Mark of the beast is sunday laws.

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
In truth, your entire reply here is nothing but fallacious ad hominem to be discarded and constitutes a hypocritical act on your part because you complain about casting stones while engaging in exactly that behavior here in this reply. It's a diversion that's not going to work.

Everything presented by me has been entirely scriptural and based squarely on an orthodox exegesis of scripture which I cited, IS confirmed by the best Bible scholars and Biblical reference materials, and makes perfect sense to educated people like myself. You're making a false assertion in saying otherwise.

This SDA/JV nonsense, on the other hand, is heretical right down to the false prophets and false teachers that invented it. SDA and JV heresy is derived directly from a distortion of God's Word that SDA and JV false prophets and false plagiarizing teachers like Ellen G. White (in the case of the SDA) engaged in and forms the basis for it. Those are SDA's and JV REAL authorities and it's deceitful of you and them to pretend to unsuspecting people that they aren't when you know better. That's called lying by omission.

I don't care if you're a member of the SDA cult or JV cult or not, if you align with their heresy: then you partner with it and this mark of the beast as Sunday worship certainly is a cornerstone of SDA heresy and JV error.

If you were truly educated (I have two masters degrees with an A average one being an M.Div. from a Church of Christ college), you would know this and not falsely assert otherwise.

Now if you have something to say regarding the discussion and are done engaging in ad hominem and making false assertions, that would be great. Otherwise, do us all a favor and take your own stones somewhere else. Thanking you in advance.


Everything presented has been entirely scriptural. Name calling makes no points. Calling people heretical to what the church in general believes makes no points. It all comes down to what Christ says and scriptures says. Throwing stones at SDAers just establishes the fact that your arguments are based on a logical fallacies. You claim that SDAers are cult members, and therefore, everything they say should be ignored. You do not base your arguments on why you believe their interpretation of scriptures regarding the specific argument is incorrect. You are not an authority, though clearly, you think you are.

You make these claims that Paul was speaking of the 7th day, but Paul didn't say that. This is your interpretation as is everything else you've stated. And then at the end again, you wrap up your argument calling 7th day Adventist cult members. The fact the 7th day Adventists believe this has nothing whatsoever to do with this argument! I am not a 7th day adventist and I agree with them on this issue!

Your claim to authority means nothing to me. I do not see that the verses you've presented say what you CLAIM they say. I also am educated, thank you, and I can read for myself. Miles and miles of text does not make your point if it doesn't make sense!
 
C

cfultz3

Guest
No, the confusion continues. It's just finally being questioned.

P.S. Nobody discussed it in scripture because everyone kept the sabbath. Don't you think it would have been majorly discussed if a Law of God had been changed? As if any disciple would have had that authority anyway, to literally blow off what Christ said and teach men to ignore a commandment of God?
Would Jesus has broken His own Sabbath? Yet, He worked on the Sabbath. Wonder why He went against the Law which said that no work is to be done on the Sabbath? Perhaps, the Lord of Sabbath was trying to teach us something.
 
D

danschance

Guest
SDA theology makes about as much sense as a parachute on a school bus.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
In truth, your entire reply here is nothing but fallacious ad hominem to be discarded and constitutes a hypocritical act on your part because you complain about casting stones while engaging in exactly that behavior here in this reply. It's a diversion that's not going to work.

Everything presented by me has been entirely scriptural and based squarely on an orthodox exegesis of scripture which I cited, IS confirmed by the best Bible scholars and Biblical reference materials, and makes perfect sense to educated people like myself. You're making a false assertion in saying otherwise.

This SDA/JV nonsense, on the other hand, is heretical right down to the false prophets and false teachers that invented it. SDA and JV heresy is derived directly from a distortion of God's Word that SDA and JV false prophets and false plagiarizing teachers like Ellen G. White (in the case of the SDA) engaged in and forms the basis for it. Those are SDA's and JV REAL authorities and it's deceitful of you and them to pretend to unsuspecting people that they aren't when you know better. That's called lying by omission.

I don't care if you're a member of the SDA cult or JV cult or not, if you align with their heresy: then you partner with it and this mark of the beast as Sunday worship certainly is a cornerstone of SDA heresy and JV error.

