Need help with discussion of gays from biblical view
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Maybe it can not be found in the NT literally but I still believe God is still the same yesterday today and will be the same tomorrow. His grace is available for all but in the end those who dont obey will feel His wrath on judgement day.
Proverbs 11:21 ESV
Be assured, an evil person will not go unpunished, but the offspring of the righteous will be delivered.
Proverbs 11:21 ESV
Be assured, an evil person will not go unpunished, but the offspring of the righteous will be delivered.
R
John 9
9 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth.
2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
9 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth.
2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
Yes but still any unrighteous act will have a consequence even today. Not as brutal as stoning but still you will have to live with your bad choices. Sin does not only affect you alone. It is not something that is bad but a blessing in disguise. When good things happen its God's favor. When bad things happen its blessing in disguise, a reminder, or a form of discipline because God already forgave us.
R
Blain we are responsible for our own sins or actions. However, if we are raised in family that has no knowledge of God our teeth are set on edge. Meaning by affiliation are sins are passed down. If your father gives you beer to drink then you will have no problem drinking beer. If your father takes you to a whore at say 14 then you have no problem and even think it's right to sleep with a whore and then it becomes our own sin. However, when you are saved, God becomes your father and these tendencies are done away with and you raise your children in the Spirit of God, but they will need their own salvation for God only has children and not grandchildren. There is no generational curse after coming to Christ for you cannot curse what God has blessed. that is why Paul encouraged the saved spouse to stay with the unsaved spouse so that the children will be protected and even saying "oh wife how do you know that husband won't get saved" for He was giving them the permission to leave their unsaved spouse.
CC this text editor is awful. i had to type this 3 times.
CC this text editor is awful. i had to type this 3 times.
M
Ok ..that's fair..but when you go along with the whole..you was born that way..I'm nor sure they will be looking at things in a real biblical perspective. . We have some members on the forum that came out of that lifestyle and at least one of them agrees with my more direct approach towards the issue in general.
D
Not logical. The OT shows many, many generations. The NT only shows one generation.
And in the OT the generational curse wasn't the same sin as the previous generation. God cursed Esau, but Esau prospered. His descendants, however, were wiped out at the same time. (Edom was Esau's descendents, and to this day there is no logical reason why everyone in that city disappeared.)
And in the OT the generational curse wasn't the same sin as the previous generation. God cursed Esau, but Esau prospered. His descendants, however, were wiped out at the same time. (Edom was Esau's descendents, and to this day there is no logical reason why everyone in that city disappeared.)
In Adam all die, as soon as humans are born they go forth lying by breaking the commandments of God. It’s in the nature of man without the Spirit of Christ.
Liars, as those who commit adultery, murders, fornicators of opposite gender or those called homosexuals who fornicate with the same gender will not enter the kingdom of God.. Parents will not be held accountable for the sins of their own children or that of the neighbors. The potential is there regardless of our upbringing. It just a matter of choice to say yes to sin, and no to our redeemer. No man can serve two masters.The flesh and the Spirit of Christ that does dwell jealously in the believer.
We must say yes to our Redeemer and no to that which he calls sin.No limbo between.
The sin of Homosexuality is no greater nor less then the sin of lying. Are people born to lie? Is there a gene that causes some people to lie?
No.
Too many people try to justify their sins to deceive themselves into accepting their sins as being normal. The Gay gene being a good example.
The main point is not about these people being born Gay, its all about God holding people accountable for the sins they commit.
Do you know what the greatest sin is? What sin is there that cannot be forgiven by God?
I'll tell you. The greatest sin a person can commit is the sin of refusing to accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior! All other sins God can forgive us for, but the sin of disbelief is a sin that will put a person in the Lake of Fire forever!
We are not to focus on if a person is born Gay. We are to focus on has that person accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior!
This is the main issue we are to focus on when talking to Gay people.
No.
Too many people try to justify their sins to deceive themselves into accepting their sins as being normal. The Gay gene being a good example.
The main point is not about these people being born Gay, its all about God holding people accountable for the sins they commit.
Do you know what the greatest sin is? What sin is there that cannot be forgiven by God?
I'll tell you. The greatest sin a person can commit is the sin of refusing to accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior! All other sins God can forgive us for, but the sin of disbelief is a sin that will put a person in the Lake of Fire forever!
We are not to focus on if a person is born Gay. We are to focus on has that person accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior!
This is the main issue we are to focus on when talking to Gay people.
God condemns homosexuality. He calls it a sin not a physical condition one can do nothing about...
1Co 6:9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
1Co 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
Lev 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.
No, people are not "born that way", they choose that way and it is a sin and an abomination.
1Co 6:9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
1Co 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
Lev 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.
No, people are not "born that way", they choose that way and it is a sin and an abomination.
Jeremiah 31:29-31
29 In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge.
30But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.
31Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
We are all held accountable for our own sins...but I do think that how we are raised or taught can lead to us being more likely to choose to sin or not to sin. If people are taught that sin is natural or normal then they might be more likely to choose to sin, but in the end it is ultimately our own decision whether we will sin (eat the sour grape) or not.
I won't be held accountable for my parents sins and they won't be held accountable for mine. My children won't be held accountable for my sins, but I might be held accountable for how I taught them. If I teach my children that sin is natural or okay with God then am I not sinning? The same goes for the gay agenda if we try to justify it in anyway and say that it is natural or people are born that way.....are we not helping them to come up with an excuse to justify that sin?
The bible plainly teaches we are not held accountable for our parents sins, and I think saying that we are born with genes to commit sin is in direct opposition of the word of God.
29 In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge.
30But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.
31Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
We are all held accountable for our own sins...but I do think that how we are raised or taught can lead to us being more likely to choose to sin or not to sin. If people are taught that sin is natural or normal then they might be more likely to choose to sin, but in the end it is ultimately our own decision whether we will sin (eat the sour grape) or not.
I won't be held accountable for my parents sins and they won't be held accountable for mine. My children won't be held accountable for my sins, but I might be held accountable for how I taught them. If I teach my children that sin is natural or okay with God then am I not sinning? The same goes for the gay agenda if we try to justify it in anyway and say that it is natural or people are born that way.....are we not helping them to come up with an excuse to justify that sin?
The bible plainly teaches we are not held accountable for our parents sins, and I think saying that we are born with genes to commit sin is in direct opposition of the word of God.
your point is very good but I think there is a difference in being born into sin which we all are and actions that are sinful. Some of the hardest people to win to Christ are those who think they are good people" Ihave not killed anyone, or hurt anyone. The nature of sin will produce tangibles however, there are good natured people but yet are still sinners who need Jesus.
perhaps i do not yet have the insight and understanding to comprehend this matter, I have seen evidence on both sides on if they are born with such desires or not but as of right now I do not think I have the spiritual maturity to understand the core truth of it and maybe as time goes on God will reveal and teach it to me but as of now this may be a bit to tough of meat for me to chew so I humbly bow out and I am grateful for everyone's help and again I am beyond proud of you all for actually discussing a sensitive subject without fiery words.
Hmm this is very concerning statement I think and i will tel you why the biblical " Evidence " has clearly outlined Gods plan for marriage this is carried over from the Old testament and seen in the NEW. Jesus said HE did not come to take away but to fulfill. Jesus in the Gospel of Matt. chap 5-6 deals with sexual sin in the context of marriage Jesus never in anyway changed Gods plan for man and women relationship or husband and wife HE reinforced it. "The Old Covenant thing" in the context of marriage Jesus did not change but made it very clear the issue.... the heart