Not By Works
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OK.
Maybe my English is really off even though it was my major.
You Always refer to works as not pertaining to becoming saved.
So, again I ask:
WHOM DO YOU BELIEVE IS POSTING ON THIS THREAD THAT IS DOING WORKS TO ACHIEVE SALVATION?
I'm not screaming, I'm trying TO GET YOUR ATTENTION.
You just keep answering with the same copy and paste.
Is that all you know?
Maybe my English is really off even though it was my major.
You Always refer to works as not pertaining to becoming saved.
So, again I ask:
WHOM DO YOU BELIEVE IS POSTING ON THIS THREAD THAT IS DOING WORKS TO ACHIEVE SALVATION?
I'm not screaming, I'm trying TO GET YOUR ATTENTION.
You just keep answering with the same copy and paste.
Is that all you know?
The only reason works play a part in our spiritual salvation is the reason that if we neglect those works,which are works of the Spirit,then we are disobedient to God,for not doing His will,and we can deny those works for we still have a choice after we are saved,for God will not twist our arm to live for Him.
It is a matter of behaving like the man Christ Jesus,which He was obedient to God,and did the will of the Father,and if we do not do that then we are disobedient to not do God's will.
Thy will be done on earth,as it is in heaven,and the angels are not disobedient in heaven,and the ones that were are not there.
We have a choice,so we have to choose to do right,and allow the Spirit to lead us,for if it was all the Spirit,and we did not have a choice,we would never sin again,and we would do works,and not be lazy,and use all our resources for our needs,and the needs of other,without fault,so since we have a choice after we are saved,then we have to make the choice to do right,and if we do not then we are disobedient to do the will of God.
God is not forcing us to do right,for we have to make the choice to do that,and then the Spirit will lead us,so responsibility is laid upon us to keep ourselves right with God,and the Bible says if we do not continue in the goodness of God,we will be cut off.
It is a matter of behaving like the man Christ Jesus,which He was obedient to God,and did the will of the Father,and if we do not do that then we are disobedient to not do God's will.
Thy will be done on earth,as it is in heaven,and the angels are not disobedient in heaven,and the ones that were are not there.
We have a choice,so we have to choose to do right,and allow the Spirit to lead us,for if it was all the Spirit,and we did not have a choice,we would never sin again,and we would do works,and not be lazy,and use all our resources for our needs,and the needs of other,without fault,so since we have a choice after we are saved,then we have to make the choice to do right,and if we do not then we are disobedient to do the will of God.
God is not forcing us to do right,for we have to make the choice to do that,and then the Spirit will lead us,so responsibility is laid upon us to keep ourselves right with God,and the Bible says if we do not continue in the goodness of God,we will be cut off.
Here is a quote from Major Ian Thomas that drives the D.I.Y self-righteousness/holiness mindset crazy that can be in all of us. It can offend us.
Make no mistake about it - the true gospel of the grace of God in Christ is offensive to the religious mind. It is a stumbling block and a rock of offense.
This exposes the "work for salvation" Old Covenant mindset belief system for what it really is and that we all can have in our thinking for various reasons.
All works not "birthed" from Christ on the inside of us is just wood, hay and stubble and will bring no lasting worth to the kingdom of God. He is the Vine - we are simply branches that bear His life to others.
No flesh shall glory in His presence!
Quote:
You may have harnessed the energy of the flesh in an otherwise quite genuine desire to honor the Lord Jesus in your life. The flesh, which has its origin in Satan, will go along with you; to survive, it is quite prepared to engage in every form of Christian activity, even though this may seem to honor Christ.
The flesh will sing in the choir, teach Sunday school, preside at a deacons’ meeting, preach from the pulpit, organize an evangelistic crusade, go to Bible college, volunteer for the mission field, and a thousand other things, all of which may in themselves be otherwise legitimate, if only it can keep its neck out of the noose.
The flesh will threaten, shout, strut, domineer, sulk, plot, creep, beg, plead, or sob, whatever the situation may demand in the interests of its own survival. By any and all means it will seek to cause every Christian to live by his own strength instead of by the power and grace of the Lord Jesus, and to conclude that doing so is actually a good thing!
