There are many covenants spoken of in the Bible. God will use things in creation to help us understand spiritual turths such as when God uses the covenant of marriage to help us understand our relationship with Him. But even in this the act of literal marriage is not done away with. We see the same thing with the Sabbath. Just because God uses the rest found in the seventh day Sabbath to help us better understand spiritual truths does not mean the literal seventh day Sabbath is done away with or changed to another day. The Sabbath is first a memorial of creation that testifies of a Creator. If God chooses to use the Sabbath in different teachings lessons that His prerogative. Would you say that now that we are married to Christ the marriage covenant between a man and a woman is done away with or change to allow a man and man or a woman and a woman to be married? So why change the seventh day Sabbath just because God uses it to teach His people lessons?
Is your denomination misleading you?
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The portion of scripture that only speaks to the way Christ changed the world (10% of scripture) always shows how God taught his principles to Israel, first, then how Christ took those very same principles and completed them. There is absolutely nothing to indicate God wiped out all He is when He sent His Son for us. The closest scripture comes to that is when translators use the word "obsolete" in Hebrews. Even there, nothing is obsolete but becoming obsolete. What is more, Romans especially goes to great length explaining that with Christ, we are grafted into Israel, and what God wants is one united people under God. So we are accepted as God's family, God is our Father, too. So if God made a contract we better listen to that contract. God doesn't go back on contracts when He makes new, better ones. Even in the secular world, a contract is a promise, God is above and better than our secular world.
S
The Catholic church CLAIMED to change the Sabbath to Sunday....in fact, Christians were worshipping on Sunday prior to the formation of the Catholic Church.
In the Sabbatarian group I was involved with, they claimed that there was a conspiracy of some sort which began in the early church to change the Sabbath and to undermine the "truth", the "truth" being what they taught...further, they claimed that they restored true Christianity to mankind after about 1900 years of being suppressed.
By the way, this "revelation" was revealed in a vision by an angel given to the "apostle's" wife...and we all know what Galatians says about gospels which are brought by angels.
Ellen G White of the Seventh Day Adventist church claimed similar angelic visions.
In the Sabbatarian group I was involved with, they claimed that there was a conspiracy of some sort which began in the early church to change the Sabbath and to undermine the "truth", the "truth" being what they taught...further, they claimed that they restored true Christianity to mankind after about 1900 years of being suppressed.
By the way, this "revelation" was revealed in a vision by an angel given to the "apostle's" wife...and we all know what Galatians says about gospels which are brought by angels.
Ellen G White of the Seventh Day Adventist church claimed similar angelic visions.
Genesis 2:1-3 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Again, I see no command only perhaps an embedded provision for future rest.
From Adam to Moses, again no mention of a command to rest.
The Sabbath command was to the Jewish nation.
No such command to the Church.
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Again, I see no command only perhaps an embedded provision for future rest.
From Adam to Moses, again no mention of a command to rest.
The Sabbath command was to the Jewish nation.
No such command to the Church.
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P
So much nonsense. God specifically said "Israel, this is between you and me". God never said "Okay, gentile, it's your turn. This now applies to you too".
He said He would give a new covenanat and the old wasn't meant to be for everybody. It took a perfect one to do that. You know all this. You reject the teachings of Christ.
He said He would give a new covenanat and the old wasn't meant to be for everybody. It took a perfect one to do that. You know all this. You reject the teachings of Christ.
You reject everything Christ told you, and then you say I reject ---what? You reject that Christ was a Jew, that Christ spoke often of Moses and talked of listening to him, that Christ said to obey, that Christ said he changed nothing, that Christ said to "follow me" as he kept the feasts and worshipped in synagogues and built the church, as Christ taught from scripture----you don't follow anything of Christ I can see and you accuse me who does my best to follow all of Christ!!!!!!
