Jesus killed the law causing enmity to cease

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Jan 19, 2013
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Elin said:
Yes, the Gentiles are no longer unclean simply because they are not Jews.

There is no longer a religious basis for enmity between the two.
there is very much a religious basis (several 'religious' reasons)

(not in yahshua hamashiach; but 'religious').
Not in the sense of Judaism.

and most gentiles are still unclean anyway. (not repentant)1/3 of mankind dies then 2/3's of mankind still REFUSES TO STOP WORSHIPING DEMONS (rcc included, and balaam, budhists, islams, etc etc etc) ... and

so they die unforgiven.
As are, and do, most of the Jews.
 
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Jan 19, 2013
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not at all.

the issue is trust in regulations , not regulations --
Jesus rebuked the TORAH teachers, but
told his disciples to keep TORAH, by and in faith and obedience to YAHWEH HIS FATHER.
Jesus told his disciples to keep his law (Mt 22:37-40; Gal 6:2; Ro 13: 8, 9, 10).

JESUS and the disciples always kept TORAH <<<BY FAITH, SIMPLY, LIKE LITTLE CHILDREN>>>.
they just did not TRUST TORAH to save them.
Jesus lived during and under the law.

Yes, he kept it perfectly, and his disciples kept it as well, for they also lived under it and the old covenant.

There is no old covenant nor Mosaic regulations with the new covenant.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Elin said:
Jesus has already established his kingdom in the hearts of the born again (Lk 17:20-21) during the first Roman empire,
which endures forever (Da 2:44).

There can be no other kingdom in time.
So the book of Revelation is irrelevant?
It's not irrelevant. . .being unfulfilled prophetic riddles, it's just subject to uncertain private interpretation.

Many of God's people interpret it to mean things entirely different.

But one thing is certain, whatever the book of Revelation does mean, it will be in agreement with the clear and certain teaching of NT word of God, including Lk 17:20-21 and Da 2:44, where the interpretation of the riddle is given by Daniel.
 
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Jan 19, 2013
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why are the blind so blind ? ? ?

the 2 don't do away with the 10. if someone keeps the 2, they keep the 10. no exceptions.

nothing at all is hard about that.
That's what the NT states. . .to keep the law of love fulfills the Decalogue (Ro 13: 8, 9, 10).
 
Apr 9, 2015
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'the issue is trust in regulations , not regulations --
Jesus rebuked the TORAH teachers, but
told his disciples to keep TORAH, by and in faith and obedience to YAHWEH HIS FATHER.'
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Why WOULD Jesus, who if you want to put it simply, was the Living Torah in the flesh/bone, the Word of God in the Flesh, why would Jesus 'tell' His disciples to 'keep' that and follow it.. AFTER HE FULFILLED it for them? Christ ,was the LIVING TORAH< the Word of God in the flesh, who did what no other man or High Priest could do, fulfill the Law Perfectly in the Flesh.. The Author of the Torah, the Living Word, telling His disciples to 'keep the Torah to fulfill its commands, when He ALREADY did that for them thru His Vicarious Appeasement at the Tree? thru His blood? and thru Faith in His Atoning Work and Perfect Life, Made Righteous thru the Father's Imputation of Christ's Righteousness upon true Salvation and belief on Him, which is the WorK of God, Jesus said... do you see your contradictions? the One Whose Purpose was to fulfill the Law in His flesh, turn around and tell His Disicples they must 'keep the Torah'. and continue to follow it to be kept Righteous'.. One cannot 'claim' that call himself/herself a Regenerated Christian, born again Genuinely.. nope.. loz... smh..... Im a christian but Im working to keep myself 'righteous'.. mmmm A BIG PROBLEM WITH THAT! yikes!
 
Dec 26, 2014
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why would you work to keep yourself righteous? the wicked are permitted to be and continue to be wicked.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Elin said:
Actually it is the spiritual whoredom of unbelief, for which there is no forgiveness.
Surely you're not insinuating that repentance is forbidden.
You're right, I'm not.

But not all whored after other gods.

A remnant believed and was faithful.

And it is still the same today (Ro 9:27, 11:5).

Romans 11:2-4, and 22-24
[SUP]2 [/SUP]God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

[SUP]3 [/SUP]Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Now this is just a question. I am still researching/studying it. And it's a little off topic.