If you were truly educated (I have two masters degrees with an A average one being an M.Div. from a Church of Christ college), you would know this and not falsely assert otherwise.

Now if you have something to say regarding the discussion and are done engaging in ad hominem and making false assertions, that would be great. Otherwise, do us all a favor and take your own stones somewhere else. Thanking you in advance.
Well, I just plain don't agree. I read through everything you posted and I do not agree with your interpretations. That's just all there is to it. I did not say you were a member of some cult; and hence, everything you said should be devalued, as you did the SDAers, of which you have just done again in your response to me. I based my statements on what you said alone.

I think it's very funny that you just did the exact same thing again. I'd barely ever heard of the SDAers before these threads. You're acting as if they alone started this issue or question. I frankly wouldn't care if they did. Again, the question or debate should be based on the argument alone, not on your accusation that these people or anyone for that matter are heretics (in your opinion).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
S

Shiloah

Guest
In truth, your entire reply here is nothing but fallacious ad hominem to be discarded and constitutes a hypocritical act on your part because you complain about casting stones while engaging in exactly that behavior here in this reply. It's a diversion that's not going to work.

Everything presented by me has been entirely scriptural and based squarely on an orthodox exegesis of scripture which I cited, IS confirmed by the best Bible scholars and Biblical reference materials, and makes perfect sense to educated people like myself. You're making a false assertion in saying otherwise.

This SDA/JV nonsense, on the other hand, is heretical right down to the false prophets and false teachers that invented it. SDA and JV heresy is derived directly from a distortion of God's Word that SDA and JV false prophets and false plagiarizing teachers like Ellen G. White (in the case of the SDA) engaged in and forms the basis for it. Those are SDA's and JV REAL authorities and it's deceitful of you and them to pretend to unsuspecting people that they aren't when you know better. That's called lying by omission.

I don't care if you're a member of the SDA cult or JV cult or not, if you align with their heresy: then you partner with it and this mark of the beast as Sunday worship certainly is a cornerstone of SDA heresy and JV error.

If you were truly educated (I have two masters degrees with an A average one being an M.Div. from a Church of Christ college), you would know this and not falsely assert otherwise.

Now if you have something to say regarding the discussion and are done engaging in ad hominem and making false assertions, that would be great. Otherwise, do us all a favor and take your own stones somewhere else. Thanking you in advance.
I also see that you're bragging about your education. I won't stoop to that. The Pharisees were very educated in their time and failed entirely to impress Jesus Christ. Wasn't it He that said He would give understanding to the simple and confound the wise? I have learned enough to at least understand what He said in that regard. Your claim to authority means squat to me. It all comes down to who educated you.

P.S. Church of Christ College pretty much says it all.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Jul 30, 2013
127
2
0
Dang, maybe I missed a law that should obey. Will I go to hell for that? Or should I place mt faith in the work of the cross and not what I can do?
You are not speaking against me. You spoke against the Bible. I never said salvation is by your works. But being saved in Christ, does not release you from obligation to the ten commandments.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid, we establish it "- romans 3:31
"It is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail."- luke 16:17
This theology is presumption that you can count breaking the law of God a very light thing.
What can Revelation 22:14 mean to you?
"Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right unto the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city".
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
Exodus 31:18 KJV
(18) And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Revelation 11:19 KJV
(19) And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.
Revelation 15:5 KJV
(5) And after that I looked, and, behold, the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened:

The tables of testimony are the 10 commandments. Why are the 10 commandments mentioned in the Book of Revelation? They are mentioned as being in heaven, the tabernacle on earth was a copy the original is in heaven. That means the sabbath of the Lord is in there in the book of Revelation. The sabbath of the Lord is written in heaven and seen by John in vision.


Revelation 14:12 KJV

(12) Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

So reading the context what are the commandments of God in this text? Because those who keep these commandments will not receive the mark of the beast.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
Exodus 31:18 KJV
(18) And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
Revelation 11:19 KJV
(19) And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.
Revelation 15:5 KJV
(5) And after that I looked, and, behold, the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened:

The tables of testimony are the 10 commandments. Why are the 10 commandments mentioned in the Book of Revelation? They are mentioned as being in heaven, the tabernacle on earth was a copy the original is in heaven. That means the sabbath of the Lord is in there in the book of Revelation. The sabbath of the Lord is written in heaven and seen by John in vision.


