Is marking of Mark of the Beast is literal or just figurative?

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

And what scripture did you get the idea that the church will be removed "only after or during the heavenly signs in the six seals?"

The seals are apart of the Day of the Lord, not a prelude. In support of this, the Lamb/Jesus, is the One who is opening the seals and causing the fatalities.

All you have been doing is repeating the false teachings of men, the teachings of preterism. It appears that you have no desire to know the truth of Revelation, as you continue to resist it.

Seals, trumpets, bowl judgments = God's wrath

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Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

iamsoandso said:

Hello iamsoandso!

There is only one true gospel. The angel says:

"Fear God and give Him glory, because the hour of His judgment has come. Worship the One who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and the springs of waters.”

Who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all things?

"For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him."

The Father speaking about the Son:

"“In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment. You will roll them up like a robe; like a garmenth they will be changed; but You remain the same, and Your years will never end.”

And

"Therefore God exalted Him to the highest place and gave Him the name above all names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Those great tribulation saints will be one of the groups on the earth during that time of which scripture states that they will have kept their testimony of Jesus and the word of God. And will not have worshiped the beast, his image, nor have received his mark.

The angel is preaching the same gospel (good news) message, which is to trust in Jesus for the forgiveness of sins, who created the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them.

garee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

The church will be lifted up on the last day.

The antichrist' (Satan) as the spirit of error is the god of this world ruling it with his lies..

The 666 is the birth mark(natural unconverted mankind) beast of the field. like fingerprints all of mankind are under the letter of the law "death".

Mark by word it will come to pass . When we do mark his word as law then we have been sealed in the forehead with 777. The mark of born again completion.

Cain unlike his brother born again Abel the first martyr had no sabbath rest a punishment's of bearing the wage of his sin without one micro second of rest from God. The punishment' Christ did bear for those who are yoked with him

Once hell our daily sufferings as a wage of sin is understood as that which in end comes up dead and not dead asleep like us.

And Cain said unto the Lord, My punishment is greater than I can bear. Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me. And the Lord said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the Lord set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him Genesis 13-15

No bargaining with the devil. Mark his word. No sufferings after death. Mark his word

MattforJesus · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

The wrath of God is not in the 7 years period, but after the 7 years period which are the vials.

God will not give up on the world until the world gives up on Him, so He is giving the world 7 years to have their way, and cause all people who do not love Him to follow the beast, and when they take his mark then salvation is no longer available to the world, and God can end sin on earth.

Since God is giving the world 7 years to have their way He will not go against them until that period is over.

There is only 2 resurrections, one of the saints before the millennial reign, and one of the dead after the millennial reign.

For the first three and one half years salvation is still available to the world, so the saints will remain on earth to witness of the truth, and since salvation is available to the world the wrath of God will not be poured upon the world like the wrath of God is not poured upon the world now because salvation is still available to the world.

When the beast claims to be God, and the people that follow him take the mark of the beast then salvation is no longer available to them, and God can put them down, and the saints will be resurrected, which is why Paul said the saints cannot be gathered unto Christ until there is a falling away first, and the man of sin claims to be God.

Which the falling away first is the condition of the world in response to the Gospel, which they stopped the preaching of the Gospel world wide when the nations came together to work for peace on earth favoring the new age movement that evolution is religion, and they are still evolving, and the time that the world will not endure sound doctrine, but want to hear the word of God according to their own lusts, evolving to be greater and spiritual through nature, exalting themselves, and no higher authority above them.

At the end of the first three and one half years the falling away first happened, when the transgressors are come to the full which allows the man of sin to rule over them, and then the saints can go home.

But the beast after he claims to be God has power to continue for three and one half years, and he rules over all nations, kindreds, and tongues, which he can only have power to rule if God allows it, so the wrath of God is not in the last three and one half years because God is allowing the man of sin to rule.

If God's wrath is in the last three and one half years then how can the beast have power to rule during that time.

God is giving the world 7 years to have their way, and go against the truth, which the antichrist will cast the truth to the ground, and stamp upon it, so the wrath of God is not in the 7 years period.

Also the beast makes war against the saints, and prevails against them, and they are given in to his hands for three and one half years, and when he shall accomplish to scatter the power of the holy people then all things are finished.

Which then comes the end when the Son shall deliver up the kingdom to the Father, and then He shall put down all power, authority, and rule.

Also the 6 trumpets are not the wrath of God but warnings to the world to repent of their sins, and turn to God, and leave off their agenda of the new age movement, and that they cannot achieve peace on earth.

Which an example is WW1, set up League of Nations, did not turn to God.

