James' warning letter.

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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#41
You are a day late a dollar short, Israel was already scattered when James wrote..... He says it at the very beginning, he is sending the letter to these people, in the 1st century. Israel has been scattered before Jesus even showed up, with many of the people staying babylon during their captivity. It became even worse after 70AD where even more people were scattered.
So you agree at least that the letter is not a Christian epistle, but a Jewish epistle? Besides, most of the Jews during the time were not scattered. They were living in and around Jerusalem. Yes?
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
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#42
So you agree at least that the letter is not a Christian epistle, but a Jewish epistle? Besides, most of the Jews during the time were not scattered. They were living in and around Jerusalem. Yes?
Not all israelites are jews. But all jews are israelites.

Study the Kingdom of Israel vs Kingdom of Judah. Judah = Jew. Kingdom of Judah had remnants of levites, tribe of judah and benjamin. Tribes of Israel the northern kingdom were largely in apostasy.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,109
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#43
Not all israelites are jews. But all jews are israelites.

Study the Kingdom of Israel vs Kingdom of Judah. Judah = Jew. Kingdom of Judah had remnants of levites, tribe of judah and benjamin. Tribes of Israel the northern kingdom were largely in apostasy.
The term twelve tribes is a reference to the entire nation of Israel, Judah and Israel.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#44
So you agree at least that the letter is not a Christian epistle, but a Jewish epistle? Besides, most of the Jews during the time were not scattered. They were living in and around Jerusalem. Yes?
Its the epistle (gospel) to mankind. No such thing as a Jewish epistle .We walk by faith the unseen eternal

The gospel has nothing to do with the corrupted flesh of any nation .God is not served by the corrupted hand of mankind .He corrupted as the wage of sin the whole creation every rudiment under the Sun

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

What kind of Jew would have to be defined. (two kinds)

Same with the word Israel. Not all Israel are born again inward Jews . Some have the outward flesh but that has nothing to do with salvation The flesh is reckoned as dead it cannot perform any good work .

Christian a more befitting name for the bride made up od all the nations of the world. Christian is the last new name the father used to identify his bride the church.

One bride one gospel Not a gospel for the outward Jew and another for the gentile .

The reformation came it is still here daily doing it works of restoring the government of God in the hearts of mankind.

They were some outward Jews hopping they could use the flesh wild card to become a Christian . The picture ID's did not serve their purpose .

Revelation 2:9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Revelation 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,109
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#45
Not all israelites are jews. But all jews are israelites.

Study the Kingdom of Israel vs Kingdom of Judah. Judah = Jew. Kingdom of Judah had remnants of levites, tribe of judah and benjamin. Tribes of Israel the northern kingdom were largely in apostasy.
Twelve tribes = Jews

Acts 26:
6 And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God, unto our fathers:
7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#46
Twelve tribes = Jews

Acts 26:
6 And now I stand and am judged for the hope of the promise made of God, unto our fathers:
7 Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come. For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.
Twelve apostles = born again mankind. God does not save nations or whole tribes its two walking together in agreement to the one who has the power to work from the inside.

When two. . husband and wife or three. . a whole family gathers together under the authority of His word ...he is there working with them making the burden lighter .

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,109
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#47
Twelve apostles = born again mankind. God does not save nations or whole tribes its two walking together in agreement to the one who has the power to work from the inside.

When two. . husband and wife or three. . a whole family gathers together under the authority of His word ...he is there working with them making the burden lighter .

Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
The twelve tribes is not a reference to Jewish Christians. Do you agree?
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#48
The twelve tribes is not a reference to Jewish Christians. Do you agree?
If the letter was not addressing believers there would be no point for the letter.
And if they were not believers James seems to have missed outlining the plan of salvation to them.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#49
The twelve tribes is not a reference to Jewish Christians. Do you agree?
Two walking together as one. God saves souls not tribes.

Just the opposite. The twelve tribes is a reference to all the Christians. Just as the twelve apostles to represent the Christian saints on this side of the reformation. Together 12 x 12. They make one bride. .. the church, the spiritual house made up of any lively stones ..

The father as promised renamed his bride Israel.. the beautiful city of Christ. (Christian )

Isaiah 62 For Zion's sake will I not hold my peace, and for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, until the righteousness thereof go forth as brightness, and the salvation thereof as a lamp that burneth. And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the Lord shall name. Thou shalt also be a crown of glory in the hand of the Lord, and a royal diadem in the hand of thy God. ...

Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch



Previously temporarily called her Israel to represent one nation .In Acts he revealed the residents of that city prepared as his bride. . .Christian a more befitting name for the bride made up of all the nations of the world ..

Christian with no other meaning added meaning "residents of the city of Christ" prepared as his bride the church .
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#50
If the letter was not addressing believers there would be no point for the letter.
And if they were not believers James seems to have missed outlining the plan of salvation to them.
The nation of Israel will need direction during the tribulation. Hebrews and James will help them see Jesus and endure to the end.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#53
How? which one? Its seems the opposite to me. Do you have a reference?
There are 25 references to the phrase twelve tribes. All of them is a reference to the entire nation of Israel and not to a called out group from that nation.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#55
There are 25 references to the phrase twelve tribes. All of them is a reference to the entire nation of Israel and not to a called out group from that nation.
Nations are used as gates to enter in. Apostles sent out ones used as walls. together one bride called Christian residents of the city of Christ named after her husband Christ .a more befitting name for the bride of all nations or tribes.

It can be seen as a parable the golden measure below.

Revelation 21:2-3 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Revelation 21: 11-15 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.

God saves souls not whole nations He is not a respecter of the corrupted flesh of any nation, or tribe as a family..

You can call her Israel her former name .But I think the father prefers the new name he did name the bride.
 
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#56
The 12 tribes scattered abroad.

Did James call the Gentiles the 12 tribes?
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#57
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith, and faith works by love.

Everything stems from love not faith, for faith comes from love.

Love is greater than faith and hope, for they are not needed in heaven, but love will go on forever.

If a person does not have works then their faith is dead.

And this is not works part time but all the time, for we must love all the time.

Faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen.

So to have true faith is to have the proper perspective of God that He hates sin, and His kingdom which is love.

1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

Paul said he could have all faith so that he could remove mountains, but if he did not have charity then he is nothing.

1Ti 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.
1Ti 6:8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
1Ti 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Paul said if anybody teaches that God blesses them with their wants withdraw yourselves from them.

For the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy, and love is the fulfilling of the law, which if they go by their wants they have erred from the faith for it is not charity.

Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

James said without charity their faith is dead, and a person is justified by works, and not faith alone.

So Paul and James say the same thing that without charity their faith is void.

For love is greater than faith.

1Jn 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

John said without charity then the love of God does not dwell in them, so do not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed, works, and in truth.

1Co 13:4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

Love does not think evil, and does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth to be led of the Spirit acting Christlike.

Which if a person hates sin, and does not want sin, by the Spirit they can abstain from sin, for a Spirit led life will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh, for they have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts, and show the ways of the Spirit and not the flesh.

And God will not let them be tempted above what they are able, but will give them an escape from the temptation so they can bear it, so a saint does not get tempted as hard as the world, and can escape it.

So there is no excuse why a person cannot abstain from sin.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

1Co 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
1Co 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

The Lord knows the people that are led of the Spirit and abstain from iniquity, and they are the ones sealed unto the day of redemption.

2Ti 3:4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

But some have a form of godliness, but deny the power thereof, ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth, for they hold unto sin and believe they are saved by faith.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

We have to have works for they are works of love, and love is greater than faith.

If a person goes by their wants then they have erred from the faith, and their faith is dead, and if they hold unto sin that is not love then no faith.

We are saved by faith, and not by works when we first confess Christ for that is all we can do, but when we receive the Spirit then we have to have works of love to have faith in our life.

Which we know by the hypocrisy among many people that they lack love, but many say they are saved by faith.

James said a person is justified by works, and not by faith alone, and Paul agrees with him.
 
Feb 28, 2016
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#59
Jesus, Paul, James, are ALL in AGREEMENT,
if they weren't, then they would be violating
the UNITY Scriptures...
 
Apr 2, 2020
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#60
The term twelve tribes is a reference to the entire nation of Israel, Judah and Israel.
The term is actually an eschatological reference and has been argued by commentators such as Moo to refer to Christians as an early manner of giving a general audience rather than restricting it to a single cities occupants. The reference is to identify the time period we are living in rather than the people as the only tribes that are identifiable still are Judah and to a lesser extent Benjamin. The other tribes are and were pretty much entirely lost in human terms.