Revelation 14:12 KJV

(12) Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

So reading the context what are the commandments of God in this text? Because those who keep these commandments will not receive the mark of the beast.
Don't know what to say about these scriptures, Laodicea, other than how does one argue with Christ's personal revelation to John?
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
It's a starting point for the serious student. I started collecting scholarly resources years ago which I scanned into pdf format making them searchable. You can search all pdfs at once, by subject folder, or a single resource. This sort of software compliments that type of library perfectly because it gives you easy access to newer resources to compliment the older ones.

But yes, it's an initial investment that most have to seriously sacrifice to receive. The upside; however, is that after the initial investment all subsequent revisions and updates for purchased resources are free forever. :)

So when you purchase a scholarly reference on a topic like Biblical archeology, for example, that is published and maintained by an originator such as Oxford, for example, all future discoveries and subsequent revisions to the product are provided at no further cost.

In the old days, we had to actually repurchase the new edition to get access to the new information (if it wasn't available through a library resource)!


Wow, that is extensive. More than I need. It also seems expensive but not for what you are getting.
 
Dec 21, 2012
2,982
40
0
I totally am convinced that the Law of God should be kept for the Christian. The fact that Jesus died for you was proof that He did not change His law. He could have ommited the law and there would be no more sin. Sin is "the transgression of the law"- 1 John 3:4
And the love of God is keeping His commandments 1john 5:3
If anyone says he knows God but keeps not His commandments, you can be sure that the man is a liar: 1 john 2:4
How can people now claim that the law was abolished when Jesus my Christ and Lord said that it is going to endure even if the earth and heaven will pass? Who is my God? The people of today or my Jesus? Whom am i to believe?
I truly hope you were blessed. Christians who keep the Law cannot get the mark of the beast: revelation 14:12
Amen.
God bless you brother, let's look at the Bible.

Deut 5:12 Keep the sabbath day to sanctify it, as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee.

Deut 5:15 And remember that thou wast a servant in the land of Egypt, and that the LORD thy God brought thee out thence through a mighty hand and by a stretched out arm: therefore the LORD thy God commanded thee to keep the sabbath day.

The word "therefore" Deut 5:15 says I should keep the Sabbath only if I or my ancestors were slaves in Egypt. Sabbath has nothing to do with Gentile Christians and it never has.
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
I'm communicating my credentials in response to your ad hominem attack. That's not the same thing as bragging.

Now you are the one that initially started telling me about your education in post #321 in the same breath you lied about my own. That's hypocritical again of you.

It's apparent to me that you are not well educated as Paul instructed Timothy to be in 2 Timothy 2:15 even though you claimed "I am educated" in post #321 and so have chosen to resort back to making personal attacks. Everything about your behavior in these replies is hypocritical and serves only one purpose: to divert the discussion away from the truth people like myself are sharing.

After Timothy followed Paul's advice in 2 Timothy 2:15, he was not afterwards a Pharisee and neither am I. The "Pharisees" in this discussion are the legalists distorting God's Word with their false condemning Sunday is the mark of the beast nonsense. That would be YOU not me for the purposes of this discussion.


I also see that you're bragging about your education. I won't stoop to that. The Pharisees were very educated in their time and failed entirely to impress Jesus Christ. Wasn't it He that said He would give understanding to the simple and confound the wise? I have learned enough to at least understand what He said in that regard. Your claim to authority means squat to me. It all comes down to who educated you.

P.S. Church of Christ College pretty much says it all.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
Oh, I just thought of yet another denomination or group that keep the sabbath on Saturday: the Hebrew Roots Group! And I'll bet you anything, they have nothing whatsoever to do with the 7th Day Adventists. Oh wait, Sunday keepers have determined them to be an evil cult too. Wow. Wonder why.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
I'm communicating my credentials in response to your ad hominem attack. That's not the same thing as bragging.

Now you are the one that initially started telling me about your education in post #321 in the same breath you lied about my own. That's hypocritical again of you.