Acts 18:18
[SUP]18 [/SUP]So Paul still remained a good while. Then he took leave of the brethren and sailed for Syria, and Priscilla and Aquila were with him. He had his hair cut off at Cenchrea, for he had taken a vow.
Acts 21:26
[SUP]26 [/SUP]Then Paul took the men, and the next day, having been purified with them, entered the temple to announce the expiration of the days of purification, at which time an offering should be made for each one of them.


Now there is only 1 vow that requires this. And that is the Nazerite vow. Now Paul not only just completes the Nazerite vow, but he does it with others (not only that, but I believe the people he took the vow with, were gentiles the NKJV states the Jews got made because he brought Greeks into the temple when doing this). Well what is the offering made in the Nazerite vow.

Numbers 6:13-18[SUP]13 [/SUP]‘Now this is the law of the Nazirite: When the days of his separation are fulfilled, he shall be brought to the door of the tabernacle of meeting. [SUP]14 [/SUP]And he shall present his offering to the Lord: one male lamb in its first year without blemish as a burnt offering, one ewe lamb in its first year without blemish as a sin offering, one ram without blemish as a peace offering, [SUP]15 [/SUP]a basket of unleavened bread, cakes of fine flour mixed with oil, unleavened wafers anointed with oil, and their grain offering with their drink offerings.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Then the priest shall bring them before the Lord and offer his sin offering and his burnt offering; [SUP]17 [/SUP]and he shall offer the ram as a sacrifice of a peace offering to the Lord, with the basket of unleavened bread; the priest shall also offer its grain offering and its drink offering. [SUP]18 [/SUP]Then the Nazirite shall shave his consecrated head at the door of the tabernacle of meeting, and shall take the hair from his consecrated head and put it on the fire which is under the sacrifice of the peace offering.

This is clearly after Yeshua's and Paul is giving offerings (along with gentiles, still assuming based off of the following verse). Now according to scripture, these offerings are as sacrifices in the temple.

So where does that come into line with all sacrifices are done away with.

P.S.
I understand there is no temple today, but that's completely different.
Good question. . .I was not completely clear on that.

Sacrifices relating to vows were not sin sacrifices.

The sin sacrifices ceased with the once-for-all sin sacrifice of Christ.

To be all things to all men that he might win some to Christ, to those under the law Paul would become as one under the law, although he himself was not under the law (1Co 9:20-21).
 
Apr 9, 2015
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You're right, I'm not.

But not all whored after other gods.

A remnant believed and was faithful.

And it is still the same today (Ro 9:27, 11:5).
God always Reserves a Remnant unto Himself, a remnant according to the Election of Grace... this Based on God , not man... you see that even into Revelation, as a 'remnant' is reserved out of the Great Tribulation, protected in the Wilderness.. these will go into the 1000 year Literal Reign of Christ to repopulate the Earth that has been devasted by the Wrath of God and the wrath of the living devil. *as does He have His Remnant Alive and well Today...-------> His Elect, SOME ARE ON HERE.. indeed! * A remnant according to the Election of Grace*... that usually stirs the man made (working for your salvation) gospel hounds (tares) into a tizzy.. lolz.. cause they are shown Salvation , Its Merits, are Grounded in God's Election and His Grace.. oh Indeed!
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Elin said:
He has fulfilled all prophecy regarding God sending a Messiah.
I agree, He has fullfilled the prophecy of His first coming. The prophets also prophecy about His 2nd coming. Which is what I'm reffering to and stating.

Not all the prophecies are just on His first coming. There are also prophecies of His second coming.
That doesn't negate he has fulfilled all prophecy regarding God's sending of the Messiah, which was the concern, focus and issue with the Jews to whom he was speaking.

You are not applying the Jewish perspective to his words.
 
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Biblelogic01

Guest
Good question. . .I was not completely clear on that.

Sacrifices relating to vows were not sin sacrifices.

The sin sacrifices ceased with the once-for-all sin sacrifice of Christ.

To be all things to all men that he might win some to Christ, to those under the law Paul would become as one under the law, although he himself was not under the law (1Co 9:20-21).
But why would he do this with gentiles, that's my main question on it?

See I don't know if the gentiles did it willingly or if Paul had them do it.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Ahh the bliss of blind grace. No responsibility. No rules (law). No obdience. Just constant reward.

All the above sounds like something taught by the enemy.

Believe God, praise God, love Him, and most of all, show some responsibility in your faith and obey Him,. God bless all in Jesus Christ, amen.
"Blind" grace? Where is that in the Bible?

