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May 12, 2017
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Hi BillyG, pardon me but this is faulty reasoning; a true born again believer would never let these things happen; if they do would you not question if they were ever truly saved. Many people can pretend to be saved; but the lust of the world and the pride of life drags them away; they were never truly saved to begin with, and rooted and grounded in God's word.
There is no unforgivable sin

God bless.
How does a believer not do things that lead to apostasy? Not a trap, but certainly need you to reply....

You base the they were never really saved on 1 verse out of 1 John, right? show me more...please....
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
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thanks for the civil discourse my brother...I am going to wait for a bit and then I will.
I assume thanks for the civil discourse my brother means thanks for asking mate and I'll get back to later.

If I was English I suppose my response would be "Why thank you my fine fellow, fancy a spot of tiffin whilst one discusses the finer matter of the detail"

Mind you I'm not English but is Scottish born in the Gorbals. If I was to express it in the Glaswegian way I would probably get banned:)
 
May 12, 2017
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Correction: there is no unforgivable sin except, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit; all other sins are forgiven and a true Christian will never forsake his faith or God. If he does he was not save to begin with.

The time to edit my post ran out excuse me please.
What is Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit to you? It is getting evident based on your absolute contradicting statements here, you may not fully understand what Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit really is and why it is unforgivable...
 

Limey410v2

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2017
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I agree with parts of this, however to compare satan to human beings is really the epitome of apples and oranges.

satan did not have satan to tempt him. Humans did. I think God recognizes this fact, and that is why He became a HUMAN, not a an angel, or nephilim, to die for OUR iniquity.

So now that I'm getting a little controversial, I'm going to throw out the possibility that satan may have been tempted BY humans. How? Why?

Most people believe satan was jealous of Adam's creation and election to rule over the world. While I think that's true, I'm going to submit there may be a far greater temptation, that he, and his followers miserably failed at, and is why they are reserved in judgement.

As an Angel you have unbelievable power, access to the Heavenly Father, eternal life in joy and bliss, but ONE thing you DO NOT have as an Angel is the ability IN HEAVEN to procreate! ( Yes I went there lol).

The temptation to leave their "Heavenly estate" and Procreate with human women, was too great. Notice how Jude couples the SEXUAL SIN of Sodom, to the SEXUAL SIN of the fallen Angels:
6 And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day; 7 as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them IN A SIMILAR MANNER ​TO THESE, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.


But I absolutely agree with you that the self-same lie, that you can be like god, is what tempts people away from Salvation through Jesus Christ.

I know there are quite the few here that highly offended with even the suggestion that fallen Angels mated with human women.
I'd say to them, it's not a Salvation issue, and I love you.
But the fall occurred either before Adam or a short time after Adam, there were no other humans to tempt the fallen angels. Or am I missing something? (Always a possibility)
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
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God felt we deserved it.....otherwise Jesus would not have laid down his life....
Psalms 103:14
14 For He knows our frame;
He remembers that we are dust.

Psalms 103:8-13
8 The Lord is merciful and gracious,
Slow to anger, and abounding in mercy.
9 He will not always strive with us,
Nor will He keep His anger forever.
10 He has not dealt with us according to our sins,
Nor punished us according to our iniquities.
11 For as the heavens are high above the earth,
So great is His mercy toward those who fear Him;
12 As far as the east is from the west,
So far has He removed our transgressions from us.
13 As a father pities his children,
So the Lord pities those who fear Him.
 
May 12, 2017
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I assume thanks for the civil discourse my brother means thanks for asking mate and I'll get back to later.

If I was English I suppose my response would be "Why thank you my fine fellow, fancy a spot of tiffin whilst one discusses the finer matter of the detail"

Mind you I'm not English but is Scottish born in the Gorbals. If I was to express it in the Glaswegian way I would probably get banned:)
Aye, ya got me laddy...I will be speaking with ya about it soon...
 
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NoNameMcgee

Guest
God felt we deserved it.....otherwise Jesus would not have laid down his life....
did he feel we deserved it?

thats why Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners?

because we deserved it?