It's apparent to me that you are not well educated as Paul instructed Timothy to be in 2 Timothy 2:15 even though you claimed "I am educated" in post #321 and so have chosen to resort back to making personal attacks. Everything about your behavior in these replies is hypocritical and serves only one purpose: to divert the discussion away from the truth people like myself are sharing.

After Timothy followed Paul's advice in 2 Timothy 2:15, he was not afterwards a Pharisee and neither am I. The "Pharisees" in this discussion are the legalists distorting God's Word with their false condemning Sunday is the mark of the beast nonsense. That would be YOU not me for the purposes of this discussion.
Reread my posts. I made no personal attacks. I only accused you of exactly what you're guilty of, and that's of attacking a group or denomination that believes in keeping sabbath on Saturday based not on their arguments in this regard, but on the fact that you believe and others like you that they are members of a cult. You obviously just can't take that, because it's the truth. Then in this post, you say I'm making false accusations about your call to authority based on all your supposed education at the same time you turn around and accuse me of obviously not being educated "enough?"

Obviously, my point went right over your over-educated head.
 
D

danschance

Guest
It's a starting point for the serious student. I started collecting scholarly resources years ago which I scanned into pdf format making them searchable. You can search all pdfs at once, by subject folder, or a single resource. This sort of software compliments that type of library perfectly because it gives you easy access to newer resources to compliment the older ones.

But yes, it's an initial investment that most have to seriously sacrifice to receive. The upside; however, is that after the initial investment all subsequent revisions and updates for purchased resources are free forever. :)

So when you purchase a scholarly reference on a topic like Biblical archeology, for example, that is published and maintained by an originator such as Oxford, for example, all future discoveries and subsequent revisions to the product are provided at no further cost.

In the old days, we had to actually repurchase the new edition to get access to the new information (if it wasn't available through a library resource)!
I think that would be awesome for clergy to have as they need more refernce material more frequently than I do. Very interesting tho. I was considering buying some bible software, but the internet has a wealth of free stuff to keep me busy.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,137
216
63
i'm not convinced the sunday law is the mark of the beast.

Revelation 13

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
if we look at our system we are very much enslaved to the government and money etc...

They could turn off our water and food supply.. they control it via money.

After something catastrophic there will be a window of opportunity to really pull rank on the people.

It could come down to die of hunger and thirst if you do not accept our "man made peace".

No matter what remember it is better to die of hunger and thirst in the flesh than to accept the evil as Good.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
I'm communicating my credentials in response to your ad hominem attack. That's not the same thing as bragging.

Now you are the one that initially started telling me about your education in post #321 in the same breath you lied about my own. That's hypocritical again of you.

It's apparent to me that you are not well educated as Paul instructed Timothy to be in 2 Timothy 2:15 even though you claimed "I am educated" in post #321 and so have chosen to resort back to making personal attacks. Everything about your behavior in these replies is hypocritical and serves only one purpose: to divert the discussion away from the truth people like myself are sharing.

After Timothy followed Paul's advice in 2 Timothy 2:15, he was not afterwards a Pharisee and neither am I. The "Pharisees" in this discussion are the legalists distorting God's Word with their false condemning Sunday is the mark of the beast nonsense. That would be YOU not me for the purposes of this discussion.
If you're going to actually take part in a discussion or debate about keeping the sabbath on Saturday or Sunday without revealing your actual purpose to simply "divert the discussion away from the truth people like myself are sharing" then perhaps you shouldn't make repeated "fallacious ad hominem" attacks on the 7th day Adventists, which once again, have nothing to do with the actual argument.
 
S

Shiloah

Guest
i'm not convinced the sunday law is the mark of the beast.

Revelation 13



if we look at our system we are very much enslaved to the government and money etc...

They could turn off our water and food supply.. they control it via money.

After something catastrophic there will be a window of opportunity to really pull rank on the people.

It could come down to die of hunger and thirst if you do not accept our "man made peace".

No matter what remember it is better to die of hunger and thirst in the flesh than to accept the evil as Good.
Quite honestly? I'm not convinced of that either. But I'm willing to consider it.