Not By Works

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joefizz

Guest
As pertaining to salvation there is "thinking" you are "saved" and "knowing" you are "saved".
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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Who knows he may not have a denomination probably another rogue rebel philosopher determined to be right.
No, I suspect he IS MORMON, because I have heard him say things that I have only heard from Mormon Missionaries. And he KNOWS he will be banned if he admits he is Mormon.
 
J

joefizz

Guest
No, I suspect He IS MORMON, because I have heard him say things that I have only heard from Mormon Missionaries. And he KNOWS he will be banned if he admits he is Mormon.
well I wouldn't know I don't much about the mormon faith except that it's very "shaky" allowing people to do whatever without shame,and urging them to do things for others for "things and favors" in return instead of "actually care" for one's neighbors.
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
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Then we are saved by works of righteousness which we have done, We are either saved or we are not saved, if we have to maintain salvation by works, we are eventually saved by works.
You are right. God declared Abraham had faith, and then Abraham went right out there and proved he had faith by his works. If Abraham had not accompanied his faith with good works, his faith would have died. So in essence it is good works that completes or perfects you faith. You last statement is surely correct.
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
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I know that if my salvation is contingent on my abilities as a filthy, imperfect, sin ridden piece of dirt, then there is no "Good News" as far as I'm concerned.

"Dear Lord, thank you for bestowing your awesome grace upon my spiritually dead existence and saving my soul from eternal damnation. And though all my thoughts and ways are finite and weak, and I am unable to fathom the spiritdual realm in any possible way, I appreciate you for sounding the starting gun. Now step aside as I show you how perfectly I can live in a spiritual and mental tormenting prison while I press on focusing on my abilities, and looking to you when I may need you because I have faith in both of us. Maybe you could watch closely, and let me show you how it's done. Thank you for this opportunity Lord, for my self righteousness will conquer my doubts and fears. In Jesus' name...Amen"
Remember always

God loves you as much as he loves Jesus.
Jesus said that.
You are the apple of his eye.

Never will he leave you or forsake you.
You are a saint, not a sinner.

We are not a piece of dirt, yet being made from dirt he knows that

Psalms 103:7-18
7 He revealed his character to Moses
and his deeds to the people of Israel.
8 The Lord is compassionate and merciful,
slow to get angry and filled with unfailing love.
9 He will not constantly accuse us,
nor remain angry forever.
10 He does not punish us for all our sins;
he does not deal harshly with us, as we deserve.
11 For his unfailing love toward those who fear him
is as great as the height of the heavens above the earth.
12 He has removed our sins as far from us
as the east is from the west.
13 The Lord is like a father to his children,
tender and compassionate to those who fear him.
14 For he knows how weak we are;
he remembers we are only dust.
15 Our days on earth are like grass;
like wildflowers, we bloom and die.
16 The wind blows, and we are gone—
as though we had never been here.
17 But the love of the Lord remains forever
with those who fear him.
His salvation extends to the children’s children
18 of those who are faithful to his covenant,
of those who obey his commandments!
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
2,854
113
You are right. God declared Abraham had faith, and then Abraham went right out there and proved he had faith by his works. If Abraham had not accompanied his faith with good works, his faith would have died. So in essence it is good works that completes or perfects you faith. You last statement is surely correct.
Good works do not complete your faith.
Good works show you have faith.

Abraham works were as a result of faith.

So what do you think the good works Abraham did to complete his faith and when
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,258
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Go back and read ALL MY POSTS, I have told you the TRUTH, so many times and you PATHETICALLY REJECTED THEM ALL.
Hi VCO, here is one of your responses to benhur;

Your Quote:
SALVATION COMES FIRST.
After you are SAVED, GOD's LOVE poured into our hearts by the HOLY SPIRIT, will produce a harvest of good works.

Benhurs Quote:
"If you choose not to walk in the good works that Christ has prepared for you ahead of time, then what?"

benhur will ask you a fictitious question which will never happen like, (not walking in Gods good works), and then he asks you, What then?
I mean seriously not walking in the works God prepared before hand? His question is nonsense because his fictitious story would never happen.

And he does this little word trickery over and over and over. Some people are not seeing his deceitfulness.

Deceivers are very good at what they do, a pity.

God bless!
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
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if someone believes
has been baptized by the Holy spirit

but not baptized in water

and this someone sins

but still believes

if this someone dies

in the middle of performing a sinful deed

anything from a white lie
to murder

doesnt matter

if they die performing this deed while believing IN Jesus Christ as their Lord and savior
born again
baptized of the Holy spirit but not yet in water


is this person saved in your belief system
If, If, If, only God knows.
 

star

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2017
905
874
93
Eternal salvation; Sealed by the Holy Spirit; Unbreakable because it is the Work of God in a born again believer.



Philippians 1:6
6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.


John 5:24
24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.































6 And I am sure of this, that he who began ha good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
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No, I suspect he IS MORMON, because I have heard him say things that I have only heard from Mormon Missionaries. And he KNOWS he will be banned if he admits he is Mormon.
And what words are those exactly?
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
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Good works do not complete your faith.
Good works show you have faith.

Abraham works were as a result of faith.

So what do you think the good works Abraham did to complete his faith and when
complete or prove is the same thing.
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
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Eternal salvation; Sealed by the Holy Spirit; Unbreakable because it is the Work of God in a born again believer.



Philippians 1:6
6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.


John 5:24
24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.































