Not By Works

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benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
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Hey Benhur, the branches that are "cut off" are "false believers", "hangers on", like Judas Escariot.

You are insulting our dear Savior Jesus Christ over and over again as if the cross is insufficient to keep us saved.
Shame on you for repeating a false gospel over and over on an international forum.
Judas Escariot was never in the vine of Christ. The true vine is for only believers. Judas was not a believer, so he was not in the true vine.
 

BaptistBibleBeliever

Well-known member
Sep 9, 2018
2,244
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Illinois
"I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ" (Galatians 1:6-10).
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
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Anaheim, Cali.
Good works does have a part in keeping you saved. But good works on its own will not save you. It is Jesus that saves you, not your works alone. But Jesus is not going to save you in his kingdom, unless you continue to abide in him and he in you, and you continue to produce fruit for his kingdom. If you stop producing fruit he will prune you and purge you and help you to produce more fruit. If you find it too dificult to be engaged in the work of the Lord, then you willl not have EL with the Lord, it is just that simple. Saying I believe and doing what I believe are light years apart in the application of the word of God.

So I believe that good works alone will not save you, but saying I believe in Jesus Christ, and saying you have faith in Christ, and saying you trust in Jesus Christ, but have not good works or little good works for Jesus Christ will result in you branch being cut off, or pruned, or purged sharply to get you to come back into the vine and start producing fruit that will lead to EL.
love is the first fruit, Love is the first fruit, Jesus's 1st command ment Is Love God with all you've got and second is love thy neighbor as thyself! No ifs', ands' or buts When the Holy spirit came to me it filled my heart with love. If you don't feel it, you've got some praying to do!
 
N

NoNameMcgee

Guest
Shame on me for telling you that we must be engaged in the work of the Lord? You are, I believed engaged in the work of the Lord, why the resistance?

I hope one day you come to the truth...
😔
 

BaptistBibleBeliever

Well-known member
Sep 9, 2018
2,244
1,032
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I hope one day you come to the truth...
😔
"Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds" (II John 1:9-11).
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,463
113
Anaheim, Cali.
The most often quoted scripture about salvation has got to be John 3:16 but read all the way to 3:20. It never says whosoever works but rather believes. Good works are good, not argument be Jesus died for the lazy too. That's not an excuse to be lazy but in Gods house there are many room which Jesus went to prepare for us. Works may well have an effect on which one we get but we won't be thrown into the lake of fire for being weak, lazy or stupid. For god so LOVED the world. There's the 'L' word again.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
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Judas Escariot was never in the vine of Christ. The true vine is for only believers. Judas was not a believer, so he was not in the true vine.
"Judas Escariot "was never in the vine" of Christ" (This is a false statement)

This is a false statement, Judas Escariot was absolutely, "in the vine" he was one of Jesus twelve disciples. You are twisting God's word to make it say what you want it to say and there are many bible scholars that would disagree with your statement. Our Heavenly Father will discipline His own Children but He will never "cut us off", you are misinterpreting, John15:2, to your shame.

You are trying to prove that a "True born again believer" can lose their eternal salvation and the bible is clear that God will not lose one of his sheep, not one. And our eternal salvation is "a gift" you cannot work for a gift.

John15:2
He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes so that it will be even more fruitful.

benhur you are pushing a "false gosple"



 

benhur

Senior Member
Feb 8, 2018
1,534
121
63
I think that is a way you can look at how good works is part of the equation. But tell me what rewards are given in heaven after you have be given EL? This is a real question, I am interested in knowing.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
36,116
13,440
113
He was also possessed. The Holy Spirit did not dwell within him. He was a fake.
True...Jesus knew who was going to betray Him, and said that person (Judas) was not clean. Jesus called Judas a son of perdition, meaning, Judas was doomed to destruction.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
36,116
13,440
113
I think that is a way you can look at how good works is part of the equation. But tell me what rewards are given in heaven after you have be given EL? This is a real question, I am interested in knowing.
As it is written: "What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard, and what no human mind has conceived" -- the things God has prepared for those who love him--
 

BaptistBibleBeliever

Well-known member
Sep 9, 2018
2,244
1,032
113
67
Illinois
I know that you feel like we need to be engaged in the Lord's work. I know you are engaged in the Lord's work, so why the resistance?
Until you come to the place under the conviction of the Holy Spirit that there is absolutely nothing you can do to either gain salvation or keep salvation in your own accord you will NEVER understand the things you seek. God is not going to give you the key to His treasure storehouse of heavenly wisdom until you come to Him as a sinner; condemned, unclean and undone and receive at His hand the free gift of eternal life.

When you are a new creature you'll understand. But until you do, and as long as you preach a works-based other gospel - I will report every thing you post that contradicts the Word of God. Yes, it is that important. I hope that others that name the name of Christ will follow suit.
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
2,904
2,259
113
Shame on me for telling you that we must be engaged in the work of the Lord? You are, I believed engaged in the work of the Lord, why the resistance?
You are pushing a gospel that say's we must work to keep ourselves saved. That is a false gospel it is Jesus who saves and keeps us saved.

What you are saying is that Jesus' death on the cross was not sufficient to keep us save that he needs a little extra help that is an insult, To pretend that you do not know what everybody is talking about adds injury to insult.

