Not By Works

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

Noooo dont your needed here sis even if your just a witness like the good witness youve been so far sis

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

I say keep up the good works yesi my lions......................

FranC · May 12, 2017

Hi MMD

I respect you and like your posts, but I cannot go on and on like you guys do. I have WORK to do!!! (JK)

As you know, I really dislike using Greek. Not because I know nothing about it, but because we have to rely on Strong's.
None of us have any initials after our names, so why can't we just use the Language we know?

It seems to me it's enough to talk about what we talk about. There's only one word I like to go to for the Greek:
BELIEVE. It MEANS SO MUCH.....

So. 2 Peter 2:20
I'm sure BillG will also be reading along and this is also for him.
IN CONTEXT. Famous words. Peter is talking about false Teachers. The chapter is called "The Rise of False Teachers"

And my oh my, is OSAS EVER FALSE!!!!

verse 9 tells us that God is able to save the godly from temptation.
verse 13 and 14 is speaking about ungodly persons who entice unstable souls
verse 19 these false Teachers promise the unstable souls freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption.
verse 20 for if AFTER they have escaped the defilement of the world by the knowledge of our Lord and SAvior Jesus Christ

AFTER means something came before.
BEFORE they had escaped the defilement of the world
By the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and Savior

Joseph did not KNOW Mary till after Jesus was born.
You know Greek, what does KNOW mean in the Greek???
It is an INTIMATE knowledge. A salvific knowledge.

Now what happens?
They are AGAIN entangled in them --- the defilements of the world --- and are overcome.
They're overcome --- they give in to the defilement.
Thanks for looking up in Strongs what defilement means -- I kind of knew it already.

SO
They (I don't care who) were LOST
They became SAVED
Then they were LOST again

It's very plain to see.
But speak about twisting scripture...
Some are expert at this.

One more thing before I go:

ADAM

He was born again. I think so, What say you? He knew God and spoke to Him and walked with Him in the cool of the garden.

Adam disobeyed God. DISOBEYED.

What did God do? Did he tell him, it's OK. You're good forever.

NO! God banished Adam from the Garden.

SO

Adam was saved
And then he was lost.

God is the same Yesterday, today and Tomorrow.
Or is He???

If He is, then I believe we could still become unsaved.

And the sealing of the Holy Spirit.
I'm tired of talking about this.

Sealings could be undone.
Ask any King who lived in those days.

And anyway, we're sealed for as long as we want to be.

Rev. 3:20 Jesus is knocking at the door. Gently. He's NEVER GOING TO BREAK IT DOWN.

Also, check out Revelation 21:27 and Revelation 22:12

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

join me in my favorite prayer song... fran c

this is war sis.. and your needed the works of god are to believe so works do obtain salvation ............hope ya like opera...

[video=youtube;_ak9rTRuEJg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ak9rTRuEJg[/video]

Grace777x70 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

Ariel can speak for herself.

I believe the scriptures teaches that the new creation in Christ - the one born of God cannot sin because that is where Christ dwells by the Holy Spirit. - created in righteousness and holiness.

1 John 3:9 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

This verse here in 1 John 3:9 says the same thing basically as 1 John 5:18...it says that the one born of God cannot sin. I don't believe the new creation in Christ can sin as 1 John 3:9 and 1 John 5:18 speaks about.

It is definitely in the present tense which means "doing a sin now".

Present tense is always present tense. Whether it is one sin or a thousand sins. I don't believe the new creation in Christ where Christ dwells can be contaminated or touched by sin.

What happens to our spirit where Christ is joined as one with us when we sin if the theory that sin can reach our new man in Christ - which has been created in righteousness and holiness.

Do we go in and out of righteousness because it is NOT our righteousness but Christ's alone?

Let's say we sinned ( and whatsoever is not of faith is sin so this could mean any type of sin ) and then we die in a car crash just after we got angry at someone and called them a name ( which Jesus says is a sin in Matt 5:22 ) - have we lost righteousness and thus not able to go to heaven?

There are so many problems when you really stop to ponder the ramifications with the theory that we lose our righteousness because sin touches the inner man in Christ.

We can sin by yielding our members in our flesh if we yield to it and we are responsible with what we do in our bodies but that is a different subject.

