Is the Devil bound right now...?

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Is Satan bound right now?


  • Total voters
    129
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
0
Texts dealing with Satan Bound:
1. Mt 12:29
2. Mk 3:22-27
3. Lk 10:17-19
4. Jn 12:30-32
5. Eph 4:8
6. Col 2:15
7. Zech 13:2

Here we go...

You posited seven scriptures for your assertion.

Now....go ahead and pick ANY one of these and explain it to us.

Not that you can...because pasting in a verse name and number is as far as anyone has actually tested you before.


Time to move past your comfort zone.

Exegete it for us...


Waiting...
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
7
0
Here we go...

You posited seven scriptures for your assertion.

Now....go ahead and pick ANY one of these and explain it to us.

Not that you can...because pasting in a verse name and number is as far as anyone has actually tested you before.


Time to move past your comfort zone.

Exegete it for us...


Waiting...
I have already explained these at the time I posted them, and have used them ever since. You have a view that you cannot explain which is why you are circumventing the questions I asked twice now.

You have Christ bound. Now what?
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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I have already explained these at the time I posted them, and have used them ever since. You have a view that you cannot explain which is why you are circumventing the questions I asked twice now.

You have Christ bound. Now what?

Look at him, folks....

He doesn't even bother to even so much as reference ANY scripture at all, now, when in discource...as he knows I will call him on it...

He has nothing.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
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Re: See right through you...

And just how does anyone come to Christ when He is in Hades?

And how is death and Satan defeated when Christ remains in Hades?

More Catholic mis-interpretation of scripture.

Show us that Jesus is in hades...
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
7
0
Re: See right through you...

More Catholic mis-interpretation of scripture.

Show us that Jesus is in hades...
Your a joke. This is the is ramifications of your view which you seem unable to explain.

Since all you can do is attempt to circumvent I can only assume you have no explaination. One wonders why you even bothered to ask the question in the first place.

I don't know about Catholic misinterpreting scripture, but in this case you have yet to show the meaning of your own question. Why is that?
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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Re: See right through you...

Your a joke. This is the is ramifications of your view which you seem unable to explain.

Since all you can do is attempt to circumvent I can only assume you have no explaination. One wonders why you even bothered to ask the question in the first place.

I don't know about Catholic misinterpreting scripture, but in this case you have yet to show the meaning of your own question. Why is that?

Stand your ground.

Show us the verse(s) that you somehow feel mandate that Jesus is in Hades....and stick around to actually defend them, if you can...or continue to run away...

Simple.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
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Bowman: 'Are you ready to discuss scripture, yet?'

Cassian: 'No, not yet.'
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
7
0
Bouman,

Stand your ground.
Show us the verse(s) that you somehow feel mandate that Jesus is in Hades....and stick around to actually defend them, if you can...or continue to run away...
I'm not the one that believes Jesus is in Hades. That is the ramification of your view, so far. I'm just trying to help you explain your view which you don't seem able to do. You have missed three opportunities to explain and nothing is put forth.

I have shown you the historical understanding with scriptural support and all you have is that Christ bound Satan by His death. What does that mean? How does death bind Satan? How does this help man for his salvation?
If death binds Satan, then Christ would of necessity need to remain dead in order to keep Him bound. Which is why I stated that you have Jesus still in Hades, if you believe Satan is bound now. Since you have not ever answered or explained your view I don't even know if you think Satan is bound now as your op questions.

So, how about explaining your view. You asked the question and now cannot answer it.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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Bouman,


I'm not the one that believes Jesus is in Hades.
You are the only one making the assertion.



That is the ramification of your view, so far.
Nope.

Nor can you scripturally prove otherwise...





I'm just trying to help you explain your view which you don't seem able to do. You have missed three opportunities to explain and nothing is put forth.
If you are afraid to even use scripture in your explanation, how can you convince anyone...?

You cant.






I have shown you the historical understanding with scriptural support and all you have is that Christ bound Satan by His death.
No, you have not.

I suppose if you say it enough times....and then click your heels together...then it just might magically happen...for you...Dorothy...




