Is God Unfair?

[jerusalem]

true but as you point out job repented which shows that he was in need of a hard earned lesson in spite of his righteousness God used the devil to help learn this valuable lesson and reap it's reward. what the devil meant for job's harm God used for his good. job not only didn't lose what he already had spiritually he gained ever so much more. he was blessed once again materially with even more than he had before and he held the assurance that the loved ones he had lost were not truly lost to him in the end. God is never unfair though our circumsytances may make it appear that He is esp in times of trouble. God is good....all the time

 

[notuptome]

God is merciful. Sin is that which has created the inequity we endure on this earth. In heaven there will be no inequity only great joy.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[kardiaoangelous]

God is merciful. Sin is that which has created the inequity we endure on this earth. In heaven there will be no inequity only great joy.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Very well discerned comment.

That wall separating the inner sanctuary connected court of the Jews from the outer court of the Gentiles as spoken of here: Ephesians 2:14-16 "For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby.."

That wall represented that Old law Covenant which kept the Jews and Gentiles separated. And that Old law Covenant was indeed a prophetic picture of the sin in this world which causes the enmity of the flesh. Ending it pictures that that enmity in the flesh will also be ended.

How can I say that? Because that Law was given to enliven sin. Indeed to enliven that enmity.

Romans 7:5 "For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death."

Romans 7:7 "What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful."

So your comment sticks with the deeper Biblical picture.

Very good comment.

 

[homwardbound]

I sincerely understand what you are saying and why. But you are not understanding certain of the verses you have concluded your idea upon, nor are you understanding what I said. For example:

[SUP]8 [/SUP]If we claim to be without<[which is entirely bad exegesis] sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. [SUP]9 [/SUP]If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

What say we look deeper at how that verse 8 really ought to read?

Actually it is verse 9 that has been mistranslated form past tense and made to look as it is present tense
In the orignal greek it states if we confess that we are or have sinned then we will recieve the forgiveness of sins back at the cross where the final sacrifice to take away sins occured in the death of Christ. No life though is recieved by death, and all have been reconciled to God by the death, forgiven 100%
Romans 5:10For if, while we were God’s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!

We are saved by the life but how caqn anyone know that God gives them knew life unless they see that by the death they have been forgiven in order to be born again anew in the Spirit of God as Christ said to Nicodemus one must be born again.
Today this born again resides in the resurrection at the cross after the death that cleared and cleansed and took away the disease that caused death in the first place
Hebrews 10:14For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy. This is happening to all that Believe God is doing the good work God began in the one's that do beleive, and it can be a long process in years of growing as it has been for me and a lot still to learn and only be thankful for not better than anyone else ever, For I know what happens when I think myself as something a messenger of Satan comes along and buffets meas this happened to Paul, 2cor 12:7 - onward and thus learn to glory in my iniquities.
When one learns to send out the praise and worship band first then victory is the Lords
Read about King Jehosaphat who di exactly this and those three armies knew not how to react and killed each other. LOVE, Praise and worship of God's miraculous Love conguers all evil as it is already conguered by Christ through the cross.
John 16 very clear on Christ what the cross of Christ did and why we are to only focus there, being the place of total victory by God for all of us that believe.
Love you deeply Brother

 

[homwardbound]

1 John 1:8 If <G1437> we say <G2036> that <G3754> we have <G2192> no <G3756> sin <G0266>, we deceive <G4105> ourselves <G1438>, and <G2532> the <G3588> truth <G0225> is <G1510> not <G3756> in <G1722> us <G2254>.


Notice the different ways that word for “no” can be translated.


G3756: ou -- also (before a vowel) ouk -- pronounced: ook – and (before an aspirate) ouch -- a primary word; the absolute negative (compare 3361) adverb; no or not: KJV -- + long, nay, neither, never, no (X man), none, (can-)not, + nothing, + special, un(-worthy), when, + without, + yet but. Note also 3364, 3372.


As you can see there, it is only able to be translated as “without” under very special circumstances and that is where the door opened to human fleshly opinion.


