Just me and Ken C, How do you understand Gal 3:2-5? (Others may also respond)

[MarcR]

Gal 3:2-5
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
KJV

 

[KohenMatt]

If I may respond.....

Galatians 3 is addressing those who would seek to observe the Law in regards to their salvation or stance before God. It addresses the receiving of the Holy Spirit and being perfected. This mis-application of the Law is very different than those who observe the Law out of a desire to honor God with their lives and to know how to live as He would have us live.

The Law cannot save. It cannot perfect. It cannot make righteousness. It cannot bring the Holy Spirit.

The only thing that can is God's merciful salvation.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

If I may respond.....

Galatians 3 is addressing those who would seek to observe the Law in regards to their salvation or stance before God. It addresses the receiving of the Holy Spirit and being perfected. This mis-application of the Law is very different than those who observe the Law out of a desire to honor God with their lives and to know how to live as He would have us live.

The Law cannot save. It cannot perfect. It cannot make righteousness. It cannot bring the Holy Spirit.

The only thing that can is God's merciful salvation.

In the spirit of what you said, I will add that many (apparently) thought that way during Paul's day.

And when [the Jewish believers in Jerusalem] heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to [Paul], "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law. Acts 21:20​

So I don't think we can say that is wrong. But do bear in mind that GOD was moving away from Israel as a natural nation and on into fulfilling the promise to Abraham of making people from all nations his holy, spiritual nation.

 

[MarcR]

The reason I specifically addressed Just me and Ken C. is that I am interested in how they reconcile their stance on many topics with this passage.

 

[just-me]

The reason I specifically addressed Just me and Ken C. is that I am interested in how they reconcile their stance on many topics with this passage.

Paul, responding in obedience to God went to Jerusalem to preach the good news of Christ. After he arrived, some others came into Paul's company surreptitiously, pretending to be brothers to spy out the situation, because Paul had made it clear that it wasn't important for a Gentile to be physically circumcised. Paul didn't back down concerning Titus' physical circumcision, for he knew that Titus had already been circumcised in heart according to the writings of Moses and Jeremiah.
Deuteronomy 10:16
Deuteronomy 30:6
Jeremiah 4:4

Further, I would like to add, after Paul was arrested to testify of himself and the way he believed concerning the law and the prophets, he backed up his unwavering belief with this statement.

"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets."
​

 

[Is]

Galatians has been referred to as the Chrisitans Magna Carta from the law.

 

[dcontroversal]

This is the result of chapter one...false teachers were preaching saved by faith but kept by works (circumcision)..Paul makes it clear that we are justified by faith without the works of the law (any works) and even calls them foolish for thinking that their justification is made complete by the works of the flesh....our justification stands complete in Christ dia faith.....

 

[dcontroversal]

The reason I specifically addressed Just me and Ken C. is that I am interested in how they reconcile their stance on many topics with this passage.

You ever heard of that old song by Chubby Checker...THE TWIST....IS EXACTLY HOW ONE OF THE TWO LISTED DEALS WITH IT!

 

[just-me]

Paul, responding in obedience to God went to Jerusalem to preach the good news of Christ. After he arrived, some others came into Paul's company surreptitiously, pretending to be brothers to spy out the situation, because Paul had made it clear that it wasn't important for a Gentile to be physically circumcised. Paul didn't back down concerning Titus' physical circumcision, for he knew that Titus had already been circumcised in heart according to the writings of Moses and Jeremiah.
Deuteronomy 10:16
Deuteronomy 30:6
Jeremiah 4:4

Further, I would like to add, after Paul was arrested to testify of himself and the way he believed concerning the law and the prophets, he backed up his unwavering belief with this statement.

"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets."
​

Sorry that was chapter 2 I was referring to. My mistake. Let me take a look at chapter 3:2-5

Works without faith is dead. Faith without works is just as dead. It's that simple. I've said it before more than once. Works of the law mean nothing without faith. Self justification, whether seeking it by the works of the law or any other means, and there are many avenues of works that mean nothing to God, for He looks at our hearts. It's His works, or nothing. One cannot do the works of God without His gift of faith.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Ephesians 2:8

Habakkuk 2:4

1 Thessalonians 3:5

 

[MarcR]

Paul, responding in obedience to God went to Jerusalem to preach the good news of Christ. After he arrived, some others came into Paul's company surreptitiously, pretending to be brothers to spy out the situation, because Paul had made it clear that it wasn't important for a Gentile to be physically circumcised. Paul didn't back down concerning Titus' physical circumcision, for he knew that Titus had already been circumcised in heart according to the writings of Moses and Jeremiah.
Deuteronomy 10:16
Deuteronomy 30:6
Jeremiah 4:4

Further, I would like to add, after Paul was arrested to testify of himself and the way he believed concerning the law and the prophets, he backed up his unwavering belief with this statement.

