you must confess that Jesus is Lord. Once this has been accomplished, you are qualified to be baptized in the name of Jesus.

"And he said unto them, go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." (Mark 16:15-16). Listen people! Baptism is a commandment or requirement for salvation.

To reject baptism is death; so, why will you die? Every soul that is baptized honors God and every soul that rejects baptism dishonors God. "And all the people that heard him, and the publicans, justified God, being baptized with the baptism of John.

But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the counsel of God against themselves, being not baptized of him." (Luke 7:29-30). People, if you are in a position to be baptized, why reject the counsel of God? Rejecting God's counsel will get you eternal life in the burning flames (lake of fire) with the scribes and Pharisees. "For I say unto you, that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, Ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 5: 20).
 

GRACE_ambassador

Well-known member
Feb 22, 2021
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Midwest
If we truly love God, then we will obey "Every word" that proceeds out of his mouth (Matthew 4:4). Baptism is one of those words.
Precious friend, respectfully, this is not a good way to begin
"judging others" - "obey EVERY Word Out of The Mouth Of God"?

You can't be serious, can you? Do you offer animal sacrifices, build an ark, sell everything, follow Moses Law, heal the sick, raise the dead,
etc. etc.?

If not, how is this disobedience "loving God"???

Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided
(+ I and II)!
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
897
161
43
Precious friend, respectfully, this is not a good way to begin
"judging others" - "obey EVERY Word Out of The Mouth Of God"?

You can't be serious, can you? Do you offer animal sacrifices, build an ark, sell everything, follow Moses Law, heal the sick, raise the dead,
etc. etc.?

If not, how is this disobedience "loving God"???

Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided
(+ I and II)!
"And he said unto them, go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." (Mark 16:15-16).
 

JBTN

Active member
Feb 11, 2020
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"And he said unto them, go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." (Mark 16:15-16).
When I think about Mark 16:16, I ask myself “is the baptism(immersion) mentioned the immersion of our physical bodies into water?”

1 John 5:1 makes me think it is not. How can 1 John 5:1 be true if it is physical water immersion?

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5‬:‭1‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/1jn.5.1.KJV

Doesn’t Ephesians 1:13 describe our immersion into Christ? If we are sealed in him weren’t we also immersed into him?

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭1‬:‭13‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/eph.1.13.KJV

Notice that physical immersion into water is not present here in Ephesians 1:13. We are sealed in Christ having believed.

This is another interesting verse.

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭12‬:‭13‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/1co.12.13.KJV

By one Spirit we are all immersed into one body. Clearly this is not a water immersion. The medium for immersion is given in the verse and it isn’t water.

Remember this one:

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭8‬-‭12‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/col.2.8-12.KJV

In physical water immersion the hands of the person who baptizes you are definitely used. If you say that physical water immersion is required then hands are required. That obviously isn’t what is being discussed here.

“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6‬:‭3‬-‭6‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/rom.6.3-6.KJV

Immersed into Christ and immersed into his death. Isn’t the medium for immersion given in the passage itself. The word for water is not present.

Should we add or assume water in these passages when it wasn’t mentioned. The medium for immersion in each one is already there.

Remember Proverbs 30:5-6.

“Every word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, Lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭30‬:‭5‬-‭6‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/pro.30.5-6.KJV
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
897
161
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When I think about Mark 16:16, I ask myself “is the baptism(immersion) mentioned the immersion of our physical bodies into water?”

1 John 5:1 makes me think it is not. How can 1 John 5:1 be true if it is physical water immersion?

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5‬:‭1‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/1jn.5.1.KJV

Doesn’t Ephesians 1:13 describe our immersion into Christ? If we are sealed in him weren’t we also immersed into him?

“In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭1‬:‭13‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/eph.1.13.KJV

Notice that physical immersion into water is not present here in Ephesians 1:13. We are sealed in Christ having believed.

This is another interesting verse.

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭12‬:‭13‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/1co.12.13.KJV

By one Spirit we are all immersed into one body. Clearly this is not a water immersion. The medium for immersion is given in the verse and it isn’t water.

Remember this one:

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭8‬-‭12‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/col.2.8-12.KJV

In physical water immersion the hands of the person who baptizes you are definitely used. If you say that physical water immersion is required then hands are required. That obviously isn’t what is being discussed here.

“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6‬:‭3‬-‭6‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/rom.6.3-6.KJV

Immersed into Christ and immersed into his death. Isn’t the medium for immersion given in the passage itself. The word for water is not present.

Should we add or assume water in these passages when it wasn’t mentioned. The medium for immersion in each one is already there.

Remember Proverbs 30:5-6.

“Every word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, Lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭30‬:‭5‬-‭6‬ ‭KJV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1/pro.30.5-6.KJV

I lot of verses you quoted and all have it's order, but less show example of the importants of being baptize in water. Let's take a look in Act 8:35-39 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.


"And it came to pass, that, while Apollo was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, he said unto them, Have ye received the Holy ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, "We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” And he said unto them, "unto what then were ye baptized?" And they said unto John's baptism.

Then Paul said, “John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him who should come after him, that is, Jesus Christ.” When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. When Paul had laid hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. And all the men were about twelve." (Acts 19:1-7).
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
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Probably the easiest way to avoid any problems with wording is to do like character Sonny in the movie The Apostle:

"And with your gracious permission, I wish to be baptized as an apostle of our Lord. I therefore, without witnesses, baptize myself in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost . . . And in the name of Jesus."
 

BroTan

Active member
Sep 16, 2021
897
161
43
op: Is baptism Necessary For Salvation?:

No, water is not +

Yes, The ONE Baptism "BY" The ONE Holy Spirit Is Necessary! Amen.
+
Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided
(+ I and II).

Grace, Peace, And JOY!...
Lets take a look in Act 8:35-39 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
5,011
1,066
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Yes, Peter and the eleven surely obeyed their commission.

Is Paul's commission in effect today for us?
Paul's, Peter's and the eleven's commission was the same. The same gospel message along with it's requirements apply to all as prophesied by Jesus Himself; "And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem." (Luke 24:47) The gospel message that included the need to repent, and be water baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus for the remission of sin BEGAN in Jerusalem and continues to spread into all nations as Jesus said it would. Paul was still water baptizing people in the name of the Lord Jesus over 20 years after Pentecost. (Acts 19:1-7)

"Afterwards I came into the regions of Syria and Cilicia;
And was unknown by face unto the churches of Judaea which were in Christ:
But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed." Gal 1:21-23

Paul's confirmation all apostles preached the same gospel message.

“For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. Therefore whether it were I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.” 1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:9-11‬