Keep The Commandments

[Wall]

What 10? The ten were given to Moses 400 and some odd year later.

EXOD.34
[28] And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables THE WORDS OF THE COVENANT, THE TEN COMMANDMENTS.

Yes they were. That's what it says right there in Ex.34

GENESIS 26 [3] Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee, AND UNTO THY SEED, I will give all these countries, and I WILL PERFORM THE OATH WHICH I SWARE UNTO ABRAHAM thy father; [4] And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; [5] BECAUSE THAT ABRAHAM OBEYED MY VOICE, and kept my charge, MY COMMANDMENTS, my statutes, and MY LAWS.

And they were givin to Abraham 400 and some odd year earlier. That's what it says in Gen.26

 

[Grandpa]

No one here has ever said we are to keep God's commands on our own strength. Are all the texts I quoted from the NT in the OP wrong that tell us to keep the commandments of God?

If you are looking at the law to obey it you are obviously using your own strength. Even if you say you aren't. You especially. You say you are supposed to take Saturday off for your flesh to rest. You have turned it into a carnal command, like most do. I'm not blaming you I'm just pointing it out. We understand the carnal things the easiest. Such as doing. We don't understand resting in His Finished Work as easily.

If you are abiding in Christ, He grows the fruit in us which is what fulfills the law.

If you are looking at the law to obey it you are not abiding in Christ, by faith. You are abiding in your own self and the knowledge of sin.

Galatians 3:23-26
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Will this faith in the Lord Jesus Christ cause us to be disobedient? Of course not. Our faith establishes the law.

If you look back at the law to obey it you are under it, plain and simple.

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

1 John 2:3 We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

If you keep God's commands isn't that works? What if you don't keep God's commands will you still be saved?

That would not happen. A person who has saving faith would obey God as he grows in faith (the law of faith)

That person would not be unsaved because they did not keep the commands, they would not be saved because they had no faith (faith without works is dead, (Nonexistant)

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

1 John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love each other. Anyone who does not love remains in death.

1 John 5:2 This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG I bet you make the claim that you are already saved

1PETER1
[4] To AN INHERITANCE INCORRUPTIBLE, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
[5] Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto SALVATION READY TO BE REVEALED IN THE LAST TIME.
[9] Receiving the END OF YOUR FAITH, EVEN THE SALVATION OF YOUR SOULS.[10] Of which salvation the prophets have inquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
[13] Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and HOPE TO THE END FOR THE GRACE THAT IS TO BE BROUGHT UNTO YOU AT THE REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST;
[23] BEING BORN AGAIN, NOT OF CORRUPTIBLE SEED, BUT OF INCORRUPTIBLE, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Salvation revealed in the last time
End of your faith....salvation
Hope to the end...grace brought unto you at the revelation of Christ

ROMANS 8 [24] For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?[25] But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

So EG, you claim your already saved so I guess you need not wait patiently for the hope uhhh...that you already see

PSALM 119 [165] Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.[166] LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments.[167] My soul hath kept thy testimonies; and I love them exceedingly.

Salvation! Hope! 10 commandments!


Sorry bout that EG

Don't be sorry.

I have been saved by faith

I have been past from life to death

I have been given eternal life

I have no more condemnation

I have the eternal seal and guarantee of the spirit.

Your either spiritually dead or alive, there is no middle ground.

I actually am sorry for you. God gives you hope.. I guess you do not want it. there is no hope if our eternity is not secured. only wishfull thinking and fear..

I was adopted by my abba father,, not given a spirit of fear.

I can go on and on.

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

If someone has a hard problem with God's commandments read psalms 119 and see how the people of the old testament LOVED them. How can they LOVE them but in the new testament be of no regard? Does that which is good become evil by faith? NO.

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

People may say hey i am not a jew so i dont have to follow all of the commandments! Don't JUDGE ME!!!!!


Please answer this question which God do you profess to serve? If it is the God of the jews did not foreigners who wish to worship the God of abraham, issac, and jacob serve God by the commandments that He gave? Can we, mere mortals, claim to love God by making up our own commandments and traditions? Would that be something that is built on solid ground? The bible says if you Love God keep HIS commandments. It doesn't say if you Love God make up a list of how you love Him your way and He will accept it for He is a God that doesn't know how He wants to be loved.

 

[Laodicea]

That would not happen. A person who has saving faith would obey God as he grows in faith (the law of faith)

That person would not be unsaved because they did not keep the commands, they would not be saved because they had no faith (faith without works is dead, (Nonexistant)

A person who has saving faith would keep the commandments of God as I showed by all the Bible texts from the NT in the OP.

