Is the human soul immortal?

DavidTree · Apr 8, 2022

it’s found in the gospel actually. Paul’s just explaining what Jesus already set forth. Paul wasn’t creating a mystery He was explaining it

there are two resurrections we don’t take part in both we either do one and take part of the present eternal resurrection of our spiritual body the moment our flesh dies , or we take part em the dead are raised in the end because we chose the flesh

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13

if we live after the flesh we’re going to be raised here with the dead at christs return

“And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. …And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

some Christians will be in That group and saved then because they died in Christ.

other Christians who did this aren’t in that group

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

They aren’t part of the dead being judged because they accepted judgement now and let the flesh die now and followed the spirit now bekng reborn into everlasting life they are in this group who overcame the flesh and world by his word of life

“And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God,

and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

They found resurrection here

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

and so they aren’t let of the dead in the end who are raised here

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

there are two resurrections one present and one for the dead who fall asleep in Christ not able to put the flesh to death but remain in the grave until tbier spiritual body is raised up in the end

some will be saved in the end others find life by the spirit now and when thoer flesh dies thier spirit goes into the lords kingdom to reign with him until the rest of The dead are raised

“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s those who does in Christ because of this they’re still going to be saved because they called upon his name

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There are the living in Christ and the dead in Christ but all in him will be saved some he will bring with him others he will father in the end from among the dead again , not this group though

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s the spirit we follow to mortify the flesh so we don’t enter death with the flesh. If we’re able to hear that part we’re of the firstfruits in christs resurrection there’s an order to it both resurrections

“For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order:

Christ , the firstfruits;

afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

If we hear and believe the gospel and keep it the second death has no power over us nor the resurrection of the dead who are raised in the end , we can be part of the reign on heaven the firstfruits raised with Christ.

“Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.”
‭‭James‬ ‭1:18‬ ‭KJV

Allow the Holy spirit and His Word to fix this: "there are two resurrections we don’t take part in both we either do one and take part of the present eternal resurrection of our spiritual body the moment our flesh dies , or we take part em the dead are raised in the end." because we chose the flesh.

Peace

Nehemiah6 · Apr 8, 2022

Mem said:

To understand how the natural man -- the man who is "under the sun" -- sees the afterlife. Ecclesiastes is all about the natural man. Philosophers and Buddhists see life as mere "vanity". But "the just shall live by faith" and "without faith it is impossible to please God". So by faith we understand that those who have passed on are very much alive (Hebrews 12:1, 22-24). And so are those who are in Hades (Luke 16).

Pilgrimshope · Apr 8, 2022

DavidTree said:

this spirit you mean ?

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. ( one resurrection )

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (The last resurrection of dead who wait in the grave )
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24, 28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: ( they’re received his word in life )

and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God,

and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

…And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:4-5, 12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You talking about letting the spirit who spoke the word correct us ?

there are two resurrections clearly in scripture we either are in the first or the last with the rest of the dead. Either this is untrue and we should ignore it or it’s the first resurrection that assures one of everlasting life

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

And either this is untrue and we should ignore it or it’s the resurrection. Of the dead in the end who didn’t receive the word of life

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

but you know maybe he’s going to put those who are alive in his kingdom …..back into their graves and raise them up again with the dead.

I don’t think he’s gonna do that part but who knows maybe I guess it seems pretty clear really there are two resurrections one group and then “ the rest of the dead who live again later “ “ now is the time , and then marvel not for the hour is coming “

I’m not planning on waiting in a grave but more like this planning on leaving my old body behind where it belongs

“Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: we are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:6, 8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I don’t think he’s in the grave and I do t recall any scriotire ever saying he’s going to put the living back in thier dead decayed body to raise it again once the e left it for glory. That seems like something we imagine rather than something the Holy Spirit is telling us

DavidTree · Apr 8, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

this spirit you mean ?

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. ( one resurrection )

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (The last resurrection of dead who wait in the grave )
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24, 28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: ( they’re received his word in life )

and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God,

and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

…And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:4-5, 12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You talking about letting the spirit who spoke the word correct us ?

there are two resurrections clearly in scripture we either are in the first or the last with the rest of the dead. Either this is untrue and we should ignore it or it’s the first resurrection that assures one of everlasting life

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

And either this is untrue and we should ignore it or it’s the resurrection. Of the dead in the end who didn’t receive the word of life

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

but you know maybe he’s going to put those who are alive in his kingdom …..back into their graves and raise them up again with the dead.