"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets."
​

Thank you for responding.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Gal 3:2-5
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh [i.e., works of law]?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

This is compliments the above passage:

As you received Christ Jesus the Lord [by faith], so walk in Him [by faith]. Colossians 2:6​

 

[atwhatcost]

Bump!

(I'm hoping Ken will see this since it's Saturday.)

 

[elf3]

I would like to mention that some know kenc and I don't always agree on certain things but I personally I DO NOT think it fair to Ken to specifically "call him out" on this subject. That is an "unChistian" way of placing the spotlight on him. It should have been stated as a general question to anyone.

 

[just-me]

I would like to mention that some know kenc and I don't always agree on certain things but I personally I DO NOT think it fair to Ken to specifically "call him out" on this subject. That is an "unChistian" way of placing the spotlight on him. It should have been stated as a general question to anyone.

The reason he was called out is that we both agree that the law of God is to be understood spiritually. Spiritual motivation is the catalyst of living according to the motive of the spiritual persuasion.

Obviously, there are some who have determined that both of us are incorrect in this train of thought, and that we are anti-grace people teaching against grace. To me it's quite ironic that grace came from "The ONE" law giver, and by attributing both grace and law together, that makes us wrong.

This verse says that KennethC is seeing it right. The question; what is the mind of those that differ with him?

Romans 8:6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The reason he was called out is that we both agree that the law of God is to be understood spiritually. Spiritual motivation is the catalyst of living according to the motive of the spiritual persuasion.

Obviously, there are some who have determined that both of us are incorrect in this train of thought, and that we are anti-grace people teaching against grace. To me it's quite ironic that grace came from "The ONE" law giver, and by attributing both grace and law together, that makes us wrong.

This verse says that KennethC is seeing it right. The question; what is the mind of those that differ with him?

Romans 8:6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

In other words, we receive grace in order to keep the law. Typical sophistry of a sabbath keeper.

 

[elf3]

I know why you were both "called out" but I feel it completely rude to specifically target certain people on a subject. It could have been presented in a much more "civil" way. It should have been presented as a "general" question to all not just a certain "few".

So now by the way this question is posed anyone who reads it now has a biased opinion of a "certain few" which is completely wrong. So now a couple people have a "target" on them making them the object of "flaming arrows". I might not agree with "just me" or "kenc" on certain things but to make them now targets is a wrong way to approach the spreading of the Gospel of Christ with humility.

 

[just-me]

I know why you were both "called out" but I feel it completely rude to specifically target certain people on a subject. It could have been presented in a much more "civil" way. It should have been presented as a "general" question to all not just a certain "few".

So now by the way this question is posed anyone who reads it now has a biased opinion of a "certain few" which is completely wrong. So now a couple people have a "target" on them making them the object of "flaming arrows". I might not agree with "just me" or "kenc" on certain things but to make them now targets is a wrong way to approach the spreading of the Gospel of Christ with humility.

Look on the bright side, because most people in here are quite bright. This is evidence for the level headed and spiritually minded people to realize the true reason for the labeling and stalking. By now, all should be able to clearly see the tactics and the reason. That's a plus.

2 Corinthains 2:10-11
[SUP]10 [/SUP]To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Ephesians 6:12

 

[shotgunner]

Questioning a believer concerning their doctrine does not equate to being in league with Satan.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Questioning a believer concerning their doctrine does not equate to being in league with Satan.

Yep. What we are seeing by some here is what is known as psychological projection. Also known as blame shifting. Where people defend themselves against unpleasant impulses by denying their existence in themselves, while attributing them to others. For example, a person who is rude will constantly accuse other people of being rude.

 

[just-me]

Jesus didn't come to separate some of God's word from us. He came to separate sin from us. Being separated from sin is our choice if we ascribe to ALL of God's words and not just a faction according to our own false doctrines that desire some of God's word to be separated from us.

Make your choice whether you want God's word separated from yourself, or whether you want God's word to separate you form your own sins. Choose all of God's grace by accepting all of His words.