 

[Shiloah]

Do you just not know the answers to the questions? Are you afraid of the faith that is in Christ? Should I ask them one at a time?

Before you come back with your usual ignorance about teaching "disobedience" by not being under the law, is there any disobedience in abiding in Christ? BY somehow not looking to the law, but looking to Christ instead, can that cause disobedience? By not beholding sin, but beholding Christ, will we somehow be off our guard and forget to ask for forgiveness of something? Will we be in any danger by Abiding in Christ and not looking to the law to examine ourselves or increase our "wisdom"? Can Christ do in you greater things than you can by the law?

If you abide in Christ, you will keep the commandments. The first doesn't happen without the second. Then, if you sin, you have your intercessor (obviously Christ). And then you "go and sin no more" as Christ instructs us to do. But the commandments tell us what sin is, so we follow them. Obviously ten times over we only manage to keep the commandments with the help of the Holy Spirit.

 

[tragedy]

Here is my understanding about keeping "commandments."

If the biblical God is supreme, then He is the only one that matters. I think it's safe to say that everyone today knows that the ancient Hebrews failed in keeping or living up to God's standards. I thought to myself, "If I was one of them, how could I ever please God?" The answer to that question was eventually given to me. I thought "Yes of course! The one who was chosen to lead the people (Moses or Joshua) I would have confidently follow. If I had any concerns, I would have asked one of those two men." After all, they were the copies of their (distant, but coming) Messiah. Moses and Joshua pleased God because they fulfilled God's will for themselves. That's what Abraham did. He fulfilled God's will for himself by doing what God called him to do. They took action by faith. So it is with us. God's will for every person is to stay AWAY/AVOID evil i.e. consecrate, sanctify, repent, purify, etc. That, is God's law for EVERYONE. Now I believe that God's will for the believer is different more or less. What matters is that every believer follow/fulfill the will of God. "What does this have to do with keeping commandments?" you say? For one believer, it could be washing the dishes for six days. For another it could be spending lots of time with Him ALL week, etc. Just as long as we stay clean in God's eyes. That's how we obey (fulfill) God's commandments (his will). That's why the Torah of God and the laws of men conflict each other. How can evil man know true justice?

 

[Grandpa]

If you abide in Christ, you will keep the commandments. The first doesn't happen without the second. Then, if you sin, you have your intercessor (obviously Christ). And then you "go and sin no more" as Christ instructs us to do. But the commandments tell us what sin is, so we follow them. Obviously ten times over we only manage to keep the commandments with the help of the Holy Spirit.

That's not how it happened with me. I was not able to keep His commandments. I would not have known Him if I was able to keep the commandments.

There would have been no one I needed to cry out to for help.

I cried out to Him for Help because I was not able to keep His Commandments. He had mercy on me and gave me exceedingly, abundantly more than I could have asked or thought.

I continue to abide in His mercy and forgiveness because I believe in Him. He grows the fruit in our lives. Without Him we can do nothing.

I don't have faith in my ability to keep commandments. I have faith in the Power of the Lord Jesus Christ. I guess I don't have to keep learning over and over that the commandments condemn us. I'm over the condemnation. I know where there is no condemnation. That is in the Lord Jesus Christ.

Galatians 3:23-25
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Haven't you ever read Galatians?

 

[GingerFollowerofChrist]

What is it that condemns people?

The commandments, if obeyed, brought life everlasting. Leviticus 18:5.

But the problem arises when people disobey. When disobedience happen the laws of sin and death take action. The laws of sin and death that state if you sin either you, someone, or something must shed blood in order for you to be forgiven and or justified. So where in the bible did the laws of sin and death get nullified for us? Colossians 2:14. The very passage that people have troubles with is where it states it. Someone may ask how does it state it? Well the laws of sin and death are what stood against people CONDEMNING them. THAT is what it taken to the cross for us! Not all of the commandments given to us by God.


If you would like another passage so that you can have two witnesses here is another.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. romans 8:2[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Through these two passages you may see that it is the laws of sin and death that was truly nailed. Jesus Christ was NEVER a man that was preaching lawlessness![/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]So someone may read galatians and think well what does this all mean then? A good portion of galatians is dealing with LEGALISTIC perversion of God's law. What is legalistic perversion? It is trying to obey God's commandments FOR salvation. In other words trying to EARN your way to heaven instead of believing and repenting and receiving salvation by grace through faith. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The misapplication of scripture is found in leviticus 18:5 that jews were misinterpreting God's word with.


So what does this passage in Galatians 3:23-25 mean? It means what it says.


Before faith came people were kept "under the law", shut up unto faith which should afterwards be revealed. The law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith! After faith has come we are no longer under a schoolmaster!