WW2, set up United Nations, and then United Religions, did not turn to God.

And that pattern will continue until the 6th trumpet Islam against the world, which that war is so terrible that one third of the world perishes, but they do not repent of their sins, and turn to God, but accept the New Age Christ as the solution to have peace on earth, so God allows the man of sin to rule over them.

The wrath of God is not in the 7 years period.

If a person misses the first resurrection they have to go to the second resurrection.

Which Jesus said that when the resurrection happens the hypocrites will not be caught up, but will have their portion with the hypocrites, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

And once He shuts the door, and you begin to knock you cannot enter.

After the resurrection no Gentile can be saved.

So if it is pre 7 years resurrection there would be no tribulation saints, but the beast makes war against the saints.

When the nations come together then the 7 years period will begin.

But Paul said when the nations come together and say Peace and safety the Gentile saints will not be deceived by that for they will know that it is not of God.

So the Gentile saints are on earth when the 7 years period starts.

Which Jesus said that He will deliver the saints from the temptation that shall come upon the whole world to try them that dwell on earth, which there can only be one temptation that can come upon the whole world at the same time, which is when the nations come together and say Peace and safety.

For then the world has a decision to make, stay with God, get with God, or follow the world.

Which God said multitudes, multitudes, in the valley of decision, for the day of the LORD is in the valley of decision, for the world has a choice whether to follow God, or follow the world.

The saints are on earth when the 7 years period starts, and Paul said the saints will not be deceived by it for they know it is not of God for the operation of the world to try to achieve peace, and prosperity, and Jesus will deliver the saints from that temptation.

God is giving the world 7 years to have their way, so why would His wrath be in the 7 years period if He is giving them their way to go against the truth so He can end sin on earth, for God will not give up on the world until the world gives up on Him, so He has to let them have their way.

After the 7 years the wrath of God comes upon the world, which the saints are delivered from that wrath.

The wrath of God is not in the 7 years period.

biker · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

^Excellent Proofs!

And it all led to first making Sweden a "cashless" society.

In California, there are places of employment that chip employees. They clock in/out/lunch/breaks by scanning the chip in their right hand. And some diners are no longer accepting cash (claiming theft risk) and pushing a cashless system.

What cracks me up, they claim their systems are not associated to (Bible Analogy) but they still force their chip into your right hand. Not left hand but it's always in the right hand. It's as if the chip will not work unless it's in the right hand

Guojing · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

Hello iamsoandso!

There is only one true gospel. The angel says:

"Fear God and give Him glory, because the hour of His judgment has come. Worship the One who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and the springs of waters.”

Who made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all things?

"For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him."

The Father speaking about the Son:

"“In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment. You will roll them up like a robe; like a garmenth they will be changed; but You remain the same, and Your years will never end.”

And

"Therefore God exalted Him to the highest place and gave Him the name above all names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Those great tribulation saints will be one of the groups on the earth during that time of which scripture states that they will have kept their testimony of Jesus and the word of God. And will not have worshiped the beast, his image, nor have received his mark.

The angel is preaching the same gospel (good news) message, which is to trust in Jesus for the forgiveness of sins, who created the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them.

But in this gospel, if you were "to trust in Jesus for the forgiveness of sins in year 1", you are not sure whether you are "really saved" until the end of year 7 right?

Because throughout those years after you put your trust in Jesus, anytime you choose to receive the mark of the beast, perhaps because you wanted to buy food to eat, you will lose your salvation?

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

MattforJesus said:

That is not correct! The vials/bowls are not the only wrath of God, as can be seen from the following:

"I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed."

Since it is stated that the seven vials are the seven "last plagues" which complete God's wrath, then there would have to be wrath that came before the vials. If you say that something is last, then something had to be first or before what was last. In this case, the bowls are last, completing God's wrath, which means that other wrath had to come before the bowl judgments. If I say that I was last in line to buy my ticket to a movie, it means that there were other people in line before me. It is the same here. The bowl judgments are said to be last completing God's wrath, which means that other wrath had to come before them, which would be the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

biker said:

Good day, biker!

I've thought about the mark going into the right hand and I believe that it is a jab at God, because the right hand with God is the place of honor. Some examples are as follows:

"Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God" - Hebs.12:2

"He went and took the scroll from the right hand of him who sat on the throne." - Rev.5:7

"These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands. - Rev.2:1

"All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will place the sheep on His right and the goats on His left.

