Not By Works

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VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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What are fruits of the spirit?
You should know that.

They are Lifestyle Characteristics.

Galatians 5:22-23 (HCSB)
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith,
23 gentleness, self-control. Against such things there is no law.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
9,310
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he Gospel is Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.

This is God’s loving invitation to be transferred into the kingdom of His dear Son. The kingdom of God.

It is also a command that must be obeyed, in which God’s Spirit is available during the preaching of those sent to announce the Gospel, to empower the lost unto salvation.

The Spirit empowers those who are sent with the word of truth, the Gospel of our salvation, in which those who obey through the Spirit, are born again and cleansed from their past sins.


Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


JPT
THIS is NOT the Gospel unto Salvation. I believe THIS is what is at the root of the error this poster has, which has caused such strife and dissension with those that solely trust in Jesus for Salvation. He believes his repentance is what saves him.

This is THE Gospel unto Salvation.
1 Corinthians 15 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Risen Christ, Faith’s Reality
15 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you THE GOSPEL which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He was seen by [a]Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have [b]fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.

The Gospel unto Salvation is encapsulated again in
Romans 10:9-10 New King James Version (NKJV)
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The repentance, is turning from our dead works as a means of Salvation. By not repenting from our dead works and NOT solely trusting in Jesus, we make null and void Christ's Sacrifice. This is a VITAL distinction because repenting of our sins as a means of Salvation sounds good, and we should repent of our sins, BUT JESUS is What and Who saves us.

So remember THIS passage when hearing a Gospel that has a little truth in it, but isn't really THE Gospel unto Salvation.

Galatians 1:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
821
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That verse does not say future sins are forgiven!
It most certainly does say that. If someone trusts and remains in that trust (abides), and grows in that trust, this is the only thing necessary. From start to finish it is all through trust. Saints don't become saints in any other way. There IS no growth in virtue except through trust. All the hard work in the world cannot accomplish any of it. Saved through trust, grow through trust, gain the virtues through trust, sins covered through trust, temporal provision through trust, receiving of the Holy Spirit through trust.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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No, you are wrong, the Motivation WILL be LOVE, if you are Born Again.

Exactly.

However Love = Obedience.


“If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15


24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24



24 For all who obey his commands find their lives joined in union with him, and he lives and flourishes in them. We know and have proof that he constantly lives and flourishes in us, by the Spirit that he has given us. 1 John 3:24 TPT



JPT
 
Oct 31, 2015
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Where does that kind of love come from?

“You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”



8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law. 11 And do this, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep; for now our salvation is nearer than when we first believed. Romans 13:8-11




JPT
 
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15 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you THE GOSPEL which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He was seen by [a]Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have [b]fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.

  • that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


Paul personally "taught" them that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


The Gospel of the kingdom does mention that:

He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


But the Gospel He was sent to preach by Jesus was plainly recited for us in Acts 26, as recounts His meeting with Jesus on the road to Damascus:


Words of Christ in red -


12 “While thus occupied, as I journeyed to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests, 13 at midday, O king, along the road I saw a light from heaven, brighter than the sun, shining around me and those who journeyed with me. 14 And when we all had fallen to the ground, I heard a voice speaking to me and saying in the Hebrew language, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.’ 15 So I said, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said,

‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. 16 But rise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to make you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen and of the things which I will yet reveal to you. 17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, 18 to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’


19 “Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, 20 but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance. Acts 26:12-20



Please read these words from the Lord who commisioned Paul -


  • to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins


Please read these words of Paul, stating what He did in reponse to His commision from Jesus -


  • I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance.



Repent means to turn to God in submission to Him.


Repent is how we receive the forgiveness of sins -

  • in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins

Repent is how we obey the Gospel.