So lets look at the literal wording of that verse in the Greek text:


“If ever we should say that sin not we are having<(as in “having accredited to the account” of our flesh, for any sin present or past would justify death to the flesh) selves we are making to err and the truth not is in us”


I could go deeper but I know for a fact that you already have enough knowledge, homward, to understand why that word “having", means what I said it does within the quotes.


And you cannot get around that John was talking to “My little children”, because you know full well we cannot be someones children as in “My”, and be their brother, too. Brothers in Christ are mature ones in Christ.

I have not claimed to have no sin against the account of my flesh, sir, but my spirit is sinless because I am obedient to Christ, regardless of how others judge me by their flesh. They only judge me because in truth they hate the word I speak.

Brother yes oyu go deep, and to others you peaking in tongues and uit does not edify the ones that do not see what you are saying. yes top the flesh as what is the problem of sin ans yes to the solution where no sin can ever occur in the Soirit of God so
[h=3]Romans 7:15-20[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[SUP]15 [/SUP]For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. [SUP]16 [/SUP]If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. [SUP]17 [/SUP]But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. [SUP]18 [/SUP]For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. [SUP]20 [/SUP]Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.


[h=3]Romans 7:21-25[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[SUP]21 [/SUP]I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. [SUP]22 [/SUP]For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. [SUP]23 [/SUP]But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. [SUP]24 [/SUP]O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? [SUP]25 [/SUP]I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.

We are to seek from God how to seperate flesh from Spirit and one sure fire way is beleivoing by God through the cross at the death we our flesh is dead with Christ and thus we made alive by God via the resurrection

[h=3]Romans 6:5-7[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[SUP]5 [/SUP]For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, [SUP]6 [/SUP]knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. [SUP]7 [/SUP]For he who has died has been freed from sin.

 

[homwardbound]

Whomever it is that yet gives their spirit to commit sin is one spirit with the devil, for they most certainly cannot be one spirit with Christ in whom there is no sin.

1 John 3:8 "He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

Such a man who is truly one spirit with Christ is not a forgetful hearer of the seed which is the word sown in him, but is a doer of that word, loving it so as to never forget to do it.

That is why love has two focuses, God and neighbor, with our whole heart, complete life or soul, and every crevice of our mind.

yes and for man to do this he must see the differance between flesh and Spirit, and learn to walk in the Spirit of God each and every day dieing to his flesh daily and this world daily, thus trusting in God and praising, worshippiing and thanking God. Now this can only hapopen daily, yet the world has gott focused on one's future in woory over whether one will sin again or not and as you just put one can't which is correct IF they are in the Spirit of God, God doiing the leading for them.
We need to discern between flesh (evil) and Holy Ghost. We are by the cross to be made whole alive in the Spirit of God by the resurrection and not worry over earthly matters knowing God said God would supply all our needs,
Goid said I believe it and that settles it. No doubt in God as the woman just touched his robe and was healed immediately WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! she had no doubt.
So why do we have doubt that Christ by and through the cross took care of us all and through this we all are available to recieve new life in him proof by the resurrection
[h=3]1 Corinthians 15:12-19[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[h=3]The Risen Christ, Our Hope[/h][SUP]12 [/SUP]Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? [SUP]13 [/SUP]But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen. [SUP]14 [/SUP]And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. [SUP]15 [/SUP]Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise. [SUP]16 [/SUP]For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. [SUP]17 [/SUP]And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! [SUP]18 [/SUP]Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. [SUP]19 [/SUP]If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.

 

[homwardbound]

And is it not with pride of your flesh that you judge me?

1 Corinthians 4:3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.
4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.


Yet Paul did judge the works and doctrines he saw of others and spoke very boldly concerning them. You would have hated him if you hate me, for I speak with the boldness he did, and it was he who told us the most concerning how true love works.

Never said I hated you, where did you get this and I was clear about not meaning any offense nor that it was I judging you, why are you on the defense?
I am nothing more than a fellow brother in Christ and as you are trying to show the war is flesh and God's Spirit. WE are at liberty not under Law that I must do this or that, We are under Love that is unconditional. I and you can do all things through Christ yet not all things are beneficial brother and others have posted this to you, which only incites ones flesh. So be it if you take it wrong, not meant that way
All in love God's type

 

[homwardbound]

Speaking the truth boldly is the zeal of Jesus to cleanse the Temple of the money-changers. It is a righteous zeal of a one spirit with Christ which does as Christ.