Misrepresentation of the NT. . .

"Without holiness, no one will see the Lord." (Heb 12:14)
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Ok, so for Yeshua to fullfill the Torah, He had to practice and perfectly follow it (which He did), in Deuteronmy 6 it states that the words of the Lord (the commands that are being given) are to be taught.

Now for Yeshua to fullfill Torah He would have to teach Torah, and not teach against it or just part of it.
Who made that rule?

The duty of teaching the law was given to the priests, of which he was not one.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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But why would he do this with gentiles, that's my main question on it?

See I don't know if the gentiles did it willingly or if Paul had them do it.
He did it in Jerusalem, to gain entrance with the Jews there.
 
Apr 9, 2015
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why would you work to keep yourself righteous? the wicked are permitted to be and continue to be wicked.
so are the ones who Claim Christ , to know Him, yet demand man to follow and adhere to the Law/ Torah etc. to maintain one's Righteousness.. lolz.. those are called 'tares-weeds'. the JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH, Faith in the Sons' completed Work at the Tree, His Perfect Life He Gave for those He would call, to be Sufficient for God the FAther to say, there is My Righteous one! and He does do just that! all the merits on Christ, and His work, Christ's Righteousness Imputed to them, Justified in the Eyes of the FAther, not their ability to claim christ, then try to 'fufill' what He has already Fulfilled.. smh.. so much of that on here.. I guess the Weeds-Tares are definately growing and ripening.. only to a Certain point, then God Himself will start that Combine, time to collect His Good Seed into the Hoppa! the weeds chaff to the Fire! indeed!
 
Feb 21, 2012
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Israel was not righteous. . .no one was righteous (Ro 3:10).
[/COLOR]
I was just setting up a contrast between the OT and the NT . . . :)
But Israel was made righteous by doing the commandments. Deut. 6:25 And it shall be our righteousness, if we observe to do all these commandments before the LORD our God, as he hath commanded us. To the church of God, the body of Christ . . . But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference.
 
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Biblelogic01

Guest
Who made that rule?

The duty of teaching the law was given to the priests, of which he was not one.
I beg to differ on that.
Read all of what I have to say, and then just think on it. My main point is try to think of it from the Pharisees POV in this topic [if thats what you want to call it].

We see in Matthew there comes up the issue of washing hands. And I'm not talking about the issue itself, I'm talking about how it was presented.

In Matthew
Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, [SUP]2 [/SUP]“Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

Note here they did mention Yeshua disciples, not Him. Which means that Yeshua did was His hands. Now on top of that, from my understanding and research, the washing of hands is oral Torah tradition. It is not actual a command in the Torah, the only time Torah really mention washing of hands is when in the tabernacle preparing and offering/sacrifice. So based off of this I do believe Yeshua was also following parts of the oral Torah.


Now for the phrase "tradition of the elders", this was a phrase used by Pharisees only, the Saducees didn't use this wording. So for the Pharisees to use this type of terminology with Yeshua, means that one either Yeshua Himself was a priest of God, or the Pharisees are under the impression that Yeshua was a priest of God.

Now with the religious leaders making this assumption with Yeshua, I would highly believe that Yeshua had some from of priestly anointing.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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Elin said:
The duty of teaching the law was given to the priests, of which he was not one.
I beg to differ on that.
Jesus came to die as a ransom for many (Mt 20:28).

Teaching the law was not his primary assignment.

Read all of what I have to say, and then just think on it. My main point is try to think of it from the Pharisees POV in this topic [if thats what you want to call it].

We see in Matthew there comes up the issue of washing hands. And I'm not talking about the issue itself, I'm talking about how it was presented.

In Matthew
Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, [SUP]2 [/SUP]“Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

Note here they did mention Yeshua disciples, not Him. Which means that Yeshua did wash His hands.
That would be an assumption on your part, that Jesus was eating at the time (Mk 7:1-2, 5), and that he also washed his hands.

Now for the phrase "tradition of the elders", this was a phrase used by Pharisees only,

As the Saducees didn't use this wording. So for the Pharisees to use this type of terminology with Yeshua, means that one either Yeshua Himself was a priest of God, or the Pharisees are under the impression that Yeshua was a priest of God.
Assumption again. . .that it means either one of those.

It means they considered him a rabbi (Jn 3:2; 6:25), not a priest.