1 John 5:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP]We know that no one who is born of God sins; but He who was born of God keeps him, and the evil one does not touch him.

Jesus is keeping us from the evil one in our new creation in Christ.

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

if ya look closely there is a god like image in the clouds lol

FranC · May 12, 2017

MattforJesus said:

I suppose their head is all in a bind as they have to try to justify all the scriptures that testify against OSAS,and come up with an interpretation that fits their belief,and they probably get in large groups,a think tank,to come up with an interpretation that fits their belief,and I can hear it now,someone standing up,and speaking,men and brethren,what shall we do,for we cannot come to an interpretation to justify our position,and there is only one way out,we must sweep this scripture under the rug,and do not mention it ever again,and file this non used scripture under non used scripture #49,and let it be so,saith the people of the OSAS clan,and they all say here ye,here ye.

Mat 21:23 And when he was come into the temple, the chief priests and the elders of the people came unto him as he was teaching, and said, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority?
Mat 21:24 And Jesus answered and said unto them, I also will ask you one thing, which if ye tell me, I in like wise will tell you by what authority I do these things.
Mat 21:25 The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him?
Mat 21:26 But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet.
Mat 21:27 And they answered Jesus, and said, We cannot tell. And he said unto them, Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things.

Mat 22:41 While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them,
Mat 22:42 Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The Son of David.
Mat 22:43 He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
Mat 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Mat 22:45 If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?
Mat 22:46 And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.

People that hold a belief contrary to the truth of God will eventually come across something that contradicts what they believe,and they will not know how to answer for they cannot justify themselves,so many will ignore it for they cannot explain it,but might think it is an interpretation that goes along with what I believe,but I cannot grasp it now.

They say God chooses who will be saved,and who will not be saved,in the beginning,without the input of the person,which first off God is not evil to condemn people that have no input concerning their destiny,and all have sinned and come short of the glory of God,and God is no respecter of persons.

1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
1Ti 2:6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Joh 1:9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Rev 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

God wants all people to be saved,and Jesus gave Himself as a ransom for all people,which the Bible says He is the Savior of the world,all people,and lights every person that is born in to this world.

So God does not choose who will be saved,and not saved,in the beginning,without the input of the person,for we do get an input in our destiny,and if not people that God chose would not truly love God,for they have no choice but to love God,and those not chosen are condemned for no reason.

2 things that go against the nature of God,that He is true love,and He is not evil,wow which is really crazy that their belief says this about God,but I know they are not trying to do that.

God calls things that have not happened as though they already happened,which all the works were finished before the foundation of the world,and the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,and the prophets blood shed from the foundation of the world,although they were future events.

God already had the plan to give mankind salvation before He laid down the foundation of the world,so it is the same as if they have salvation in the beginning,and that salvation is to whoever wants it,for the Spirit and bride say,Come,and anybody that wants that salvation can have it.

Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

Co 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called.

God does the calling and choosing on earth,but God gets the glory for us being saved,for when He calls us He works in our life to get us to the truth,but we have to make the final push through the door and accept that truth,for God's kingdom is based on true love.Without God interceding in our life we would never get to the point to make the decision of the truth,for no person comes to the Son unless the Father draws them,and no person says Jesus is Lord,but by the Holy Ghost.

Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Like the Old Testament that was given to Israel,if they did not obey then they were cut off,so it is in the New Testament,if a person accepts Jesus as Lord and Savior,but they do not continue in His goodness,holding unto sin,they too will be cut off if they do not repent,and give up the sin.

Jas 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

2Ti 3:6 lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

A lot of people claim Jesus as Lord,and if some people start out in goodness,and then did not continue in goodness,will be cut off,if they do not get rid of the sins,then how will these people be in a right position that did not even get off on the right foot,for they would not get rid of their sins right off the bat,but if they would realize that sin affects their relationship with God,and does something about it,they can get on track.

If they believe they cannot abstain from sin,and sin does not affect their relationship with God,did they get off on the right foot with God,for when they accepted Christ as Lord and Savior,did they hold unto sin thinking they were alright with God,but only repented of all they did prior to that,but did not make that great of an effort to try to abstain from sin in the future,but do it,and then repent,and hold unto sin.

Many are called but few chosen,for we have a choice in the matter of our salvation,for God is true love,and is not evil.