Judge by the word if you are going to judge, but even then not by a fleshly view of the word, but by making sure you have it's spirit in you which is the true sense of it by spirit, and that in no way of the flesh.

When you go by your gut instincts you cannot be sure of that. I have heard Jehovah's Witnesses call it "the ring of truth to their spirit", which is just another way around being certain it is truly of the spirit of God's word.

Such things as living by "the ring of the truth" as in gut feelings, is the flesh's pride.

Well if you are not walking by flesh and you are sure cool, I stand back, I as you just know what I hear and heard as you do too!!!!!!!!!!!!! Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[homwardbound]

yes

because God made us as imperfect beings, yet demands a perfection of us only he is capable of.
because God created us with sin already tainting our soul, yet condemns us for having been born into sin.
because God will never, ever be revealed in our scientific journey thru his creation.
because God's 'final solution' is our mortal death.

The fight is between flesh and Spirit!!!!!!!!!!!!!! we are by Christ through the cross by the resurrection are born again by God the Father of Christ and are able to walk in ther Spirit of God daily, by us dieing daily to our flesh
[h=3]Galatians 5:16-26[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)

[h=3]Walking in the Spirit[/h][SUP]16 [/SUP]I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. [SUP]17 [/SUP]For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. [SUP]18 [/SUP]But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, [SUP]20 [/SUP]idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, [SUP]21 [/SUP]envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, [SUP]23 [/SUP]gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. [SUP]24 [/SUP]And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. [SUP]25 [/SUP]If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. [SUP]26 [/SUP]Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.

 

[kardiaoangelous]

yes

because God made us as imperfect beings, yet demands a perfection of us only he is capable of.
because God created us with sin already tainting our soul, yet condemns us for having been born into sin.
because God will never, ever be revealed in our scientific journey thru his creation.
because God's 'final solution' is our mortal death.

Let's visit upon the above thoughts for a moment and see if they can really be validated by God's word.

"because God made us as imperfect beings, yet demands a perfection of us only he is capable of.
because God created us with sin already tainting our soul, yet condemns us for having been born into sin."

Genesis 1:26-27 "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness .......... So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

If those comments be true that God made us as imperfect beings and created us with sin already tainting our soul, then our being created in God's and his Son's image and likeness would prove that God and His Son are imperfect beings. Yet we know such is not the case.

*** *** ***

"because God will never, ever be revealed in our scientific journey thru his creation."

True, such is revealed spirit to spirit. Romans 1:17 "For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith."

Romans 1:18 "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.."

Psalms 19:1 "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard."

Thus we see God's glory is his righteousness and that after man "corrupted his [own] way" (Genesis 6:12; Deuteronomy 32:5) God had mercy and sent a living example to us of His righteousness by means of His Son. Colossians 2:3 "In whom are hid all the treasures of [God's] wisdom and knowledge." For Jesus is to us the "wisdom, and righteousness" of God all rolled up in God's fulness for us as a living example for us to follow after since we have corrupted ourselves and now must receive help. (1 Corinthians 1:30)

"because God created us with sin already tainting our soul, yet condemns us for having been born into sin."

Take a lesson from why it is that the Bible uses water to represent God's pure life-giving word of truth:
God created Adam and Eve like two vessels containing pure water. Those vessels of their own choice mixed impure water into themselves. Those vessels could not afterward pour pure water into other vessels as they came along.

Why did those vessels do that? The Bible is very clear about why those vessels did that. Let us go to nature and learn:

Bugs were created to serve useful purposes in helping man's home be fruitful of good things. But man is quite able to do things by lack of knowledge and wisdom which affects the rate at which bugs multiply so that they come to be in excess which then causes them to become a problem to humans.

Further, lack of wisdom causes man to turn the natural surface of the earth upside down and destroy the natural elements of plants and other foods those bugs were designed to feed upon so that they then begin to feed upon things which are a problem to us.