I don’t think he’s gonna do that part but who knows maybe I guess it seems pretty clear really there are two resurrections one group and then “ the rest of the dead who live again later “ “ now is the time , and then marvel not for the hour is coming “

I’m not planning on waiting in a grave but more like this planning on leaving my old body behind where it belongs

“Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: we are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:6, 8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I don’t think he’s in the grave and I do t recall any scriotire ever saying he’s going to put the living back in thier dead decayed body to raise it again once the e left it for glory. That seems like something we imagine rather than something the Holy Spirit is telling us

ALL the scriptures you post are YEAH and AMEN in my heart - thank you.

Fill in the blank below (two words).

We who are Born-Again by the Spirit, have already experienced the first part of the First Resurrection,
where Christ is the Firstfruits of them that have___________________ _____________________.

RR · Apr 8, 2022

TMS said:

Exactly, before the breath of life, Adam was a dead soul. People often use the phrase "oh, that poor soul", which isn't referring to a separate entity from the body, but the person himself.

RR

Pilgrimshope · Apr 8, 2022

DavidTree said:

there is no “first part “ the resurrections aren’t two part . there’s one group and then the other group

“But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s not the first part of anything if it was it would say That somewhere bro.

“Then shall the dust return to the dust as it was:

and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:7‬ ‭

“it is sown a natural body;( death )

it is raised a spiritual body. (resurrection )

There is a natural body,( dies )

and there is a spiritual body.” (Lives )
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And as we have borne the image of the earthy, ( natural body made for this temporary life )

we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.”( spiritual body made for eternal Life )
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There’s just two groups the living and dead. Some are never going to enter death thier flesh will just be shed away and left behind ,

others will be raised up the last day from among the dead.

DavidTree · Apr 8, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

there is no “first part “ the resurrections aren’t two part . there’s one group and then the other group

“But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s not the first part of anything if it was it would say That somewhere bro.

“Then shall the dust return to the dust as it was:

and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:7‬ ‭

“it is sown a natural body;( death )

it is raised a spiritual body. (resurrection )

There is a natural body,( dies )

and there is a spiritual body.” (Lives )
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And as we have borne the image of the earthy, ( natural body made for this temporary life )

we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.”( spiritual body made for eternal Life )
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There’s just two groups the living and dead. Some are never going to enter death thier flesh will just be shed away and left behind ,

others will be raised up the last day from among the dead.

AMEN to every scripture you posted.

Every believer in Christ is part of the First Resurrection - AMEN and HalleluYah

DavidTree · Apr 8, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

AFTER His Resurrection Jesus appears to His disciples - Luke 24:36-43
Now as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them, “Peace to you.” But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit. And He said to them, “Why are you troubled? And why do doubts arise in your hearts? Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have.”
When He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet. But while they still did not believe for joy, and marveled, He said to them, “Have you any food here?” So they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish and some honeycomb. And He took it and ate in their presence.

Was the Lord Jesus Christ resurrected in a corruptable body?

Pilgrimshope · Apr 8, 2022

DavidTree said:

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s spoken to the church both parts. That’s what determines which resurrection we belong to. Some Christians are going to be raised up here and saved because they are written in the book of life believing and calling upon the lord

“And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. …And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

no believer in Christ is going to be cast into the lake of fire but some will die. The way to avoid death and that resurrection is to get our deeds straitened our in this life, by following the spirit and ridding ourselves of the deeds of the flesh before we die.

if we follow this spirit it will
Mortify the deeds of the flesh for us

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The first resurrection corresponds here

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭

Some believers don’t accept that part, they aren’t able to hear it . They’re here

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”

and here

“No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s not the same as this

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Not all can hear the same call in Christ. But they have all heard and believe this and will be saved that day raised up in the end

“that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:9, 11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

every Christian will be saved and raised up but there’s an order to it Christ , the firstfruits …..and then when he returns those who belong to him he will raise up from the dead they died in him and father those left alive like this

“Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:51-52‬ ‭

again that’s not this group who accept and abide his word hey don’t enter death they just part from the body because they are born of the word and walked in the spirit rather than flesh

“Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever….. But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭1:22-23, 25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s the group that keep his words and never die , the others believe but die because they never overcome the world they’re going to be saved also just at a different time in the end he will remove all their corruption they didn’t overcome
When the dead in chrirt are raised to join the Living in Christ.