Were they chosen that believe sin does not affect their relationship with Christ.

This is deserving of a reputation but it won't let me give one.

Why have the system if I can't use it as I want to??? (for the mod)

Great Post!! Very well thought out.

Grace777x70 · May 12, 2017

I believe that the Holy Spirit knew what He was doing when He had Paul write 1 Corinthians.

Some of them were going to temple prostitutes for sex, they were taking each other to court, they were in divisions and strife, they were not treating the poor amongst them right...etc.

Paul was saying that those in Corinth were acting like mere men and men of flesh - in other words not being spiritually minded.

1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ.

[SUP]2 [/SUP] I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,

[SUP]3 [/SUP] for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men?

[SUP]4 [/SUP] For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not mere men?

I noticed that in verse 1 Paul says that they are "babes in Christ".

- not that you are going to hell because you are sinning. Or that because they were sinning - that they are not born of God.

This lose your salvation ( which is based entirely on the works of Christ ) is the worse most damaging false doctrine to the body of Christ that has ever been put into the minds of men from the enemy.

It has done more harm to the body of Christ than any other false doctrine. It denies Christ and the work that He has done. It is unbelief in Christ and His work on the cross and resurrection.

FranC · May 12, 2017

JIMBO43 said:

Thanks for posting this Jimbo.
It's mighty and grandioso and marvelous.
Actually, i live in a place that looks like the image. It's very beautiful and it Always makes me think of God.
I think we're repeating everything 100X and my Brother Always tells me it's not good to argue between us.
Between us Christians, I mean. Jesus meant for us to be of one mind and to love each other.

I feel responsible for those reading along who think that because they've gone to an altar they can now MAYBE do nothing because of some things that are said here. Not everyone undersands what is being said or meant. Or, that they will be saved FOREVER no matter what they do, as if today we no longer had to be obedient to God.

I'll be back every now and then.
I love everyone here. We're all doing our best.

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

Its like this ,,,,,,,,,,its the faith alone preachers who say you can lose salvation by denying god ?????????

i think if that here true than we would all be in hell coz the is clear there is not one of us who is full proof the done deal...........

i do not believe you can lose your salvation until judgement day..............

JIMBO43 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

Thanks for posting this Jimbo.
It's mighty and grandioso and marvelous.
Actually, i live in a place that looks like the image. It's very beautiful and it Always makes me think of God.
I think we're repeating everything 100X and my Brother Always tells me it's not good to argue between us.
Between us Christians, I mean. Jesus meant for us to be of one mind and to love each other.

I feel responsible for those reading along who think that because they've gone to an altar they can now MAYBE do nothing because of some things that are said here. Not everyone undersands what is being said or meant. Or, that they will be saved FOREVER no matter what they do, as if today we no longer had to be obedient to God.

I'll be back every now and then.
I love everyone here. We're all doing our best.

its a war sis coz its spiritual warfare going on in here.. but glad youll carry on to pray i dont become invected again ....

Grace777x70 · May 12, 2017

There is a massive difference between church discipline to protect the people and the Lord sending you to hell as can be seen by the letter Paul said to the 1 Corinthians.

Paul told them who they were in Christ...then corrected their behavior...he didn't say you were all unsaved now or that because they were sinning that they were not born of God land thus now going to hell like some people try to teach.

( without understanding the new creation in Christ - this "sinning" part will throw people off because they don't understand what is being done by giving in to the flesh and what the new man is Christ really is. )

Paul told them who they were in Christ...Here are 7 things that Paul confirmed as truth in the believers in Corinth before he went on to correct their behavior.

1) The Corinthians have been sanctified in Christ Jesus,

2) The Corinthians were now saints by calling

3) The Corinthians in everything were enriched in Him,

4) The Corinthians had the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in them,

5) The Corinthians had that God will also confirm them to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ

6) The Corinthians had that it was by Gods doing that we are in Christ ( Not our own D.I.Y. self-righteousness and holiness )

7) That because the Corinthians were in Christ - Christ Himself became to them wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption

1 Corinthians 1:2-9 (NASB)

[SUP]2 [/SUP] To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

[SUP]3 [/SUP] Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]4 [/SUP] I thank my God always concerning you for the grace of God which was given you in Christ Jesus,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] that in everything you were enriched in Him, in all speech and all knowledge,

[SUP]6 [/SUP] even as the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in you,

[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that you are not lacking in any gift, awaiting eagerly the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,

[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Corinthians 1:30 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

Preach and teach the grace of Christ as it is the only think that teaches us how to live godly in this world. Titus 2:11-12. The word of His grace is the only thing that is able to build us up and that gives us the inheritance that is ours in Christ. Acts 20:32

FranC · May 12, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

The reason I mentioned Ariel is because you two present two totally different views.
Which one is the right one?