Yet the many bug varieties yet perform a useful function in helping our plant life to reproduce itself in that these bugs carry the plants pollen upon their legs from one plant to another.

Though their design was perfect, man can disrupt that perfection by his failure to have stuck with God in the beginning and fully learn knowledge and wisdom from God, so as to know how not to disrupt his own environment, working with that environment instead of against it.

And though these bugs were perfect for the purpose with which God made them, man can also shine bright lights at them to distract them from their way. The bug is not drawn to the artificial light as many think. They are draw by that light blinding them and travel the direction of that blindness. That is why a bug will even fly right into a fire and die. That is why they beat themselves against a light bulb. Not because they see the light, but because the light blinds them.

Eve became blinded by the artificial light of the fruit of that forbidden tree because another introduced her to seeing something she had not formerly seen. There was no temptation before she was introduced to it by outside interference for the thought never came up into her mind for her to look for herself to try to see.

God's ultimate goal, sir, is to destroy sin by making us forget sin, that we might return to being as Adam and Eve were before sin, having no knowledge of sin.

That is why we are not supposed to focus on that Old Law. By Law is only knowledge of sin. So we fight against what God is doing when we take our eyes off God's love and focus on that Law.

 

[homwardbound]

true but as you point out job repented which shows that he was in need of a hard earned lesson in spite of his righteousness God used the devil to help learn this valuable lesson and reap it's reward. what the devil meant for job's harm God used for his good. job not only didn't lose what he already had spiritually he gained ever so much more. he was blessed once again materially with even more than he had before and he held the assurance that the loved ones he had lost were not truly lost to him in the end. God is never unfair though our circumsytances may make it appear that He is esp in times of trouble. God is good....all the time

Bottom line after reading and seeing what took place, are we going to not curse God, deny God and claim God is unfair when God through his Son Christ went to the cross for us inspite of our denials even as St. Peter did what denied Christ three times
Yet God forgave him and gave him life and Peter came to understand this and live this new way in the Spirit of God being married to God and forsaking all flesh in the process
Colossians 2:14having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

By Christ we have been freed to do what is right by the Spirit of God our new life by the resurrected Christ, saved by the life after the death. So first we must go to Christ and die with Christ Spiritually and then be raised back to new life in Christ by the resurreected Christ form God the Father of christ now through belief our Father too!!!!!!!!!!!! The Holy Ghost confoirming this with our Spirits ans we know how great Father is, what a miraculous salvation to appreciate if we do not how will anyone ever escape
Hebrews 12:25See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven?

 

[soldierofchrist4ever24]

I see a symbolic ax coming...not from the truth, but just
from putting in on a warhead, rather than a plate.
Took the Lord more than a few years patiently to train
His men and still they didnt see much....whats a few posts?
Seems like whats going on here is far from truth and being firm
on that, rather personal punches and belittling. Not the best method ive seen.

Amen Brother, and it could be, maybe, just maybe.... My little children is the author referencing his age at the time, as it is well known among many Scholars at this point John would of been up in age, but this does not surprise me as i have seen some interesting interpretations describing who the elect lady was, it never dawned on the author maybe its the church lol one thing is for sure though the context etc of the epistles of John makes it clear His audience where believers.

in Christ
Brother Travis

 

[soldierofchrist4ever24]

I see my faults continually. Thats not the point. Or the problem.
"seems" was a word used for your option. If you prefer and bold rebuke
ill comply. And if your slain by a rebuke, then that would be a mistake on your part.
My humility is not in view here either. But yours may be. Yes i said "may be" judge yourself,
i dont have the will or inclination.


As far as blaspheme, im not scared. Your the one representing the HolySpirit.
So i rekon your the one in view for that representation and judgement "seems to me"

I thought Sarcasm would be the word here not 'seems' silly me and it seems i can not just post that <----------- but have to lengthen my message a wee bit oh well

 

[kardiaoangelous]

Amen Brother, and it could be, maybe, just maybe.... My little children is the author referencing his age at the time, as it is well known among many Scholars at this point John would of been up in age, but this does not surprise me as i have seen some interesting interpretations describing who the elect lady was, it never dawned on the author maybe its the church lol one thing is for sure though the context etc of the epistles of John makes it clear His audience where believers.

in Christ
Brother Travis

Hebrews 12:26 "Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven."