DavidTree · Apr 8, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s spoken to the church both parts. That’s what determines which resurrection we belong to. Some Christians are going to be raised up here and saved because they are written in the book of life believing and calling upon the lord

“And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. …And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

no believer in Christ is going to be cast into the lake of fire but some will die. The way to avoid death and that resurrection is to get our deeds straitened our in this life, by following the spirit and ridding ourselves of the deeds of the flesh before we die.

if we follow this spirit it will
Mortify the deeds of the flesh for us

“It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:63‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The first resurrection corresponds here

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭

Some believers don’t accept that part, they aren’t able to hear it . They’re here

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”

and here

“No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.”
‭‭John‬ ‭6:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s not the same as this

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Not all can hear the same call in Christ. But they have all heard and believe this and will be saved that day raised up in the end

“that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:9, 11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

every Christian will be saved and raised up but there’s an order to it Christ , the firstfruits …..and then when he returns those who belong to him he will raise up from the dead they died in him and father those left alive like this

“Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:51-52‬ ‭

again that’s not this group who accept and abide his word hey don’t enter death they just part from the body because they are born of the word and walked in the spirit rather than flesh

“Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever….. But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭1:22-23, 25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s the group that keep his words and never die , the others believe but die because they never overcome the world they’re going to be saved also just at a different time in the end he will remove all their corruption they didn’t overcome
When the dead in chrirt are raised to join the Living in Christ.

AMEN to every scripture you posted.
Every believer in Christ is part of the First Resurrection - AMEN and HalleluYah

Was the Lord Jesus Christ resurrected in a corruptable body?

Pilgrimshope · Apr 8, 2022

DavidTree said:

his body was never corrupt on the first place of course not he perfected his flesh the only one ever to not sin .

and no not every Christians believer is part of the first resurrection it’s for those who receive his word and judgement it’s why you see them seated on thrones having received judgement . It’s not that they are now judging others it’s that they received his words and walked in them applied them to life and didn’t continue serving the flesh they overcame the world

“To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭3:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

they are in the first resurrection because they heard and received the wternal
Jidgement christs word

all Christians don’t do this part lol

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

they reject his word instead and do t no her receiving his words in the gospel that’s how they die but they will take part in the end resurrection because they also are in the book of life……this matters brother

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13‬ ‭

that decides which resurrection we belong to all are going to be saved though …..but you shouldn’t compare any flesh of any man to Jesus flesh that’a like comparing man to God he is and was always perfect never once did he any sin . We all have that’s why our bodies die and we have to be translated to spiritual bodies

remember what a spiritual being is though it’s not less than a natural bekng it’s more. Many times angels I are spiritual beings appear as men in earth Sonora not like the movies a spirit isn’t just floating around like a ghost. We aren’t allowed I don’t think anyways to do what angels did but spiritual beings have a body we just can’t see it if it’s not manifest spiritual beings are grea the r than natural it’s an upgrade

Mem · Apr 9, 2022

DavidTree said:

Together with...
There goes the resurrection in stages (as in according to the time we die and/or different groupings of saints) supposition.

Mem · Apr 9, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

Notice what is not written: "it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual soul"

Mem · Apr 9, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

Isaiah 26:19 Together with my dead body they shall rise" . No separate ressurrection.

Pilgrimshope said:

Nehemiah6 said:

This verse explains the converse of "shall never see death" or who will never see
Psalm 49:18-9 Though in his lifetime he blesses his soul—and men praise you when you prosper— he will join the generation of his fathers, who will never see the light of day.

Mem · Apr 9, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

Using the analogy of this body being an apple, it is sown, as in the fruit falls from the tree, and so rots leaving behind only the seed, which then said seed is raised into an entire tree in itself... the glorified body.