I see no command prior to Mt. Sinai that says not to murder, lie, covet, commit adultery and so on but people were found guilty of these things prior to the given of the Law. Now let's look at the seventh day of creation. God calls the day blessed. What does it mean to be blessed by God? What was God thinking when He said it was a blessed, holy and sanctified day?
Blessed:
1. consecrated; sacred; holy; sanctified.
2. worthy of adoration,reverence,or worship.
3. divinely or supremely favored;fortunate.
4. bliss fully happy or contented.
Holy:
1. specially recognized as or declared sacred by religious use or authority;consecrated.
2. Dedicated or devoted to the service of God,the church,or religion.
3. saintly;godly;pious;devout.
4. having a spiritually pure quality.
5.entitled to worship or veneration.
Sanctified:
1. To make holy; set apart as sacred; consecrate.
2. to purify or free from sin.
3. to impart religious sanction to; render legitimate or binding.
4. to entitle to reverence or respect.
5. to make productive of or conducive to spiritual blessing.
Now look at all these words and understand their meaning and value in the mind of God. Now think about this, with all these words that God used to define the seventh day and not one word about, "Thou shall not murder" yet Cain was found guilty of the sin of murder. Don't you think we should put some value in honoring the seventh day in light of how God defines it or do you need to be under the Law for that?
Blessed:
1. consecrated; sacred; holy; sanctified.
2. worthy of adoration,reverence,or worship.
3. divinely or supremely favored;fortunate.
4. bliss fully happy or contented.
Holy:
1. specially recognized as or declared sacred by religious use or authority;consecrated.
2. Dedicated or devoted to the service of God,the church,or religion.
3. saintly;godly;pious;devout.
4. having a spiritually pure quality.
5.entitled to worship or veneration.
Sanctified:
1. To make holy; set apart as sacred; consecrate.
2. to purify or free from sin.
3. to impart religious sanction to; render legitimate or binding.
4. to entitle to reverence or respect.
5. to make productive of or conducive to spiritual blessing.
Now look at all these words and understand their meaning and value in the mind of God. Now think about this, with all these words that God used to define the seventh day and not one word about, "Thou shall not murder" yet Cain was found guilty of the sin of murder. Don't you think we should put some value in honoring the seventh day in light of how God defines it or do you need to be under the Law for that?
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One standard of love and righteousness for all people.
Exodus 12:49 "One law shall be for the native-born and for the foreigner who dwells among you."
Leviticus 24:22 "You shall have the same law for the stranger and for one from your own country; for I am the Lord your God.’”
Isaiah 56:1-8 This is what the Lord says: "Be just and fair to all. Do what is right and good, for I am coming soon to rescue you and to display my righteousness among you. Blessed are all those who are careful to do this. Blessed are those who honor my Sabbath day of rest and keep themselves from doing wrong. "Don't let Gentiles who commit themselves to the Lord say, "The Lord will never let me be part of his people." And don't let the eunuchs say, "I'm a dried-up tree with no children and no future." For this is what the Lord says: I will bless those eunuchs who keep my Sabbath day holy and who choose to do what pleases me and commit their lives to me. I will give them within the walls of my house a memorial and a name far greater than sons and daughters could give. For the name I give them is an everlasting one. It will never disappear! "I will also bless the Gentile who commit themselves to the Lord, who serve him and love his name, who worship him and do not desecrate the Sabbath day of rest, and who hold fast to my covenant. I will bring them to my holy mountain of Jerusalem and will fill them with joy in my house of prayer. I will accept their burnt offerings and sacrifices, because my house will be called a house of prayer for all nations. For the Sovereign Lord, who brings back the outcasts of Israel, says: I will bring others, too, besides my people Israel."
If you love God, His commandments won't be a burden to you.
Exodus 12:49 "One law shall be for the native-born and for the foreigner who dwells among you."
Leviticus 24:22 "You shall have the same law for the stranger and for one from your own country; for I am the Lord your God.’”