This is what I mean...

If someone new in Christ is reading along right now, they would understand that
WE CAN NO LONGER SIN.

1 Timothy chapters 1 and 4 and 5 are important to me.
It's not an easy task to teach. Every word must be measured and we should make sure not to be misunderstood.

I mean, Grace, look at what you're asking:

Let's say we sinned ( and whatsoever is not of faith is sin so this could mean any type of sin ) and then we die in a car crash just after we got angry at someone and called them a name ( which Jesus says is a sin in Matt 5:22 ) - have we lost righteousness and thus not able to go to heaven?

I believe a 9 year old religion student would know this answer. (if he was taught properly)
So why ask it?

limey410 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

Hi MMD

I respect you and like your posts, but I cannot go on and on like you guys do. I have WORK to do!!! (JK)

As you know, I really dislike using Greek. Not because I know nothing about it, but because we have to rely on Strong's.
None of us have any initials after our names, so why can't we just use the Language we know?

It seems to me it's enough to talk about what we talk about. There's only one word I like to go to for the Greek:
BELIEVE. It MEANS SO MUCH.....

So. 2 Peter 2:20
I'm sure BillG will also be reading along and this is also for him.
IN CONTEXT. Famous words. Peter is talking about false Teachers. The chapter is called "The Rise of False Teachers"

And my oh my, is OSAS EVER FALSE!!!!

verse 9 tells us that God is able to save the godly from temptation.
verse 13 and 14 is speaking about ungodly persons who entice unstable souls
verse 19 these false Teachers promise the unstable souls freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption.
verse 20 for if AFTER they have escaped the defilement of the world by the knowledge of our Lord and SAvior Jesus Christ

AFTER means something came before.
BEFORE they had escaped the defilement of the world
By the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and Savior

Joseph did not KNOW Mary till after Jesus was born.
You know Greek, what does KNOW mean in the Greek???
It is an INTIMATE knowledge. A salvific knowledge.

Now what happens?
They are AGAIN entangled in them --- the defilements of the world --- and are overcome.
They're overcome --- they give in to the defilement.
Thanks for looking up in Strongs what defilement means -- I kind of knew it already.

SO
They (I don't care who) were LOST
They became SAVED
Then they were LOST again

It's very plain to see.
But speak about twisting scripture...
Some are expert at this.

One more thing before I go:

ADAM

He was born again. I think so, What say you? He knew God and spoke to Him and walked with Him in the cool of the garden.

Adam disobeyed God. DISOBEYED.

What did God do? Did he tell him, it's OK. You're good forever.

NO! God banished Adam from the Garden.

SO

Adam was saved
And then he was lost.

God is the same Yesterday, today and Tomorrow.
Or is He???

If He is, then I believe we could still become unsaved.

And the sealing of the Holy Spirit.
I'm tired of talking about this.

Sealings could be undone.
Ask any King who lived in those days.

And anyway, we're sealed for as long as we want to be.

Rev. 3:20 Jesus is knocking at the door. Gently. He's NEVER GOING TO BREAK IT DOWN.

Also, check out Revelation 21:27 and Revelation 22:12

Adam was birthed with the Spirit of Life breathed into him. He was not born spiritually dead, so was not lost, ergo had nothing to be saved from. We, as a result of what Adam did are born without the Spirit of Life living within us and are born lost.
Adam is not an example of saved turning to lost. He is an example of what happens when one doesn't believe God.
Hence a Savior, Our salvation is based on our belief in the finished work and then the acceptance of the Holy Spirit that is being restored to us. There is no provision for the removal of that once it has occurred.

FranC · May 12, 2017

JIMBO43 said:

No worries Jimbo.