Jesus send them out to preach the Gospel -



7 And He called the twelve to Himself, and began to send them out two by two, and gave them power over unclean spirits. 8 He commanded them to take nothing for the journey except a staff—no bag, no bread, no copper in their money belts— 9 but to wear sandals, and not to put on two tunics. 10 Also He said to them, “In whatever place you enter a house, stay there till you depart from that place. 11 And whoever will not receive you nor hear you, when you depart from there, shake off the dust under your feet as a testimony against them. Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!”12 So they went out and preached that people should repent. 13 And they cast out many demons, and anointed with oil many who were sick, and healed them. Mark 6:7-12




The Day of Pentecost -

Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:38


again


Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, Acts 3:19



The way we demonstrate our obedience to the command repent is to confess Jesus as Lord.


Again, Repent means to turn to God, in which we turn away from Satan as our lord and master, by confessing Jesus as Lord.



By this act of obedience to the Gospel call to repent, we are transferred out of the domain of darkness into the kingdom of God: The kingdom of His dear Son.



13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. Colossians 1:13-14


  • to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins: Jesus
  • but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God,: Paul



JPT
 
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3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, 4 he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, 5 useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself. 1 Timothy 6:3-5
 
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31 Jesus said to those Jews who believed in him, “When you continue to embrace all that I teach, you prove that you are my true followers. 32 For if you embrace the truth, it will release more freedom into your lives.”

33 Surprised by this, they said, “But we’re the descendants of Abraham and we’re already free. We’ve never been in bondage to anyone. How could you say that we will be released into more freedom?”

34 “I speak eternal truth,” Jesus said. “When you sin you are not free. You’ve become a slave in bondage to your sin.
John 8:31-34 TPT
 
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16 Don’t you realize that grace frees you to choose your own master? But choose carefully, for you surrender yourself to become a servant—bound to the one you choose to obey. If you choose to love sin, it will become your master, and it will own you and reward you with death. But if you choose to love and obey God, he will lead you into perfect righteousness. Romans 6:16 TPT


But if you choose to love and obey God, he will lead you into perfect righteousness.




JPT
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
9,310
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JPT thank you for your response. As a talk show host I sometimes listen to says, I'd prefer clarity over agreement. And you have made clear you do not believe the simple Gospel unto Salvation message.

As I previously stated, the repentance is that of DEAD WORKS.

  • I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance.

The turning to God is repenting of your dead works and then you are made a NEW creation, born again, THEN we will do works befitting that repentance.

Paul EXPLICITLY proclaims what THE GOSPEL is 1 Corinthians 15.

Romans 10 tells us the TWO elements, CONFESS with your mouth. So what are we confessing? We are confessing that we are lost sinners in desperate need of a Savior to pay for our sin, and that Jesus Christ IS LORD. The second is BELIEVE in our heart that God has raised His Son to life.
WE can only see the confessing part. We cannot see people's heart. That is why we should not assume people's eternal position, but rather, examine our OWN heart to see if god has made us new.

John's epistles tell us how we can KNOW we are His, and that boils down to loving all, but especially the Brethren.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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  • that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. 6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. 7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. 8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


Paul personally "taught" them that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


The Gospel of the kingdom does mention that:

He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.


But the Gospel He was sent to preach by Jesus was plainly recited for us in Acts 26, as recounts His meeting with Jesus on the road to Damascus:


Words of Christ in red -


12 “While thus occupied, as I journeyed to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests, 13 at midday, O king, along the road I saw a light from heaven, brighter than the sun, shining around me and those who journeyed with me. 14 And when we all had fallen to the ground, I heard a voice speaking to me and saying in the Hebrew language, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.’ 15 So I said, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said,

‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. 16 But rise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to make you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen and of the things which I will yet reveal to you. 17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, 18 to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’


19 “Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, 20 but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance. Acts 26:12-20



Please read these words from the Lord who commisioned Paul -


  • to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins


Please read these words of Paul, stating what He did in reponse to His commision from Jesus -


  • I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance.



Repent means to turn to God in submission to Him.


Repent is how we receive the forgiveness of sins -

  • in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins

Repent is how we obey the Gospel.



