Ok putting aside the Gnostics for the moment, well no let's not because into today's church there is false teaching.
Are you vexed because you feel people are using John to say that believers can lose salvation, or they never believed or because you feel accused of easy believism?
Not being obtuse I promise, just trying to understand fully what you are saying.
Are you vexed because you feel people are using John to say that believers can lose salvation, or they never believed or because you feel accused of easy believism?
Not being obtuse I promise, just trying to understand fully what you are saying.
I believe personally, it is spiritually, emotionally and intellectually dishonest of any saint to use 1 John 2.19 apologetically as a proof test of salvation or no salvation...I say this because the context of 1 John 2.19 having anything to do with who is saved or not saved, salvation, losing salvation and salvation in general simply is not there....
I say this same thing about 1 John 4.1-4...Please do not get on a prayer line or altar counseling and ask someone if they believe Jesus came in the flesh as a test to see if they are demonized or not...
I view 1 John 2.19 and most of 1 John as a warning letter, teaching me how to discern against false teachers with a spirit of antichrist....and most of it it tells me that those such people are not believers and are never going to be believers and has zero to do with testing salvation of people...
That is why I fight people on 1 John 2.19...I have seen first hand how many people have been broken by someone claiming they were never really saved to begin with.....and use that verse to justify their judgement....not discernment...big difference in the two...