The characteristic of the spiritually immature is that they are unable to discern between good and evil (Hebrews 5:13-14), and the baby Christian, like the foolish Galatians, “having begun in the Spirit” still tries to be “made perfect by the flesh” (Galatians 3:3).
We must be particularly patient with those whose lack of understanding allows a genuine love for the Lord Jesus to be satisfied with, and sometimes to be quite enthusiastic about, Christian activities involving means and methods which are heavily contaminated by the flesh. These are more deserving of instruction than rebuke, for they are still in their spiritual babyhood.
.....The flesh will seek to produce the most plausible arguments in justification of its own illegitimate activities, even though these activities are only what the Bible calls “dead works” (Hebrews 6:1; 9:14) and not the “good works” which are truly the work of God.
“Good works” are those that have their origin in Jesus Christ, as Christ’s activity is released through your body because you present it to Him as a living sacrifice.
You do this only by faith that expresses total dependence, as opposed to Adamic independence."
Major Ian Thomas: The Way Of The Flesh; from The Indwelling Life of Christ
Make no mistake about it - the true gospel of the grace of God in Christ is offensive to the religious mind. It is a stumbling block and a rock of offense.
This exposes the "work for salvation" Old Covenant mindset belief system for what it really is and that we all can have in our thinking for various reasons.
All works not "birthed" from Christ on the inside of us is just wood, hay and stubble and will bring no lasting worth to the kingdom of God. He is the Vine - we are simply branches that bear His life to others.
No flesh shall glory in His presence!
Quote:
You may have harnessed the energy of the flesh in an otherwise quite genuine desire to honor the Lord Jesus in your life. The flesh, which has its origin in Satan, will go along with you; to survive, it is quite prepared to engage in every form of Christian activity, even though this may seem to honor Christ.
The flesh will sing in the choir, teach Sunday school, preside at a deacons’ meeting, preach from the pulpit, organize an evangelistic crusade, go to Bible college, volunteer for the mission field, and a thousand other things, all of which may in themselves be otherwise legitimate, if only it can keep its neck out of the noose.
The flesh will threaten, shout, strut, domineer, sulk, plot, creep, beg, plead, or sob, whatever the situation may demand in the interests of its own survival. By any and all means it will seek to cause every Christian to live by his own strength instead of by the power and grace of the Lord Jesus, and to conclude that doing so is actually a good thing!
The characteristic of the spiritually immature is that they are unable to discern between good and evil (Hebrews 5:13-14), and the baby Christian, like the foolish Galatians, “having begun in the Spirit” still tries to be “made perfect by the flesh” (Galatians 3:3).
We must be particularly patient with those whose lack of understanding allows a genuine love for the Lord Jesus to be satisfied with, and sometimes to be quite enthusiastic about, Christian activities involving means and methods which are heavily contaminated by the flesh. These are more deserving of instruction than rebuke, for they are still in their spiritual babyhood.
.....The flesh will seek to produce the most plausible arguments in justification of its own illegitimate activities, even though these activities are only what the Bible calls “dead works” (Hebrews 6:1; 9:14) and not the “good works” which are truly the work of God.
“Good works” are those that have their origin in Jesus Christ, as Christ’s activity is released through your body because you present it to Him as a living sacrifice.
You do this only by faith that expresses total dependence, as opposed to Adamic independence."
Major Ian Thomas: The Way Of The Flesh; from The Indwelling Life of Christ
Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God (not the reward of God) is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (not through works) - Romans 6:23.
Ephesians 2:8,9 (AMPC) - 8 For it is by free grace (God’s unmerited favor) that you are saved delivered from judgment and made partakers of Christ’s salvation) through [your] faith. And this [salvation] is not of yourselves [of your own doing, it came not through your own striving], but it is the gift of God; 9 Not because of works [not the fulfillment of the Law’s demands], lest any man should boast. [It is not the result of what anyone can possibly do, so no one can pride himself in it or take glory to himself.] *Does that sound like the gift of everlasting life is rewarded based on your works to you?