Jesus send them out to preach the Gospel -



7 And He called the twelve to Himself, and began to send them out two by two, and gave them power over unclean spirits. 8 He commanded them to take nothing for the journey except a staff—no bag, no bread, no copper in their money belts— 9 but to wear sandals, and not to put on two tunics. 10 Also He said to them, “In whatever place you enter a house, stay there till you depart from that place. 11 And whoever will not receive you nor hear you, when you depart from there, shake off the dust under your feet as a testimony against them. Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!”12 So they went out and preached that people should repent. 13 And they cast out many demons, and anointed with oil many who were sick, and healed them. Mark 6:7-12




The Day of Pentecost -

Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Acts 2:38


again


Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, Acts 3:19



The way we demonstrate our obedience to the command repent is to confess Jesus as Lord.


Again, Repent means to turn to God, in which we turn away from Satan as our lord and master, by confessing Jesus as Lord.



By this act of obedience to the Gospel call to repent, we are transferred out of the domain of darkness into the kingdom of God: The kingdom of His dear Son.



13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. Colossians 1:13-14


  • to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins: Jesus
  • but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God,: Paul



JPT
here is what you are saying- we are saved by faith, proven by good works/obedience , then, if we have enough faith, do enough good works, then God grants us grace.

in my, ( and others ) opinion is this- most of us do our jobs, then we get our pay. many transfer this thinking into their relationship with God. it is logical. it makes sense.

but, this is NOT God's way. God's way is - by grace, through faith, for good works. it is NOT of ourselves, it is a gift of God.

so, you have this out of order, according to what you say.
 

star

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,519
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North Carolina
You deliberately left a very important word from verse 28.

Why?


Verse 28 begins with the word “and”.

Verse 28 is the result of obeying verse 27.


27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. John 10:27-28


Eternal comes at the end of a life of hearing His Voice, which means hearing and doing what is heard, and following Him.


Those who “hear”, follow Him and do not become lost.


Those who become lost, have returned to being sinners.


4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. 6 And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ 7 I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.
Luke 15:4-7


Lost = Seperated from God. Dead to God.




JPT

You "assume" I deliberately did this, I deliberately am thus and so. You are "supposing" more than you should.
 

star

Senior Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,519
1,984
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North Carolina
Nothing I've stated is reflected in your accusations.

Here's something novel for you to do: Apologize to the sister for your insults; end asserting things no one has said as you've done above.

JPT has not pointed out in direct context where I insulted him/her. Whenever or if I ever insult someone, the insult will be plan and simple.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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Romans 10 tells us the TWO elements, CONFESS with your mouth. So what are we confessing?

We are confessing Jesus as Lord.


This is the command of the Gospel, which says "Repent", for the kingdom of God is here.


Repent means to turn to God in submission to His rule and kingdom as Lord.


Repent is the call to submit to God as our Lord.


The way we obey [the obedience of faith] is by confessing with our mouth Jesus as Lord, the One who we now will obey as our Lord, our God, our Master, our King.


We all are under the rule and domain of Satan as his slave because of our sin and disobedience to God, which has seperated us from Him.


The call of the Gospel is to repent: Turn to God [Be reconciled to Him] and submit to Him as our Lord.


If be believe that Jesus is Lord, then we obey the call to turn to Him and confess Him as our Lord.


This is how we obey the Gospel.




JPT
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
8,631
4,386
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actually, the word repent means to change one's mind, or change the inner man, or to fell sorrow at sin.

the word repent means much more than behavior modification.

honesty please. use the whole definition, not just the small part that pushes works salvationism.
 
Oct 31, 2015
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here is what you are saying- we are saved by faith, proven by good works/obedience , then, if we have enough faith, do enough good works, then God grants us grace.

Absolutely not.

It's not even close to what I have been saying.


I ask you to please, discuss with me what I say, and not what I do not say.


Most everyone here, states what I do not say, then proceeds to condemn me and what I teach, based on what I do not say.


Here is what I have said, and now plainly say again:

  • No one is saved [born again; regenerated] by works.
  • We are saved [born again; regenerated] by grace, through faith.

Which means we are saved [born again:regenerated] by obeying the Gospel.