Isaiah 56:1-8 This is what the Lord says: "Be just and fair to all. Do what is right and good, for I am coming soon to rescue you and to display my righteousness among you. Blessed are all those who are careful to do this. Blessed are those who honor my Sabbath day of rest and keep themselves from doing wrong. "Don't let Gentiles who commit themselves to the Lord say, "The Lord will never let me be part of his people." And don't let the eunuchs say, "I'm a dried-up tree with no children and no future." For this is what the Lord says: I will bless those eunuchs who keep my Sabbath day holy and who choose to do what pleases me and commit their lives to me. I will give them within the walls of my house a memorial and a name far greater than sons and daughters could give. For the name I give them is an everlasting one. It will never disappear! "I will also bless the Gentile who commit themselves to the Lord, who serve him and love his name, who worship him and do not desecrate the Sabbath day of rest, and who hold fast to my covenant. I will bring them to my holy mountain of Jerusalem and will fill them with joy in my house of prayer. I will accept their burnt offerings and sacrifices, because my house will be called a house of prayer for all nations. For the Sovereign Lord, who brings back the outcasts of Israel, says: I will bring others, too, besides my people Israel."
If you love God, His commandments won't be a burden to you.
P
How long have you been living in Israel among the jews? In America we expect people to obey our laws when they are here too. Those scriptures could not be more clear. When in Rome, do as the Romans.
The only Israel God recognizes today is the spiritual one. We worship God in spirit and in truth, not with our hands. Works based salvation will take you to hell. You better wake up and jettison such erroneus teaching.
Stop twisting scripture to fit your idea of what doctrine is. God's word is immutable. Get used to it.
The only Israel God recognizes today is the spiritual one. We worship God in spirit and in truth, not with our hands. Works based salvation will take you to hell. You better wake up and jettison such erroneus teaching.
Stop twisting scripture to fit your idea of what doctrine is. God's word is immutable. Get used to it.
The only problem with that is that it seems the Israelites didn't take it as spiritually as you suggest - they litteraly went out and tore down Asherah poles. They actually went to the temple, made animal sacrifices, etc.. The text wasn't intended to be spiritualized; it was intended to be read by the Israelites and followed as written.
That's all well and good, and I don't disagree with the principle, but that text in Ex 34 is talking about actual idols, and specifically Asherah's idols. This wasn't a spiritual command to the Israelites - they were being told to tear down some real idols. This isn't a command that can be followed as written today - there are no Asherah poles. Sure we can recognize the principle of worshiping Yahweh alone, but we still can't follow the text as written. If we're going to be sticklers about the 10 commandments, let's at least try to follow the instructions as written. We can't be sticklers about following the 10 commandments and then immediately start making exceptions and spiritualizations all through the text.
The real point I'm making here is that it's obvious you can't follow the 10 commandments as written. So it seems a little out of place to try to place that requirement on people.
Sure, I agree; Jesus is the Temple, the Church is His body and so the Spirit resides in us. However, we still can't follow Ex 34 as it's written. We can apply some general principles that we see in the actual commands, but there are no Asherah poles. As you point out, we aren't agricultural people - we don't have live animals in our house and fruit and veggies out in the yard, much less a centralized temple to bring them to and hand over to the priests for sacrifice and immolation (nor do I think we're obligated to do so; Christianity explains the change very nicely). And that's my point; we can't follow Ex 34 as it's written down. Only an Israelite could possibly follow the 10 commandments in Ex 34 as intended.
But if you do find an actual Asherah pole somewhere, you know what to do...
That's all well and good, and I don't disagree with the principle, but that text in Ex 34 is talking about actual idols, and specifically Asherah's idols. This wasn't a spiritual command to the Israelites - they were being told to tear down some real idols. This isn't a command that can be followed as written today - there are no Asherah poles. Sure we can recognize the principle of worshiping Yahweh alone, but we still can't follow the text as written. If we're going to be sticklers about the 10 commandments, let's at least try to follow the instructions as written. We can't be sticklers about following the 10 commandments and then immediately start making exceptions and spiritualizations all through the text.