What does that mean? How does death bind Satan? How does this help man for his salvation?
Again....and don't ignore it this time...

Sacrificial death has ALWAYS been mandated by Yahweh as a means of providing humanity with respite.

That is why sacrifices had to be made over and over and over again...because the respite period expires...

The final sacrifice was made by God, Himself, to humanity...again providing a period of time for humanity to freely come to Jesus while Satan was out of the way...






If death binds Satan, then Christ would of necessity need to remain dead in order to keep Him bound. Which is why I stated that you have Jesus still in Hades, if you believe Satan is bound now. Since you have not ever answered or explained your view I don't even know if you think Satan is bound now as your op questions.

So, how about explaining your view. You asked the question and now cannot answer it.
Scripture informs the reader that it is Jesus' death that renders Satan impotent.

This is fact....and you have yet to scripturally refute it.

The chapter in Hebrews which mentions this makes no mention of a Resurrection event required to complete it.



Where you got the idea that Jesus had to remain in the grave as long as Satan is bound is a fictional catholic fabrication residing in the inner recesses of a delusional mind...
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
7
0
Bouman,
You are the only one making the assertion.
assertion based on your view which you have not shown to be incorrect. You simply dismiss the concept and still do not explain your view.

I guess I'll need to help you some more.

Sacrificial death has ALWAYS been mandated by Yahweh as a means of providing humanity with respite.
I understand that point. However, you have not explained that a sacrifice is all that was necessary. You put your statement into a little theological box and cannot seem to get out of it in order to make it valid.

Are you saying that Christ's death, death alone gave man this respite? Is this what you understand by Christ binding Satan? Respite from what?

The final sacrifice was made by God, Himself, to humanity...again providing a period of time for humanity to freely come to Jesus while Satan was out of the way...
So the resurrection has no salvfic content. Only the sacrifice is sufficient for our salvation?

You seem to imply that man could not come to God before Christ bound Satan? What about the OT saints?
Could you explain what you mean by the phrase, "Satan out of the way:?

So in your view death has not yet been defeated? If not, what reqirement is needed in your view to defeat death?

Scripture informs the reader that it is Jesus' death that renders Satan impotent.
This is fact....and you have yet to scripturally refute it.
Christ bound Him there by His death, but to be valid, Christ needed to rise from the dead. Without life, death, the power of Satan cannot be defeated. Without the resurrection Christ would have failed in binding Satan. This is what I mean by having a little box which you have created that has absolutely no meaning or effect upon man.

Scripture refutes your little box concept, as does history. The sacrifice was necessary for sin, but the sacrifice does not give life. It is the resurrection that validates the whole of Christ's work. Without it, nothing of any meaning ever occurred for our salvation. We don't celebrate his death, but His victory over death. It is that victory, life over death that gives man and the world life, defeats Satan and his power, death.

The chapter in Hebrews which mentions this makes no mention of a Resurrection event required to complete it.
which is due to your creation of little isolated boxes of theology. You fail to connect them so they have meaning. It presupposes the resurrection which is amply explained elsewhere in scripture.

Death itself does not defeat death. Life defeats death. The power of Satan, death was completed by Christ's resurrection. Without the resurrection death remains and Satan remains unbound would still absolute power over man.

Where you got the idea that Jesus had to remain in the grave as long as Satan is bound is a fictional catholic fabrication residing in the inner recesses of a delusional mind...
It was deduced from your little box theology. See if you can dispell that notion. Explain just how death, per se, binds Satan.
Let's see if you can answer these questions and shed some light upon your view which at this point has no scriptural/theological meaning. Fill in that meaning.

Put some relevancy to your OP. The fact that you have continued to mount a distraction from your view shows that you cannot explain it and actually answer your own OP.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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Bouman,
assertion based on your view which you have not shown to be incorrect. You simply dismiss the concept and still do not explain your view.

I guess I'll need to help you some more.
And you are going to scripturally correct me...right?




I understand that point. However, you have not explained that a sacrifice is all that was necessary. You put your statement into a little theological box and cannot seem to get out of it in order to make it valid.
My theology is based upon scripture.