To break this down lets find out what this is talking about. In verse 24 we read the word "Justified". What do we need justification for? For salvation. The law was their schoolmaster to bring them to Christ Jesus. Since we've been brought to Christ Jesus we aren't under that schoolmaster anymore. But that doesn't say we can disobey God's commandments. As Paul said in romans we can't nullify the law by faith.

What does "under the law" mean? It means to be mastered by sin. Romans 6:14 [/FONT]For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
So as i was trying to explain this i received something. I'm going to try and run this by you. Since the laws of sin and death are what condemned people and kept the under the law would that not be the SAME "schoolmaster" that brought us to Christ Jesus.

Think about it if people knew that the laws of sin and death is what condemned them and stood against them would that not serve as the schoolmaster?

The laws of sin and death are not all of God's commandments.

The laws of sin and death are if you sin either you are going to die or someone, or something, must shed it's blood and die in order for YOU to be forgiven. When Jesus Christ died for mankind that is the way by which mankind is saved. When people are brought to salvation through that schoolmaster of the laws of sin and death and are forgiven later they are no longer under that schoolmaster since Jesus Christ has nailed them to the cross.


Thoughts?

[/FONT]

 

[Grandpa]

What is it that condemns people?

The commandments, if obeyed, brought life everlasting. Leviticus 18:5.

But the problem arises when people disobey. When disobedience happen the laws of sin and death take action. The laws of sin and death that state if you sin either you, someone, or something must shed blood in order for you to be forgiven and or justified. So where in the bible did the laws of sin and death get nullified for us? Colossians 2:14. The very passage that people have troubles with is where it states it. Someone may ask how does it state it? Well the laws of sin and death are what stood against people CONDEMNING them. THAT is what it taken to the cross for us! Not all of the commandments given to us by God.


If you would like another passage so that you can have two witnesses here is another.

because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. romans 8:2


Through these two passages you may see that it is the laws of sin and death that was truly nailed. Jesus Christ was NEVER a man that was preaching lawlessness!


So someone may read galatians and think well what does this all mean then? A good portion of galatians is dealing with LEGALISTIC perversion of God's law. What is legalistic perversion? It is trying to obey God's commandments FOR salvation. In other words trying to EARN your way to heaven instead of believing and repenting and receiving salvation by grace through faith.


The misapplication of scripture is found in leviticus 18:5 that jews were misinterpreting God's word with.


So what does this passage in Galatians 3:23-25 mean? It means what it says.


Before faith came people were kept "under the law", shut up unto faith which should afterwards be revealed. The law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith! After faith has come we are no longer under a schoolmaster!


To break this down lets find out what this is talking about. In verse 24 we read the word "Justified". What do we need justification for? For salvation. The law was their schoolmaster to bring them to Christ Jesus. Since we've been brought to Christ Jesus we aren't under that schoolmaster anymore. But that doesn't say we can disobey God's commandments. As Paul said in romans we can't nullify the law by faith.

What does "under the law" mean? It means to be mastered by sin. Romans 6:14 For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.

So as i was trying to explain this i received something. I'm going to try and run this by you. Since the laws of sin and death are what condemned people and kept the under the law would that not be the SAME "schoolmaster" that brought us to Christ Jesus.

Think about it if people knew that the laws of sin and death is what condemned them and stood against them would that not serve as the schoolmaster?

The laws of sin and death are not all of God's commandments.

The laws of sin and death are if you sin either you are going to die or someone, or something, must shed it's blood and die in order for YOU to be forgiven. When Jesus Christ died for mankind that is the way by which mankind is saved. When people are brought to salvation through that schoolmaster of the laws of sin and death and are forgiven later they are no longer under that schoolmaster since Jesus Christ has nailed them to the cross.


Thoughts?

The 10 commandments are called the ministry of Death and the ministry of Condemnation.

2 Corinthians 3:7-9
[SUP]7[/SUP]But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
[SUP]8 [/SUP]How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
[SUP]9 [/SUP]For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

Romans 3:19-20
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

The Lord Jesus wouldn't preach lawlessness. The Law is our schoolmaster that brings us to Him. Without Him all we have is condemnation, death and the knowledge of our sins pointed out by the 10 commandments which are contrary to us.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

The reason why sin doesn't have dominion over you is because you are under grace. If you go back to the Law sin has dominion over you.

Romans 8:2 [SUP] [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

The Lord Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit. This is Life. There is no condemnation in Christ Jesus.