That shaking is done through his true ministers which is why those who judge with fleshly minds do kill them. They no not what they see.

 

[kardiaoangelous]

Well if you are not walking by flesh and you are sure cool, I stand back, I as you just know what I hear and heard as you do too!!!!!!!!!!!!! Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Amen, but you also know that flesh will condemn others in the hypocrisy of the flesh which does not so much as see it's own true condition, let alone the condition they imagine of God's true ministers. They will not admit it but they would have judged Jesus and all the teachers in the NT who spoke at times exactly as I did. They would have like those Pharisees seen them to be no better than themselves and interpreted their words as false pride and self-deception.

Just as I concluded in one recent post, Eve became blinded by the artificial light of the fruit of that forbidden tree because another introduced her to seeing something she had not formerly seen. There was no temptation before she was introduced to it by outside interference for the thought never came up into her mind for her to look for herself to try to see.

God's ultimate goal, sir, is to destroy sin by making us forget sin, that we might return to being as Adam and Eve were before sin, having no knowledge of sin.

That is why we are not supposed to focus on that Old Law. By Law is only knowledge of sin. So we fight against what God is doing when we take our eyes off God's love and focus on that Law.

You know that is true, so then you tell me how one can continue in sin and forget sin? They can't and that is what John is loudly proclaiming throughout the entire 1st letter.

Therefore, if we cannot say that we have ceased from sin then what we are saying is that we have not benefited from Christ's work on the cross.

And as I showed you by the literal word for quote 0f 1 John 1:8 in the virgin order which it was written, John was clearly only telling them that if they claim to have never had any sin to credit against their flesh, then they make God out a liar and spurn the great love shown us in Christ.

But just as powerfully, John tells us that to continue to remember sin so as to keep on sinning spurns that great love and mercy shown us in Christ in just as horrible a way.

If you cannot say that you have ceased from sin, then neither can you say that you have matured to Christ.

And I believe you of all people on CC know that.

 

[Ephraim]

No sir, i don't (sin). Not even when you falsely accuse me of talking cruelly to peaople when I love them enough to be courageously honest with them for their own sake.

In accussing me that way you have revealed to me how in your heart as you read the NT you see many things said by Jesus and by all of the NT Bible writers which your mind tells you are very cruel and unloving things to say.

Be honest is that not true that you have that problem seeing things as cruelly stated when you read the NT?

Being that honest with ones self is te first step in a person's pulling the beam out of their own eye.

The second step is to learn why some times it is not love to speak softly and why sometimes love must speak the truth with a bit of force behind the spoken word.

You are mistaken greatly if you have a picture in your mind of me wreathing visible anger as that is not true. I can be forcefully honest with you when appropriate and never add extras beats to my heart by emotion at all because I know true love. It is the very same love that at times appeared cruel to you when Jesus or any of the Bible writers spoke in that necessity of love.

Have a nice life all you hypocrites who would not recognize true love if it smacked you in the face.

Affectionately said.

Isaiah 64:6 We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. Like autumn leaves, we wither and fall, and our sins sweep us away like the wind.

1 John 1:8

If we say that sin is something we don't have, then we deceive ourselves and the truth is not inherent in us.

Romans 3:23

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,


You like the truth spoken with a bit of force? There it is.

 

[kardiaoangelous]

Isaiah 64:6 We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. Like autumn leaves, we wither and fall, and our sins sweep us away like the wind.

1 John 1:8

If we say that sin is something we don't have, then we deceive ourselves and the truth is not inherent in us.

Romans 3:23

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,


You like the truth spoken with a bit of force? There it is.

I do sometimes wonder why I even bother to try to help you guys see. It can only be love.

The man without Christ just as we all were at one time: Isaiah 64:6 We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. Like autumn leaves, we wither and fall, and our sins sweep us away like the wind.