In Revelation 22:12, notice that "reward" (not eternal life) is connected with "according as his work shall be." Now read 1 Corinthians 3:13 - each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is. 14 If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; (of reward) but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
In Revelation 22:14, "do His commandments" does not earn us eternal life, but it is evidence that we have been granted eternal life through faith and are born of God. Some translations read, "Blessed are those who wash their robes," which symbolizes those who have been forgiven of their sins through the blood of the Lamb (Romans 3:24-26). *Also see Revelation 7:14.
Those who by faith that have trusted in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation have received Christ's imputed righteousness (Romans 4:4-6; Philippians 3:9). Unbelievers are all in the same boat with those in Revelation 22:15. *You need to be careful not to confuse descriptive passages of Scripture with prescriptive passages of Scripture.
Ephesians 2:8,9 (AMPC) - 8 For it is by free grace (God’s unmerited favor) that you are saved delivered from judgment and made partakers of Christ’s salvation) through [your] faith. And this [salvation] is not of yourselves [of your own doing, it came not through your own striving], but it is the gift of God; 9 Not because of works [not the fulfillment of the Law’s demands], lest any man should boast. [It is not the result of what anyone can possibly do, so no one can pride himself in it or take glory to himself.] *Does that sound like the gift of everlasting life is rewarded based on your works to you?
In Revelation 22:12, notice that "reward" (not eternal life) is connected with "according as his work shall be." Now read 1 Corinthians 3:13 - each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is. 14 If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; (of reward) but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
In Revelation 22:14, "do His commandments" does not earn us eternal life, but it is evidence that we have been granted eternal life through faith and are born of God. Some translations read, "Blessed are those who wash their robes," which symbolizes those who have been forgiven of their sins through the blood of the Lamb (Romans 3:24-26). *Also see Revelation 7:14.
Those who by faith that have trusted in Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation have received Christ's imputed righteousness (Romans 4:4-6; Philippians 3:9). Unbelievers are all in the same boat with those in Revelation 22:15. *You need to be careful not to confuse descriptive passages of Scripture with prescriptive passages of Scripture.
The right to the tree of life is allegorical. He Himself is the tree of Life.
The leaves that are for the healing of the nations if you actually study this, is His body as we go to the nations with the gospel. What He commands is to go. Make disciples. Lift up the Cross that sets men free. Not self works trying to please God. That is bondage.
His work of salvation sets men free from sin and striving to please a Holy God. The Jews couldn't do it by law, and nether will spiritual men for its not our covenant.
We are of the inheritance of Spirit and we do the same works of the spiritual man that Jesus did.
The leaves that are for the healing of the nations if you actually study this, is His body as we go to the nations with the gospel. What He commands is to go. Make disciples. Lift up the Cross that sets men free. Not self works trying to please God. That is bondage.
His work of salvation sets men free from sin and striving to please a Holy God. The Jews couldn't do it by law, and nether will spiritual men for its not our covenant.
We are of the inheritance of Spirit and we do the same works of the spiritual man that Jesus did.
Revelation 22
6And he said unto me, These sayings arefaithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done.
7Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
8And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. 9Then saith he unto me, See thou do itnot: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.
10And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 13I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
16I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
17And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
Nothing regarding trusting in the works of the cross only..
Nothing about those being rejected for putting the cart before the horse..
no remark about being unbelieving and evil for working..
Blessed are they that do His Commandments.. not cursed as some say...
So when all said and done.. it comes down to who was a Faithful servant... who heard and believed? Who set their heart to be perfect as He taught.. who set their heart to do His work?
Who believed His Testimony?
He Gave His blood for remission of sins... to enforce the New Covenant of GOD.
6And he said unto me, These sayings arefaithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done.
7Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book.
8And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. 9Then saith he unto me, See thou do itnot: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.
10And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. 11He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. 13I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
16I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
17And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
Nothing regarding trusting in the works of the cross only..
Nothing about those being rejected for putting the cart before the horse..
no remark about being unbelieving and evil for working..
Blessed are they that do His Commandments.. not cursed as some say...
So when all said and done.. it comes down to who was a Faithful servant... who heard and believed? Who set their heart to be perfect as He taught.. who set their heart to do His work?
Who believed His Testimony?
He Gave His blood for remission of sins... to enforce the New Covenant of GOD.