The laws of sin and death are if you sin either you are going to die or someone, or something, must shed it's blood and die in order for YOU to be forgiven. When Jesus Christ died for mankind that is the way by which mankind is saved. When people are brought to salvation through that schoolmaster of the laws of sin and death and are forgiven later they are no longer under that schoolmaster since Jesus Christ has nailed them to the cross

Exactly what you just said...

What is Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus?

John 15:3-5
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

What is this fruit?

Galatians 5:22-23
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

Do you see that you can be not under the law, not following the law, and still not disobey it?

Do you see how you can have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and not be under the law of sin and death?

 

[Shiloah]

That's not how it happened with me. I was not able to keep His commandments. I would not have known Him if I was able to keep the commandments.

There would have been no one I needed to cry out to for help.

I cried out to Him for Help because I was not able to keep His Commandments. He had mercy on me and gave me exceedingly, abundantly more than I could have asked or thought.

I continue to abide in His mercy and forgiveness because I believe in Him. He grows the fruit in our lives. Without Him we can do nothing.

I don't have faith in my ability to keep commandments. I have faith in the Power of the Lord Jesus Christ. I guess I don't have to keep learning over and over that the commandments condemn us. I'm over the condemnation. I know where there is no condemnation. That is in the Lord Jesus Christ.

Galatians 3:23-25
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Haven't you ever read Galatians?

This does actually fit together. The commandments condemn us because without His grace, we can't keep them. But by His grace, we keep them. In other words, we still keep them by His grace. We don't toss them aside.

 

[Laodicea]

This does actually fit together. The commandments condemn us because without His grace, we can't keep them. But by His grace, we keep them. In other words, we still keep them by His grace. We don't toss them aside.

Yes the verses in Galatians are not saying that the law of God or schoolmaster is done away but we are not under the law to attain righteousness.
Galatians 3:21 KJV
(21) Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

We do not attain righteousness by the law but, by faith in Christ. That is what Paul is saying here, he is not saying the law is done away with. Because there were some in the early church teaching that they had to be circumcised to be saved as shown in Acts 15:1

 

[eternally-gratefull]

A person who has saving faith would keep the commandments of God as I showed by all the Bible texts from the NT in the OP.

Yes. So how could they lose salvation, as many claim, if they are obeying in faith??

 

[Laodicea]

Yes. So how could they lose salvation, as many claim, if they are obeying in faith??

We have been given freedom of choice so what if a person chooses to not follow God anymore?
Romans 11:22 KJV
(22) Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

 

[Cobus]

Are SAVED people perfect? If God says those born of GOD does not and CANNOT sin, is that not salvation COMPLETE?

Or let me ask it as best as I can. I hope this English I use will reach EVERY person...

If God saves a person, or rather SAVED a person..... Is that person perfect? Let us say God saves me right now, andGod said that what He started he will finish... So when is God finished with whom He saves? I think of one Scripture that says he will PRESERVE the SOUL,BODY and SPIRIT .... Blameless! (Blameless for me is perfect, that means that person had a PURE (perfect) SOUL SPIRIT AND BODY...

Also another Scripture says... AS GOD IS SO ARE WE IN THIS WORLD.... Also menas to me AS PERFECT AS ABBA FATHER IS SO ARE WE IN THIS WORLD... Oh there are MANY more Scripture that points to this...

So I ask.... Is a saved man PERFECT as God is PERFECT?

Does a man that sin, EVEN ONCE need salvation? Or can a saved man sin, and be saved again, and sin again and be saved again?.... I think NOT!

We have to determine what it means to be SAVED by God. Can a saved man sin? Or is salvation (the finished product) so holy that sin is not even mentioned....

 

[Cobus]

I know of only ONE THING I obey God. I hate sin! I hate my life here on earth. I hate myself for being a sinner! Is there a God that can change that? I hope Jesus and His Father is the ONE that can change that for me.

I just asked God, Lord can You help me, I hate the person I am. I am lustfull, untruthful, hateful, and VERY false. Can God help me with this? Can he remove this person so far from me, so that I can also love myself? How in the hell, can I love you as myself, if I hate myself for the sinner I am?

How can I love sin in you, and hate it in myself? Look, God has to work a lot harder in/on me, before I would be able to love as He wants me to love....'

"A pure conscience" ... God says.... WOW! Pure conscience.... what is that? If your heart convicts you.... God is more...
WOW! what is that? If my heart will ALWAYS convict me, what is the use of going to God for salvation? If His REST means to be still convicted with a dirty conscience, what is the USE OF GOING TO JESUS?

I do not know how to stop sinning, I do not know how to love myself, so who should I go to? Or is this what life is about, to ALWAYS need saving? Is God a tease, or does He actually REMOVE US FROM EVIL... Does God DELIVER from evil or NOT!