These are just a few of the examples of the right hand being the place of honor with God and I think that the mark of the beast going into the right hand is a jab at God. That's Just my opinion based on Satan being the great imitator of God.

just_truth · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

WHO SAYS THAT TRUMPET JUDGEMENT IS SATAN'S WRATH?? SURELY NOT ME WHO SAYS THAT, ONLY THE 5 SEALS IS SATAN'S WRATH.

Ahwatukee said:

LET US SEE OF WHO IS ONE OF US THAT DOES NOT KNOW HIS TALKING.
SATAN WAS A LONG TIME CAST TO THE EARTH(BUT NOT BOUND), WHAT THE SCRIPTURE MEAN THAT HE SATAN KNOW'S HIS SHORT TIME IS THAT HE WILL BE BOUND TO ABYSS, HE CANNOT NO LONGER ROAMING AROUND THE EARTH.

FURTHER, THE SCRIPTURE SAYS... "When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman(IN ANGER) who had given birth to the male child."... But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is FILLED with WRATH, because he knows that his time is short(TO BE BOUND)...

just_truth · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

AGAIN AND AGAIN, HOW MANY TIME DID I TELL YOU THAT the opening of the 7 seals is just a replay of the prophecy of Jesus in Matthew chptr 24 and Mark chptr 13 from the false Christ to heavenly signs(moon/sun dark). It happened since the apostle time up to the last days.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

Satan and his angels still currently have access to heaven and will continue to do so until that war in heaven takes place in Rev.12, which is in the middle of the seven years.

FURTHER, THE SCRIPTURE SAYS... "When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman(IN ANGER) who had given birth to the male child."... But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is FILLED with WRATH, because he knows that his time is short(TO BE BOUND)... [/QUOTE]

"IN ANGER" does not mean that this time period is Satan's wrath. He is just angry because he will have been cast out of heaven and that during the Day of the Lord, which is the time of God's wrath.

This is the last post that I am going to respond to you, because you have been influenced by the teachings of preterism and are unteachable. Therefore, you are free to believe whatever you want. However, I know the truth of what I have been studying for all these years and what you are claiming is not the truth.

just_truth · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

I SEE YOUR STUDYING FOR ALL THESE YEARS, NOW YOU ENCOUNTERED THE TRUTH.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

No, the event of the sun, moon and stars has not yet taken place. Your getting this from when Peter quoted the prophecy in Joel, except that the event of the sun and moon being darkened and stars falling from heaven to the earth has not yet happened. These events will not take place until the church has been removed and during the time of God's wrath.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

The following event takes place right after the sun and moon being darkened. Do you think that it has already taken place?

"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other."

The above is directly related to the sun and moon being darkened, which takes place just as the Lord is returning to the earth to end the age. Do you believe that this event has already happened? If so, when did the world witness the Lord arriving on the clouds of heaven? And when did the world see the Lord send out His angels to collect the wicked and the righteous?

If you say that the sun and moon being darkened has already happened, then the event must also have happened. However, since we have not yet seen Jesus, nor the end of the age, then the sun and moon being darkened is an event that is still future because they happen in close proximately each other.

just_truth · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

YES OF COURSE! the event of the sun, moon and stars has not yet taken place. AS WHAT I SAID THE PROPECHY OF JESUS IS UP TO LAST DAYS AND DID BEGIN DURING THE APOSTLES TIME.

just_truth · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

The following event takes place right after the sun and moon being darkened. Do you think that it has already taken place?

"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other."

The above is directly related to the sun and moon being darkened, which takes place just as the Lord is returning to the earth to end the age. Do you believe that this event has already happened? If so, when did the world witness the Lord arriving on the clouds of heaven? And when did the world see the Lord send out His angels to collect the wicked and the righteous?

If you say that the sun and moon being darkened has already happened, then the event must also have happened. However, since we have not yet seen Jesus, nor the end of the age, then the sun and moon being darkened is an event that is still future because they happen in close proximately each other.

GO BACK TO MY PREVIOUS POST, I DID NOT SAY HEAVENLY SIGNS ALREADY OCCUR.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

That's my point. If the sun, moon and stars event has not taken place, how could have begun during the time of the Apostles?

The darkening of the sun and moon and the stars falling to the earth, happen in close proximity to the Lord's return. So how can you say that it began in the times of the apostles? None of the events of wrath written in Revelation have yet taken place.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

just_truth said:

I think that you are very confused about end-time scriptures and the order in which everything is going to take place.

Nehemiah6 · May 23, 2020

Ahwatukee said:

You can't discourage anyone from indulging in fantasies.

Ahwatukee · May 23, 2020

Nehemiah6 said:

True! It's just too bad that he has been influenced by the fantacy of preterism.

Is marking of Mark of the Beast is literal or just figurative?

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