Yours is not....that is why you are afraid to even mention a verse at this point...





Are you saying that Christ's death, death alone gave man this respite?
Scripture states this...not me.




Is this what you understand by Christ binding Satan? Respite from what?
Respite from his direct interference.




So the resurrection has no salvfic content. Only the sacrifice is sufficient for our salvation?
That is your assertion.

We are dealing with the Binding of Satan...not our Salvation.

Satan had to be bound first to give us time to come to Jesus for Salvation.





You seem to imply that man could not come to God before Christ bound Satan? What about the OT saints?
Could you explain what you mean by the phrase, "Satan out of the way:?
Hebrews 1.1 - 2 informs the reader that Yahweh revealed Himself as Triune in the OT and through The Son in the NT.

Salvation has ALWAYS been the same both in the OT & the NT...and that is through worship of God as Triune.

Few in the OT worshipped God in this manner - and the few that did were protected and allowed to enter into the future...








So in your view death has not yet been defeated? If not, what reqirement is needed in your view to defeat death?
Death is thrown into the Lake of Fire at the Second Death, according to Revelation.





Christ bound Him there by His death, but to be valid, Christ needed to rise from the dead. Without life, death, the power of Satan cannot be defeated. Without the resurrection Christ would have failed in binding Satan. This is what I mean by having a little box which you have created that has absolutely no meaning or effect upon man.
You keep repeating and blending two separate events WITHOUT showing ANY scriptural support.

Impress me and show ANY scripture for your repeat assertions.

Don't be afraid.


 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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Scripture refutes your little box concept, as does history.
You can keep parroting that till you are blue in the face...but until you can scripturally refute my position, you still have nothing.

You act like nobody has ever called you on this before...




The sacrifice was necessary for sin, but the sacrifice does not give life. It is the resurrection that validates the whole of Christ's work. Without it, nothing of any meaning ever occurred for our salvation. We don't celebrate his death, but His victory over death. It is that victory, life over death that gives man and the world life, defeats Satan and his power, death.
Another event.

We are talking about the binding.

Scripture makes the distinction.....when are you?
 
Dec 18, 2013
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Firstly, we agree that Jesus crucifixion and resurrection is of utmost importance and that it binds Satan even more to his ultimate destiny.

The answer though as to whether that old dragon is bound in the Bottomless Pit as it is written is no, but he will be. To prove that the devil was not directly sealed into the pit at the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus it is rather straight-forward. Paul we know converted after Jesus was resurrected and ascended into heaven.

1 Thessalonians 2:18

[SUP]18 [/SUP]Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

So if Paul having been converted after the ascension of Christ says that Satan tried to hinder him this only shows that the Bottomless Pit was not opened and then sealed upon the resurrection of Jesus. Nevertheless because of the resurrection of Jesus all that which was foretold shall surely come to pass.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
7
0
Bouman,

so you missed another chance to prove your OP. It is your op, show the theology/scriptural meaning behind it. You have Christ bound. Now what? You say Satan cannot have interference, just what does that mean in your view?

Death is thrown into the Lake of Fire at the Second Death, according to Revelation
So it was not Christ that defeated death. It was simply thrown into the fire?

Could you explain just how you or anyone can get to heaven or hell based on your view?

How long are you going to keep us all in suspense?

You have Christ binding Satan by His death. So far, this has no meaning for our salvation. So Christ bound Satan, what does that mean, according to your view?
If you cannot explain it, why make the OP?

You can keep parroting that till you are blue in the face...but until you can scripturally refute my position, you still have nothing.
I have already given the historical/scriptural meaning. You don't accept it, however, no one can actually refute your view since you have yet to give any credence and explanation of what it means that Christ bound Satan by His death.

At this point you don't even have a position anyone can refute. I need much more clarification by you.

You act like nobody has ever called you on this before...
Why would anyone, except those that have developed supposedly innovative ideas about scripture which you seem to be doing, though you cannot explain yourself. What I explained has been the historical/scriptural view since the Apostles and the early Church. The very first liturgy written by James, proclaims the resurrection as defeating death by death. Without the resurrection your binding of Satan by death is impotent and meaningless.
But give it a try. See if you can overturn 2000 years of unchanging Truth.