DavidTree · Apr 9, 2022

Pilgrimshope said:

his body was never corrupt on the first place of course not he perfected his flesh the only one ever to not sin .

and no not every Christians believer is part of the first resurrection it’s for those who receive his word and judgement it’s why you see them seated on thrones having received judgement . It’s not that they are now judging others it’s that they received his words and walked in them applied them to life and didn’t continue serving the flesh they overcame the world

“To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭3:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

they are in the first resurrection because they heard and received the wternal
Jidgement christs word

all Christians don’t do this part lol

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

they reject his word instead and do t no her receiving his words in the gospel that’s how they die but they will take part in the end resurrection because they also are in the book of life……this matters brother

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:13‬ ‭

that decides which resurrection we belong to all are going to be saved though …..but you shouldn’t compare any flesh of any man to Jesus flesh that’a like comparing man to God he is and was always perfect never once did he any sin . We all have that’s why our bodies die and we have to be translated to spiritual bodies

remember what a spiritual being is though it’s not less than a natural bekng it’s more. Many times angels I are spiritual beings appear as men in earth Sonora not like the movies a spirit isn’t just floating around like a ghost. We aren’t allowed I don’t think anyways to do what angels did but spiritual beings have a body we just can’t see it if it’s not manifest spiritual beings are grea the r than natural it’s an upgrade

Do believe HE died on the Cross? YES/NO

posthuman · Apr 9, 2022

RR said:

a 'dead soul' ?
according to what definition of 'dead' ?
are you saying Adam existed before he was created?

existence is not the same quality as 'life' or 'death'

Pilgrimshope · Apr 9, 2022

Mem said:

yeah that’s the thing in my opinion a soul is a living person.

“And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,( natural body )

and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; ( living spirit )

and man became a living soul.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭2:7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The natural body was formed first , then the spirit was given into the body and a living soul is born.

at death it’s the opposite process the natural body dies and the spirit which has become a living soul returns to God

“Then shall the dust return to the dust as it was:

and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the natural body returns to the earth the spiritual body sustaining the soul returns to God who gave man spirit and created a soul within the body.

The natural body is only for this natural life we live it carries the spirit until death and the spirit lives in and returns to God. Dust returns as it was dust and the living spirit brings the soul for judgement to God.

Pilgrimshope · Apr 9, 2022

Mem said:

“Isaiah 26:19 Together with my dead body they shall rise" . No separate ressurrection.”

how does this mean there’s no seperate resurrection ?

This verse explains the converse of "shall never see death" or who will never see
Psalm 49:18-9 Though in his lifetime he blesses his soul—and men praise you when you prosper— he will join the generation of his fathers, who will never see the light of day”

How so ? Your saying this revelation is cancelled by a single verse from Isaiah ?

“And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God,

and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

This is the first resurrection.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

your saying this resurrection that tells us the rest of the dead didn’t live until after this is not seperate from this resurrection because of those two verses in Isaiah ? I’m not following sorry

“the rest of the dead lived not again until”

“And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

…And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:12, 15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

your saying the re aren’t teo resurrections ? And one group is t raised first , and then the rest of the dead are t going to have to wait until the last resurrection ? Based on those verses ?

can you elaborate on that , notice the others in the first resurrection were given judgement already and already were alive and already reigning with Christ ?

How do we get that group back among the dead on thier graves who rise for judgement ?

Pilgrimshope · Apr 9, 2022

Mem said:

yeah the seed dies and the life in it ( the spirit ) is what lives. But we’re not talking about literally being planted in the ground otherwise what if someone who is creamated ? Or devoured by wild animals or sea creatures ? Are they just lost because tbier body is destroyed ? And not literally planted in the ground ?

we have to understand the difference In these two positions the natural and spiritual. They will never agree

“Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth;

comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭2:12-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We need to let scriptire hash it out rather than thinking too
Much in the natural analogies and relating them to earthly things well
Never grasp Anything like that.

remembering that the Old Testament isn’t where we find the answers about urging after the first death of the natural body but the New Testament is where we find the answers pertaining to the resurrection of the dead the New Testament folks were filled with the Holy Ghost , the Old Testament folks were naturally minded hearing veiled prophecy from the spirit.

if we want mystery we look at ot prophecy if we want the answers to those mysteries we look tonthe revelation of the New Testament the spirit and not the flesh.

the ot is wonderful and helpful but it’s not our answers d it’s not revealed but hidden behind a veil that’s why it talks very little me very vaguely of what happens after death.

“ the dead know nothing “ is a good example it says that because it’s this

“but their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament;

which vail is done away in Christ.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭3:14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that’s why Christ talks so much of life after death , and shows us things they didn’t and could t know until he came forth we want to begin with Jesus be the gospel and then study the prophets otherwise you seem to see contradiction rather than helpful Information.

Is the human soul immortal?

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