John 1;8 IS NOT SAYING WHAT YOU THINK IT IS!!!! Bold for emphasis so that you understand, please listen to what I am telling you, for I do in fact in the sight of God know it to be true.

John is saying that if we deny that we had no sin to accredit to our old man, then we make God out a liar and deny the need for Christ to bring us back from the death of that old man by sin, unto the life of the new man free from that sin.

The literal word by word direct translation of that verse is pretty clear about that.

The Staphanus Textus Receptus, Scrivner's Greek NT, and the Wescott-Hort Greek NT are all in agreement on that verse, so I have Westcott-Hort's full works here in book form right in front of me, so for the reason that it is handy, I will quote from it's direct word for word in order translation of 1 John 1:7-10, which no scholar disputes.

1 John 1:7 "If ever but in the light we may be walking about as he is in the light, sharing we are having with one another and the blood of Jesus the Son of Him it is cleansing us from all sin."

1 John 1:8 "If ever we should say that sin not we are having, selves we are making to err and the truth no is in us."

"we are having' is a phrase every competent lexical scholar recognizes as meaning "having" as in '"having credited against us'".

1 John 1:9 "If ever we may be confessing the sins of us, faithful he is and righteous in order that in order that he might let go off to us the sins and he might cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

"If ever we may be confessing the sins of us" is a phrase every competent lexical scholar recognizes as meaning "If ever we have need to be confessing the sins of us".

1 John 1:10 "If ever we should say that not we have sinned, liar we are making him and the word of him not is in us."

(there is that implanted see of 1 John 3:9 "the word of him not is in us." The word that we are not to be forgetful hearers of. 1 John 3:3; James 1:25)

And every competent lexical scholar recognizes "If ever we should say that not we have sinned" as meaning only one or both of two possible things:

(1) "that we actually do slip up and commit a sin and refuse to recognize it", or,

(2) "that we be claiming that we never had an old man that used to sin", or both one and two. I favor both.

Now, read tha entire 1st John again and see that John has presented you two sides to the coin, either of which make God out to be a lira and spurn the need for Christ having died for us and making a joke of what Christ actually did for us on the cross.

(side 1 of the coin) If we should deny that the old man was dead by sin and needed to have Christ to have life once again. Which also has the same effect if we slip and sin in the present and then deny it.

(side 2 of the coin) If we keep sinning while claiming to be of the one spirit with Christ, for that is like saying sin exists in Christ, and against the fact that Christ came to destroy sin as the work of the devil.

1 John 3:6 "Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him."

But you do not want to understand 1 John 3:6 if you do yet sin because it reveals a truth to frightening for you, that you may not actually yet be in Christ, having not matured into him and yet being a forgetful hearer of the seed that is God's word through and in Christ. How frightening !!! Yes, indeed!!! But what is the alternative? There is now but this:

Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 

[Ephraim]

I do sometimes wonder why I even bother to try to help you guys see. It can only be love.

The man without Christ just as we all were at one time: Isaiah 64:6 We are all infected and impure with sin. When we display our righteous deeds, they are nothing but filthy rags. Like autumn leaves, we wither and fall, and our sins sweep us away like the wind.

John 1;8 IS NOT SAYING WHAT YOU THINK IT IS!!!! Bold for emphasis so that you understand, please listen to what I am telling you, for I do in fact in the sight of God know it to be true.

John is saying that if we deny that we had no sin to accredit to our old man, then we make God out a liar and deny the need for Christ to bring us back from the death of that old man by sin, unto the life of the new man free from that sin.

The literal word by word direct translation of that verse is pretty clear about that.

The Staphanus Textus Receptus, Scrivner's Greek NT, and the Wescott-Hort Greek NT are all in agreement on that verse, so I have Westcott-Hort's full works here in book form right in front of me, so for the reason that it is handy, I will quote from it's direct word for word in order translation of 1 John 1:7-10, which no scholar disputes.

1 John 1:7 "If ever but in the light we may be walking about as he is in the light, sharing we are having with one another and the blood of Jesus the Son of Him it is cleansing us from all sin."