The real point I'm making here is that it's obvious you can't follow the 10 commandments as written. So it seems a little out of place to try to place that requirement on people.
Sure, I agree; Jesus is the Temple, the Church is His body and so the Spirit resides in us. However, we still can't follow Ex 34 as it's written. We can apply some general principles that we see in the actual commands, but there are no Asherah poles. As you point out, we aren't agricultural people - we don't have live animals in our house and fruit and veggies out in the yard, much less a centralized temple to bring them to and hand over to the priests for sacrifice and immolation (nor do I think we're obligated to do so; Christianity explains the change very nicely). And that's my point; we can't follow Ex 34 as it's written down. Only an Israelite could possibly follow the 10 commandments in Ex 34 as intended.
But if you do find an actual Asherah pole somewhere, you know what to do...
We are not talking about judging the Israelites either as a people or individually, we are talking about what God is telling us.
But you can use common sense. Is there something in our world used as they used Asherah poles? If we follow all text literally, we would have to quit our jobs and buy a farm. Do you think God wants us to do that? How about slave treatment to explain justice? Do you think we should throw out all God teaches because we can't follow the letter of the law? We are told not follow law, and we are told not to follow the letter of the law.
Your point seems to be that if you can't follow the letter of the law, it is best to throw out the scripture about the law. That makes no sense.
You throw out scripture? Don't think so.
But you can use common sense. Is there something in our world used as they used Asherah poles? If we follow all text literally, we would have to quit our jobs and buy a farm. Do you think God wants us to do that? How about slave treatment to explain justice? Do you think we should throw out all God teaches because we can't follow the letter of the law? We are told not follow law, and we are told not to follow the letter of the law.
Your point seems to be that if you can't follow the letter of the law, it is best to throw out the scripture about the law. That makes no sense.
Sure, I agree; Jesus is the Temple, the Church is His body and so the Spirit resides in us. However, we still can't follow Ex 34 as it's written. We can apply some general principles that we see in the actual commands, but there are no Asherah poles. As you point out, we aren't agricultural people - we don't have live animals in our house and fruit and veggies out in the yard, much less a centralized temple to bring them to and hand over to the priests for sacrifice and immolation (nor do I think we're obligated to do so; Christianity explains the change very nicely). And that's my point; we can't follow Ex 34 as it's written down. Only an Israelite could possibly follow the 10 commandments in Ex 34 as intended.
But if you do find an actual Asherah pole somewhere, you know what to do...
But if you do find an actual Asherah pole somewhere, you know what to do...
S
A no, its not acording to my Bible[SUP]27 [/SUP]And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He gave itto them, saying, “Drinkfrom it, all of you;[SUP]28 [/SUP]for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured outfor many for forgiveness of sins.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]In the same way He took the cup also after supper,saying, “This cup isthe new covenant in My blood; do this, as often as you drink it, inremembrance of Me.”
"But when you come to the NewCovenant, you have a new kind of observation, not observing God as Creator, notobserving God as Law-giver, but in the New Covenant God is defining Himselfas...what?...Savior. So the New Covenant has its own day, a day in which wefocus on God as our Savior.... Verse 7, “Go quickly and tell His disciples Hehas risen from the dead.” Tell them quickly because there's a lot that's goingto happen in this day. This is right at daybreak, you remember. Before thisevent, Sunday had no place in a Jewish calendar...no important place. None, itwas not identified as a special day in any sense, religiously or socially. Itwas like every other day.
But once the Lord rose from the dead on thefirst day of the week, the first day of the week would never be the same againbecause if you memorialize the creation on the seventh day, and if youmemorialize as it were the Law on the seventh day, you certainly want tomemorialize the resurrection, don't you? If you celebrate God as Creator andGod as Law-giver, you certainly want to celebrate Him regularly and even morejoyfully as Savior." JMac
We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because of the resurrection.