(please if i sound rude im not trying to offend, i just.... am not sure i agree thats how he felt)
 
May 12, 2017
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did he feel we deserved it?

thats why Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners?

because we deserved it?
Why do you feel you do not deserve grace and salvation and then tell people you do not deserve it? what is your motive in saying and thinking that you do not deserve Grace or what Jesus did for you...not a trap, just a conversation...
 

Limey410v2

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2017
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Why not focus more on true doctrine and getting rid of false doctrine my friend?

Instead of attempting to hold on to heresy.

I posted about those breakin the rules on CC, posting hypergrace videos & quoting hypergrace writers.

Why do you want me to stop that?

Are you hypergrace too?
I have zero problem with shooting down false doctrine. I do it all of the time. That would be my suggestion to you to talk about the disagreements. However you chose to attack the person. I have a problem with that my brother.
 
May 12, 2017
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Correction: there is no unforgivable sin except, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit; all other sins are forgiven and a true Christian will never forsake his faith or God. If he does he was not save to begin with.

The time to edit my post ran out excuse me please.
my time ran out too...

so please define a "true" Christian....and then tell us how you define what makes a "True" christian and then finally how they differ from a "Christian'....

Oh yeah, almost forgot...is a "true" Christian a son?
 
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NoNameMcgee

Guest
Why do you feel you do not deserve grace and salvation and then tell people you do not deserve it? what is your motive in saying and thinking that you do not deserve Grace or what Jesus did for you...not a trap, just a conversation...
no motive

i just dont feel like anything i have ever done on my own is worth anything of value

including forgiveness

and i have come to see...
even if i have repented and been delivered from many sins

and maybe even used to help others...

its by the Holy spirit...

i dont see how i could deserve it
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
did he feel we deserved it?

thats why Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners?

because we deserved it?


(please if i sound rude im not trying to offend, i just.... am not sure i agree thats how he felt)
​I agree, hope it was a typo, sort of takes away the whole meaning of Grace
 
May 12, 2017
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no motive

i just dont feel like anything i have ever done on my own is worth anything of value

including forgiveness

and i have come to see...
even if i have repented and been delivered from many sins

and maybe even used to help others...

its by the Holy spirit...

i dont see how i could deserve it
We must always attempt to see ourselves how God sees us....not how Satan would like us to feel or see ourselves as...

Have you ever forgiven......yourself?

We talk big about forgiving others, but forget to forgive ourselves...only by learning and forgiving ourselves to we ever truly understand how deserving we are...

You are worthy Son....God thought enough about NNM that he put a plan into motion, because you are worth it to him....

The Bible says there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus....none...never...nada...

Forgiving ourselves leads us out of false humility and into deeper relationship....
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
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did he feel we deserved it?

thats why Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners?

because we deserved it?


(please if i sound rude im not trying to offend, i just.... am not sure i agree thats how he felt)
Hi NNG

Your not being rude at all. You are just talking about what you feel or understand and willing to discuss.
Nothing wrong with that at all.

I would say yes he did feel we deserved it, after all he created us.

Before Jesus went to the cross he asked the Father "If it is possible please let this cup pass me by, but according to your will let it be done"

I would say yes he felt we deserved it because when Jesus hung on that cross he said

"Father forgive them for they don't know what they are doing"
"My God my God why have your forsaken me"
Then he gave up his last breath.

My thoughts are that if we did not deserve it then he would have wiped us out.
 
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NoNameMcgee

Guest
We must always attempt to see ourselves how God sees us....not how Satan would like us to feel or see ourselves as...

Have you ever forgiven......yourself?

We talk big about forgiving others, but forget to forgive ourselves...only by learning and forgiving ourselves to we ever truly understand how deserving we are...

You are worthy Son....God thought enough about NNM that he put a plan into motion, because you are worth it to him....

The Bible says there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus....none...never...nada...

Forgiving ourselves leads us out of false humility and into deeper relationship....
maybe youre thinking he felt i was WORTH it

but not that i DESERVED it?