6 And I am sure of this, that he who began ha good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.
You mean we don't get EL the second we believe?
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
2,854
113
well I wouldn't know I don't much about the mormon faith except that it's very "shaky" allowing people to do whatever without shame,and urging them to do things for others for "things and favors" in return instead of "actually care" for one's neighbors.
Actually I think it's the opposite.
Very works orientated and baptism saves.
That is why they get baptised for those who have died but were not baptised before they died.

I'm sure VCO will correct me but if memory serves me we were spirits in heaven before we were born.
Then we are sent the earth.
Whilst here on earth we will do works and when we die we will go to heaven.
But there are 3 realms and we will live in one based on our works.

I'm not fully sure they believe in the deity of Jesus.

Brother VCO is probably more learned then me.
So I leave it up to him to clarify and expand
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
63
Hi VCO, here is one of your responses to benhur;

Your Quote:
SALVATION COMES FIRST.
After you are SAVED, GOD's LOVE poured into our hearts by the HOLY SPIRIT, will produce a harvest of good works.

Benhurs Quote:
"If you choose not to walk in the good works that Christ has prepared for you ahead of time, then what?"

benhur will ask you a fictitious question which will never happen like, (not walking in Gods good works), and then he asks you, What then?
I mean seriously not walking in the works God prepared before hand? His question is nonsense because his fictitious story would never happen.

And he does this little word trickery over and over and over. Some people are not seeing his deceitfulness.

Deceivers are very good at what they do, a pity.

God bless!
So God prepares works for you to do and then puts some kind of implant in your head that makes you do these works or your head will eventually explode? Does God force men to do the works he has prepared for them? Does God force men to have EL with Him?
 
N

NoNameMcgee

Guest
If, If, If, only God knows.
but i thought you said you believe john 3 :16.......


they believe in Jesus as their Lord and savior

they have been born again.... baptized by the Holy Spirit

why would only God know?

what else is required for salvation?

John 3:16
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


:unsure:
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
2,854
113
complete or prove is the same thing.
Not really.

When was Abrams faith completed?
Was it completed when he was Abram or Abraham?

When as Abraham he was willing to sacrifice Issac (his second child)
Or when he was Abram and God told him to pack his bags from the country he was living in and trust him to go to the country he had called him to go to?
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
2,854
113
So God prepares works for you to do and then puts some kind of implant in your head that makes you do these works or your head will eventually explode? Does God force men to do the works he has prepared for them? Does God force men to have EL with Him?
No he does not implant in our heads, he gives us the Holy Spirit, implants him in us to do good works.

That's why Jesus had to go back to heaven, so that the Holy Spirit would come.
Our comforter and HELPER.
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,986
2,854
113
but i thought you said you believe john 3 :16.......


they believe in Jesus as their Lord and savior

they have been born again.... baptized by the Holy Spirit

why would only God know?

what else is required for salvation?

John 3:16
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


:unsure:
Works works works, baptism baptism baptism.
More works works works.
Be baptised for remission of sins.

If we need to baptised for remmision of sins then do we need to be baptised again when we sin?
 
N

NoNameMcgee

Guest
Works works works, baptism baptism baptism.
More works works works.
Be baptised for remission of sins.

If we need to baptised for remmision of sins then do we need to be baptised again when we sin?
(y)
what we need is Jesus
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
8,828
2,710
113
well I wouldn't know I don't much about the mormon faith except that it's very "shaky" allowing people to do whatever without shame,and urging them to do things for others for "things and favors" in return instead of "actually care" for one's neighbors.
The most dangerous part of talking to a MORMON, is they USE Christian Terms, but mean something totally different than we mean. One day I confronted two Mormon missionaries in my drive way, and the Holy Spirit gave me the answers to their FALSE STATEMENTS, including Book, Chapter and Verse. (I confronted them in my drive way, because I knew that it said in 2 John, that we were NOT to Invite them into our homes, because in doing so, we were participating in their EVIL.) That amazed even me, because I had almost NO bible memorized. After they made a False Statement, out of my mouth would come "BUT that contradicts what GOD said in . . ." and I would quote the appropriate scripture, accurately. Finally after about the fifth time that the Holy Spirit inspired, "BUT that contradicts what GOD said in . . ."; he stated, "But I do not see why that Matters, because, everyone knows the Bible is FULL OF CONTRADICTIONS." . . . ( SOUND FAMILIAR? ) . . .
I instantly came back, "Maybe your bible is, BUT MINE HAS NO CONTRADICTIONS AT ALL." As they kept on trying to proclaim their False Doctrine, I finally said, "You know there is only one thing wrong with believing what Joseph Smith taught, IF YOU DIE WHILE BELIEVING IT, YOU WILL CERTAINLY GO TO HELL."

OH MY, did that get a major REACTION out of them. One of them jumped on his bicycle and was out on the street waiting for his buddy to catch up. The other jumped on his bicycle and peddled around and around me, shouting, "I can't believe you are pronouncing us to Hell." He repeated that at least 4 times, while riding around and around me. It did not end there, they took off from my apartment and rode to the Post Office. They new I was a Mail Carrier, and they new my Post Master was a Mormon. They tried to get me FIRED, and John my Post Master, said he could not do that. BUT, he then Called the head Chaplain where my Volunteer Prison Ministry was, and TRIED to get the head Chaplain to FIRE ME. The next time I was due to go out to the Prison, the head Chaplain told me all about it, LAUGHING ALL THE TIME, and said, "Boy you sure know how to RILE UP two Mormon missionaries."