1 John 1:8 "If ever we should say that sin not we are having, selves we are making to err and the truth no is in us."

"we are having' is a phrase every competent lexical scholar recognizes as meaning "having" as in '"having credited against us'".

1 John 1:9 "If ever we may be confessing the sins of us, faithful he is and righteous in order that in order that he might let go off to us the sins and he might cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

"If ever we may be confessing the sins of us" is a phrase every competent lexical scholar recognizes as meaning "If ever we have need to be confessing the sins of us".

1 John 1:10 "If ever we should say that not we have sinned, liar we are making him and the word of him not is in us."

(there is that implanted see of 1 John 3:9 "the word of him not is in us." The word that we are not to be forgetful hearers of. 1 John 3:3; James 1:25)

And every competent lexical scholar recognizes "If ever we should say that not we have sinned" as meaning only one or both of two possible things:

(1) "that we actually do slip up and commit a sin and refuse to recognize it", or,

(2) "that we be claiming that we never had an old man that used to sin", or both one and two. I favor both.

Now, read tha entire 1st John again and see that John has presented you two sides to the coin, either of which make God out to be a lira and spurn the need for Christ having died for us and making a joke of what Christ actually did for us on the cross.

(side 1 of the coin) If we should deny that the old man was dead by sin and needed to have Christ to have life once again. Which also has the same effect if we slip and sin in the present and then deny it.

(side 2 of the coin) If we keep sinning while claiming to be of the one spirit with Christ, for that is like saying sin exists in Christ, and against the fact that Christ came to destroy sin as the work of the devil.

1 John 3:6 "Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him."

But you do not want to understand 1 John 3:6 if you do yet sin because it reveals a truth to frightening for you, that you may not actually yet be in Christ, having not matured into him and yet being a forgetful hearer of the seed that is God's word through and in Christ. How frightening !!! Yes, indeed!!! But what is the alternative? There is now but this:

Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

1 John 1:8

Ean eipomen hoti hamartian ok acco-men he-autous planomen hai hé alethiea ouk estin en hemin.

if (we) speak (saying) that sin (in the deedful sense) we do not possess, (then, object of grammar) ourselves we lead astray, and the truth (is) not existing in us.

The general jist is, if we utter the words that say 'I have no sin' or 'I do not sin', then that makes a person into someone who is leading themselves astray or deceiving themselves.

there's other verses to back it up.

All fall short of the glory of God.

the deeds are as filthy rags.

I partake of that which I know I should not.

For God has imprisoned all of man in disobedience that he may have mercy on all of man.

etc etc.

 

[Ephraim]

Romans 3:10

Kathos gegraptaí oti Ouk estin dikayos oude heis.

Just as - gratified (in writing) - that (pertaining to said gratifying) - No one - exists - just/impartial/righteous -, not even one.

Just as was written; Not even one exists in a state of righteousness.

The only person you can consider sinless is Jesus himself.

 

[kardiaoangelous]

1 John 1:8

Ean eipomen hoti hamartian ok acco-men he-autous planomen hai hé alethiea ouk estin en hemin.

if (we) speak (saying) that sin (in the deedful sense) we do not possess, (then, object of grammar) ourselves we lead astray, and the truth (is) not existing in us.

The general jist is, if we utter the words that say 'I have no sin' or 'I do not sin', then that makes a person into someone who is leading themselves astray or deceiving themselves.

there's other verses to back it up.

All fall short of the glory of God.

the deeds are as filthy rags.

I partake of that which I know I should not.

For God has imprisoned all of man in disobedience that he may have mercy on all of man.

etc etc.

You know not what you speak of at all.

You have no ability in you to discern when Paul speaks things that pertain as true to the old man of flesh that you lie if you say you let die with Christ but you yet let him live.

Your real fear is that the seats you fill with people you have told, "Come support the church because Christ loves you just as you are", would now by great numbers leave you if you told them the truth.

Or, you have been programed to do that on behalf of the church run by such an imposter who is himself the man of sin, son of perdition.

Regardless of why you do it, you do not listen to the scriptures and neither then will you listen to me.

Instead you will twist and corrupt and pervert, Just as you do here, and as the poster just after you did.