Your obviously fully indoctrinated in false teaching and quite happy in it.
Other wonky Seventh day teachings.
They teach that the proper day of worshipis Saturday, that Jesus is Michael the Archangel, that ultimately Satan willbear all of our sins, that when a person dies he does not exist anymore, thathell is not eternal, and more.
Theyemphasize dietary laws and legalism, they teach you can lose your salvation,that Jesus is Michael the arch Angel.
The last one is heresy!
They insist baptism is required for salvation, that’s addingworks and is a different gospel than what Paul taught. Then there was all thedate settings for the return of Christ. Also Ellen White declared her specialrevelation as having the same inspiration as scripture. Most of the church's founders, including JamesWhite and Joseph Bates, openly rejected the Trinity and the deity of Christ.
The SDA Church did not officiallyendorse a "Trinitarian view" until 1946, and it still fundamentallydistorts the historic doctrine of the Trinity as expressed in the Nicene Creed.
Any of this sounding familiar to anyone?
In Galatians 4:9, “Now that you have come to know God, tobe known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things to which you desire to be enslaved all over again?”
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I don't know why you believe instruction from God is bad. I look forward to God teaching me the ways of life so that I can live.
Now as far as Hebrews 4 goes, you are making it say something that it's not. The Gospel that was preached to them is the same one that is preached us, which is the promise of the coming kingdom. They all looked forward to the promise but died without receiving the promise. Do you believe the people in Joshua's day kept the Sabbath? Do you think that if they believed the Gospel they wouldn't have to keep the Sabbath? What God is saying in Hebrews 4 is that there is a kingdom coming that is good news for the people. The people of old were looking forward to it. This kingdom is a finished work just like creation is a finished work. Why? Because the kingdom of God was in the mind and plan of God as a finished work from the foundation of the world.
Matthew 25:34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
If you put you hope and trust in the promise of the coming kingdom we can find rest in the promise of God.
Hebrews 4 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: “So I swore in My wrath, ‘They shall not enter My rest,’” although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Just like the Sabbath is guaranteed every week that testifies of God's finished work in creation the Gospel of the coming kingdom is also a guarantee.
Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.
There is nothing in these verses that say Jesus removes the seventh day Sabbath. You are just trying to make them say it.
Did you know that the Apostles were preaching the Gospel with Jesus for three years and they didn't even know Jesus was going to be crucified?
Now as far as Hebrews 4 goes, you are making it say something that it's not. The Gospel that was preached to them is the same one that is preached us, which is the promise of the coming kingdom. They all looked forward to the promise but died without receiving the promise. Do you believe the people in Joshua's day kept the Sabbath? Do you think that if they believed the Gospel they wouldn't have to keep the Sabbath? What God is saying in Hebrews 4 is that there is a kingdom coming that is good news for the people. The people of old were looking forward to it. This kingdom is a finished work just like creation is a finished work. Why? Because the kingdom of God was in the mind and plan of God as a finished work from the foundation of the world.
Matthew 25:34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
If you put you hope and trust in the promise of the coming kingdom we can find rest in the promise of God.
Hebrews 4 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: “So I swore in My wrath, ‘They shall not enter My rest,’” although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Just like the Sabbath is guaranteed every week that testifies of God's finished work in creation the Gospel of the coming kingdom is also a guarantee.
Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.
There is nothing in these verses that say Jesus removes the seventh day Sabbath. You are just trying to make them say it.
Did you know that the Apostles were preaching the Gospel with Jesus for three years and they didn't even know Jesus was going to be crucified?
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S
Where are you getting that rubish? I never said anything close, Jesus Christ is fully God and fully man an is co equal and eternal from the begining of time. Col 1:15
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
Col 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things were created through him and for him.
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
Col 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things were created through him and for him.
S
I think you missread Jmacs quote see link for context.
Why Sunday Is the Lord’s Day
Why Sunday Is the Lord’s Day