You are so proud of your works but so so lost and why do people think your gospel is unbelievable?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,959
4,072
113
What do think it means when God cuts off the branch and takes it away. Do you think that could do with you not getting EL with him. It is a scriptural metaphor for what it takes to lose your salvation. Being cut off the true vine means you are no longer in line for EL.

If you do not produce fruit for the KOG, you will not be in the KOG. IOW you will not have salvation in the KOG.

You are counting all kinds of people, who truly are NOT Born Again Christians, even though they are regular attenders to our worship service. ONLY BORN AGAIN BELIEVERS go to heaven, it says so in John Chapter 3. Matthew 7, HE EXPLAINS that You must KNOW HIM, intimately, personally, with DEEP LOVE FOR HIM more than anyone else, before you can claim you are a Born Again Christian. Even in Matthew Chapter 7, HE SAYS:

Matthew 7:20 (NKJV)
20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.


John 12:24 (CSBBible)
24 Truly I tell you, unless a grain of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains by itself. But if it dies, it produces much fruit.


NO AND's, IF's, BUT's, or MAYBE's. IT IS A GIVEN, or they have NEVER HAVE BEEN BORN AGAIN, even if they sit in PEWS every Sunday.
YOU think they are BORN AGAIN, only because you see them sitting on a PEW every Sunday or Saturday.

Sitting on a Pew every week, does not make you a Born Again Christian, any more than sitting in a Garage would make you a Car.

You have to have actually surrendered your life to Christ OUT OF LOVE FOR HIM, before HE is your LORD of your Life. That is why I have been telling you, that you do not understand the first thing about Born Again. Sure we know Lots of People who sit in our PEWS, who have NEVER BEEN SAVED (PAST TENSE), but we want them to be there, because it says:

Romans 10:17 (NKJV)

17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.


John 15:5-6 (NKJV)
5 I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.
6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. [ 🡹 They are not a true Christian.]


You are COUNTING the unsaved SITTING IN OUR PEWS. They TRULY ARE NOT IN THE VINE, just because they are sitting in a PEW.

That is WHY this verse is 100% TRUE:

1 John 2:19 (NKJV)
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us,
they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be
made manifest, that none of them were of us.


You are counting every so-called Christian that are our PEWS, but the BIBLES SAYS FEW FIND IT.

The Bible SAYS:

Matthew 7:13-14 (NKJV)
13 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it.
14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.


HE IS NOT CUTTING THOSE WHO ARE IN THE TRUE VINE (.who abides in Me, and I in him.), BUT RATHER THOSE WHO NEVER PRODUCES FRUIT, AND THOSE IN THE VINE WILL ALWAYS PRODUCE FRUIT.

Mark 4:20 (NKJV)
20 But these are the ones sown on good ground, those who hear the word, accept it, and bear fruit: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred."

The Seed shown on the Hardened Path are those who rejected CHRIST.

The Seed shown on Sown on Stony Ground, and the Seed Sown among Thorns, are TWO TYPES of NON-Born Again Church Goers, who were NEVER SAVED in the First Place that HE specifically mentioned in Mat 7:20-23. ONLY THOSE OF GOOD SOIL PRODUCE FRUITS.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
8,268
5,463
113
Anaheim, Cali.
What do think it means when God cuts off the branch and takes it away. Do you think that could do with you not getting EL with him. It is a scriptural metaphor for what it takes to lose your salvation. Being cut off the true vine means you are no longer in line for EL.

If you do not produce fruit for the KOG, you will not be in the KOG. IOW you will not have salvation in the KOG.
I think it is another way of saying, separates' the sheep from the goats
baaaa!
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,959
4,072
113
I believe that you must believe in Christ,
have the baptism of the Holy Spirit
,
and become a new creature in Christ. I believe this new creature with the guidance of the Holy Spirit will do good works unto the Lord that have been given from the Lord to accomplish. I believe that through the grace of Jesus Christ one is saved in the KOG.

I believe in keeping the law of Christ, which is to cloth the naked, feed the poor, visit the imprisoned, take care of the widow and her children, seek justice for all.

Is this teaching false doctrine, and if it is, get me banned from this forum. You go do try it TT.

Flash: everything I have said is in the bible. Very hard to ban a person from a Christian chat room for teaching from the bible.


Could you please in your own words, explain what you meant by that EXPRESSION IN RED above?
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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What do think it means when God cuts off the branch and takes it away. Do you think that could do with you not getting EL with him. It is a scriptural metaphor for what it takes to lose your salvation. Being cut off the true vine means you are no longer in line for EL.

If you do not produce fruit for the KOG, you will not be in the KOG. IOW you will not have salvation in the KOG.
Your wasting your time posting your working for drivel to me pal.....the context is bearing fruit, not salvation.....
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,366
113
Hey Benhur, the branches that are "cut off" are "false believers", "hangers on", like Judas Escariot.

You are insulting our dear Savior Jesus Christ over and over again as if the cross is insufficient to keep us saved.
Shame on you for repeating a false gospel over and over on an international forum.
Amen.....when he states that good works keep you saved he is peddling a working for false gospel....Cainologist drivel....!!