3 For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another. 4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. Titus 3:3-7


  • He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,


again



6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Thessalonians 1:6-8


  • in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ


again


22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


  • you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit




JPT
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
8,631
4,386
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Absolutely not.

It's not even close to what I have been saying.


I ask you to please, discuss with me what I say, and not what I do not say.


Most everyone here, states what I do not say, then proceeds to condemn me and what I teach, based on what I do not say.


Here is what I have said, and now plainly say again:

  • No one is saved [born again; regenerated] by works.
  • We are saved [born again; regenerated] by grace, through faith.

Which means we are saved [born again:regenerated] by obeying the Gospel.


3 For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another. 4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. Titus 3:3-7


  • He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,


again



6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Thessalonians 1:6-8


  • in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ


again


22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 1 Peter 1:22-23


  • you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit




JPT
what you just said here is salvation is based on obedience. that is 100% false. in Titus 3, which you quoted, Paul says " not by works of rightiouness we have done, but according to His mercy, he saved us".

not we will earn salvation if we obey. obedience is a result of salvation. not a cause.

unsaved people have little or no interest in following God's instructions. if you care about them, and do your best to obey them, that means you ARE saved, because if not , you would not care...…….
 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
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You should know that.

They are Lifestyle Characteristics.

Galatians 5:22-23 (HCSB)
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith,
23 gentleness, self-control. Against such things there is no law.
Yes I do. And what do the fruits of the spirit lead to? They lead to fruits of the KOG. What are fruits of the KOG. They are people who have been served in many different ways and because of that service, they have been converted to a belief in Jesus Christ and the KOG has expanded.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,850
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Exactly.

However Love = Obedience.


“If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15


24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24



24 For all who obey his commands find their lives joined in union with him, and he lives and flourishes in them. We know and have proof that he constantly lives and flourishes in us, by the Spirit that he has given us. 1 John 3:24 TPT



JPT
Now you are closer to the TRUTH than you have every been.


HE is NOT interested who can obediently fulfill his COMMANDS as a WORK, like the Israelites did.

HE is ONLY interested in THOSE who can (WITH THE HELP OF THE HOLY SPIRIT) LOVE HIM with the Purest form of absolute LOVE there is.

Only the BORN AGAIN, with the HOLY SPIRIT in their HEARTS, can LOVE like that.

Matthew 22:36-39 (HCSB)
36 “Teacher, which command in the law is the greatest?”
37 He said to him, “Love the Lord your God with all your
heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.

38 This is the greatest and most important command.
39 The second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself.


The ONLY MOTIVE for OBEDIENCE THAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO GOD, IS PURE LOVE, (expecting nothing in return).

That Blows Prosperity Theology, clean out of the water, and makes it a FALSE DOCTRINE.

YES, there are heavenly rewards, like Crowns. But it is HIS decision who has earned it, and it cannot be the MOTIVE for LOVING HIM.


NOW apply that reasoning to this VERSE:


John 14:15 (HCSB)
15 “If you love Me, you will keep My commands.


If that makes SENSE to you NOW, it is the Holy Spirit inside you.

If you just decided to LOVINGLY make Jesus Christ your personal LORD, meaning MASTER;
welcome to the family of GOD!
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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I simply believe you can lose your salvation. But I can still call you a brother in Jesus because you do believe in Jesus.
Will you agree that when YOU ARE SAVED, the HOLY SPIRIT enters your heart?


John 14:16-17 (ASV)
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may be with you for ever,
17 even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you.


See it? Those who you thought lost their Salvation, never had it in the first place, OR THE HOLY SPIRIT WOULD STILL BE THERE.

Salvation is not something you have to KEEP. JESUS CHRIST AND THE FATHER has got it securely in their hands:

John 10:25-30 (HCSB)
25 “I did tell you and you don’t believe,” Jesus answered them.
“The works that I do in My Father’s name testify about Me.
26 But you don’t believe because you are not My sheep.
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever!
No one will snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all.
No one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.
30 The Father and I are one.”