Show me anywhere in scripture that death actually defeats death?
Your text, maybe you should check your Greek again. It is death that binds, but the key word is a preposition, it is not by death as you seem to want to make it, but through death. The fact is, life cannot be won unless Christ died, so that a resurrection, the actually defeat of death can take place.

This is why you need to explain your view since it is wholly a new, personal explanation that you created. The fact that now 34 people in the poll have no idea that Christ apparently rose from the dead giving life to the world and defeated death. It is why there is a heaven and hell because Christ defeated death, the power of Satan. We have 34 people who don't understand why Christ came and what He accomplished for us.

It is quite ironic that based on your statement, these 34 people actually don't believe Christ even died. At least you're half way there, having Christ dying and binding Satan in Hades.

Now explain it with more meat not all of your subterfuge.

 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
0
Firstly, we agree that Jesus crucifixion and resurrection is of utmost importance and that it binds Satan even more to his ultimate destiny.

The answer though as to whether that old dragon is bound in the Bottomless Pit as it is written is no, but he will be. To prove that the devil was not directly sealed into the pit at the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus it is rather straight-forward. Paul we know converted after Jesus was resurrected and ascended into heaven.

1 Thessalonians 2:18

[SUP]18 [/SUP]Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

So if Paul having been converted after the ascension of Christ says that Satan tried to hinder him this only shows that the Bottomless Pit was not opened and then sealed upon the resurrection of Jesus. Nevertheless because of the resurrection of Jesus all that which was foretold shall surely come to pass.

Adding context…


For, brothers, you became imitators of the assemblies of God being in Judea in Christ Jesus, because you also suffered these things by your own fellow countrymen, as they did also by the Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, also having driven us out, and not pleasing God, and being contrary to all men, hindering us from speaking to the nations in order that they be saved, to the filling up of their sins always. But the wrath to the end is come on them. But, brothers, we being taken away from you for an hour's time, in presence, not in heart, we were much more eager with much desire to see your face. Because of this, we desired to come to you, truly I, Paul, both once and twice; but Satan hindered us. (1 Thes 2.14 – 18)




As we can see by adding context, this ‘hindering’ is applied to what the Jews (plural) did in obstructing the spread of the Gospel.


Obviously, since Satan cannot possess more than one person at a time, then this can only apply to the work of his demons, and not himself, as he is bound during this time.




 
Dec 18, 2013
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Adding context…


For, brothers, you became imitators of the assemblies of God being in Judea in Christ Jesus, because you also suffered these things by your own fellow countrymen, as they did also by the Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, also having driven us out, and not pleasing God, and being contrary to all men, hindering us from speaking to the nations in order that they be saved, to the filling up of their sins always. But the wrath to the end is come on them. But, brothers, we being taken away from you for an hour's time, in presence, not in heart, we were much more eager with much desire to see your face. Because of this, we desired to come to you, truly I, Paul, both once and twice; but Satan hindered us. (1 Thes 2.14 – 18)




As we can see by adding context, this ‘hindering’ is applied to what the Jews (plural) did in obstructing the spread of the Gospel.


Obviously, since Satan cannot possess more than one person at a time, then this can only apply to the work of his demons, and not himself, as he is bound during this time.




Your explanation would make Paul a liar.

Paul is not a liar, but he spoke truth, even if it is hard for some to understand.
 
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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Bouman,

so you missed another chance to prove your OP. It is your op, show the theology/scriptural meaning behind it. You have Christ bound. Now what? You say Satan cannot have interference, just what does that mean in your view?
Satan is bound, but his demons are not.





So it was not Christ that defeated death. It was simply thrown into the fire?

Death is defeated by Christ.







Could you explain just how you or anyone can get to heaven or hell based on your view?

How long are you going to keep us all in suspense?

If you worship God as Triune, you will be saved.





You have Christ binding Satan by His death.
Scripture has this...not me.

If you disagree, then show otherwise...