You're safe in the hands of Jesus.
Just stay there...
I plan on being there all my life.

FranC · May 12, 2017

limey410 said:

Oh really.
I'm not even replying to this.
Are you serious?
If Adam wasn't saved WHO WAS?
This discussion goes on with theologians all the time.
ADAM WAS SAVED.
HE BECAME LOST.

What? You have to be lost first to be saved?
NO.
What are we saved from?
Hell.
Being distant from God.

You tell me. Whatever we get saved FROM, Adam had it.

HE LOST IT.

Did he or did he not have what every born again Christian has?

Did he have it when he was banished from the garden?

Grace777x70 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

1 John 3:9 and 1 John 5:18 are very clear that the one born of God cannot sin. The one born of God is the new man in Christ - the new creation. It doesn't say that people cannot give into the flesh and fulfill it's lusts and these are called "deeds of the body".

It is saying that this new man in Christ where the Holy Spirit dwells - where Christ dwells in our hearts - that new creation cannot sin.

This is where the understanding of the circumcision of the flesh and heart comes into play. I have written about it numerous times. I'll try once more for any new readers of the thread.

The understanding of the circumcision of Christ where the new creation in Christ is "cut away" from the flesh is a life changing revelation of the wonderful awesome work that our Lord did when we died with Him on the cross and rose again to being a new creation - joined as one spirit with Him for eternity - sealed by the Holy Spirit who raised Jesus from the dead.

The truth is that Jesus has already saved us from our sins. If we don't know that - then a lot of the good news of what Jesus did will be a blurr to us.

We will end up searching for sin in our lives constantly and I have news for all of us. There will be sin in our flesh until we get rid of theses bodies.

We will be constantly trying to clean up the flesh but the only way to not fulfill the lusts of the flesh is by the Spirit in us.

That is why the circumcision of Christ is imperative to understand in order to grow up in Christ.

Abraham's circumcision was a shadow of being circumcised in Christ now from our flesh.We are cut away from the flesh and our inner man of the new creation - our new spirit created in righteousness and holiness in Christ.

What do we do with the old flesh that is cut away? We throw it out and you can not have it put back on as it is dead. The same goes for our spiritual circumcision in which our flesh is cut away from our inner man - the spirit where Christ dwells.

We are completely sealed by the Holy Spirit within our spirit in our circumcision in Christ.

Understanding spiritual circumcision is important to get a revelation of the new creation in Christ now and to the understanding that our new hearts are pure now because our heart and Christ are one spirit - created in righteousness and holiness - by the incorruptible seed of God which abides forever.

When scriptures talk about the circumcision ( cutting away from) of the heart and of the flesh - it is 2 sides of the same coin.

Romans 2:29 (NASB)
[SUP]29[/SUP] But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.

Colossians 2:11 (NASB)
[SUP]11[/SUP] and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands,in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

Colossians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions,

FranC · May 12, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

I believe that the Holy Spirit knew what He was doing when He had Paul write 1 Corinthians.

Some of them were going to temple prostitutes for sex, they were taking each other to court, they were in divisions and strife, they were not treating the poor amongst them right...etc.

Paul was saying that those in Corinth were acting like mere men and men of flesh - in other words not being spiritually minded.

1 Corinthians 3:1-4 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ.

[SUP]2 [/SUP] I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,

[SUP]3 [/SUP] for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men?

[SUP]4 [/SUP] For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not mere men?

I noticed that in verse 1 Paul says that they are "babes in Christ".

- not that you are going to hell because you are sinning. Or that because they were sinning - that they are not born of God.

This lose your salvation ( which is based entirely on the works of Christ ) is the worse most damaging false doctrine to the body of Christ that has ever been put into the minds of men from the enemy.

It has done more harm to the body of Christ than any other false doctrine. It denies Christ and the work that He has done. It is unbelief in Christ and His work on the cross and resurrection.

Please read your second and third paragraphs.

You mean we actually have to not sin and be good???

AND WHAT IF WE'RE NOT???

limey410 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

You totally misread my post. Adam born alive, sinned, died. The rest of us, born dead, resurrected through Christ, alive.

Grace777x70 · May 12, 2017

FranC said:

Sorry....i have no idea what you are asking here. I don't understand what you are saying.

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