Not By Works

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UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
8,970
5,447
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I cannot but help to compare fruit in the same way the Lord did and how many places creation is used to describe the process......I personally believe the only one NOT saved in the parable of the sower is the first one on the list where Satan comes and immediately steals away the seed (MOST fit this group).......I believe there is sufficient evidence to support the other three a being saved with different processes of life and how it has bearing upon the possibility of bearing fruit......there are numerous verses that deals with these truths throughout the bible.....

Some in immaturity are easily offended and though saved fall by the way side
Some are saved and allow worldliness and the cares of life to choke fruit down just like a garden with weeds
Some saved are faithful as and bear an abundance

AND really the above can all three apply to any believer at any stage of their walk.......

Amen and Amen!!!
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,761
2,627
113
Just a question; Unless you were brought up a spirit filled believer don't you feel the difference from before you were saved till now?
My background was that of the Islamic faith.

So no spirit filled upbringing.

Do I feel the difference now before I saved?

Yes I sure do.

And it's an encompassing.

Want to be like Jesus and know when I'm not.
And when I'm not I acknowledge it and ask fot help.
 

calibob

Sinner saved by grace
May 29, 2018
5,534
3,832
113
65
lawton ok
My background was that of the Islamic faith.

So no spirit filled upbringing.

Do I feel the difference now before I saved?

Yes I sure do.

And it's an encompassing.

Want to be like Jesus and know when I'm not.
And when I'm not I acknowledge it and ask fot help.
Well then please acknowledge that feelings do play apart in decision making, we not only know right from wrong in our heads but due to the Holy Spirit we know the difference in our hearts too. We can feel it. That's all. Peace.V
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
40,806
13,184
113
Just a thought...

If we as children of God , who has been sealed by His Holy Spirit , and kept by His power , and is the guardian of our souls , then how can we possibly lose our Salvation...

If we could , then that would make us more powerful than God ...xox...
AMEN ROSE......the following words are clear...

Irrevocable
Incorruptible
Uttermost
Eternal
Everlasting
Kept
ETC....
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
40,806
13,184
113
To be honest the thoughts you have I agree with.
But not really followed it through.
I'm not a romantic when it comes to this.
So it's not based on feelings.
AMEN bro.....it does bear out.........I can think of numerous sets of verses that bear these truths out
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,187
113
Its a good thing God is not like this.
Quite a shocking thing you say.
Basically it comes across as God saying "I care nothing about what I have sown with regards to the dead and soiled plants and that's the price for showing in the first place"
Firstly the price was paid on the cross so we can sow.
So God does care about dead and soiled plants. That's why Jesus died.
That's why he paid the price.
I think you have miss-understood the gospel. It is to save people to bring them to completion,
to the likeness of Jesus, to be blameless, as wedding guests of the Lamb.

23 May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.
1 Thess 5

27 And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.
28 "Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Will he not first sit down and estimate the cost to see if he has enough money to complete it?
29 For if he lays the foundation and is not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule him,
30 saying, 'This fellow began to build and was not able to finish.'
31 "Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Will he not first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand?
32 If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace.
33 In the same way, any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14

There are no free rides, no easy options, no compromise. God is not one for compromise.
Do you see people dying in pain and anguish? Do you see tremendous suffering and hardship,
yet it continues? God is just and true, and things work to His will.

Christ died for those who will listen and follow. And it is almost impossible, because we are
so lost, yet He will work with people as they are willing. There is no compromise, God has
done enough in the cross, it is up to us to walk and follow. God is the Lord, it is His judgement
yet sinful man will always wish to compromise because sinful man does not understand purity,
righteousness, truth, integrity and lives in unbelief that He who raised Christ from the dead cannot
change the heart of man to follow like Jesus. And that is it. Unbelief.
 

longtrekker

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
390
183
43
Just a thought...

If we as children of God , who has been sealed by His Holy Spirit , and kept by His power , and is the guardian of our souls , then how can we possibly lose our Salvation...

If we could , then that would make us more powerful than God ...xox...
.
Hi Rosemary

I remember someone a while back saying something to the effect "..if we could lose our salvation - we would"!

But we're kept by someOne else - who'll never lose us!
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,187
113
Universalism is God cannot judge anyone, all will in the end enter heaven.
Easy believism - all who call on Jesus's name are in not matter the mess they are and continue to stay.

God is not looking for sinners, but sinners who are prepared to become saints and walk as saints.
It is really this simple. No walking like a saint, no entry.

The farce is the idea that sinners can be forced to be saints against their will.
Only those who do not understand love and righteousness would even think such a thing.
But if that is your God, you will meet the real Saviour and it will be all too late.

God bless you
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
40,806
13,184
113
.
Hi Rosemary

I remember someone a while back saying something to the effect "..if we could lose our salvation - we would"!

But we're kept by someOne else - who'll never lose us!
AMEN.....JESUS--->I will LOSE nothing the FATHER hath given me, but raise it up the last day!

Saved to the UTTERMOST and KEPT by the power of God through the faith that JESUS begins, finishes and completes IN US...........

The gifts and calling of GOD are IRREVOCABLE <----SALVATION is a GIFT of GOD
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
6,797
2,580
113
Universalism is God cannot judge anyone, all will in the end enter heaven.
Easy believism - all who call on Jesus's name are in not matter the mess they are and continue to stay.

God is not looking for sinners, but sinners who are prepared to become saints and walk as saints.
It is really this simple. No walking like a saint, no entry.

The farce is the idea that sinners can be forced to be saints against their will.
Only those who do not understand love and righteousness would even think such a thing.
But if that is your God, you will meet the real Saviour and it will be all too late.

God bless you
only those who refuse to accept the Biblical definition of sin ( and one who is full of puffed-up arrogant pride ) would make the claim that he could be just like Jesus.

instead of bowing at the feet of the Savior, in a sense of our unworthiness , and thanking Him profusely for what He did for us, you want to smile and say " aren't you proud of me, i'm just like you"

what a delusional state of mind.
 

UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
8,970
5,447
113
Universalism is God cannot judge anyone, all will in the end enter heaven.
Easy believism - all who call on Jesus's name are in not matter the mess they are and continue to stay.
Ya know a person looses credibilty when they misrepresent a belief.
 

UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
8,970
5,447
113
only those who refuse to accept the Biblical definition of sin ( and one who is full of puffed-up arrogant pride ) would make the claim that he could be just like Jesus.

instead of bowing at the feet of the Savior, in a sense of our unworthiness , and thanking Him profusely for what He did for us, you want to smile and say " aren't you proud of me, i'm just like you"

what a delusional state of mind.
I said the same thing a while back....I was told we are not called to bow or kneel or some such thing.:unsure::eek::rolleyes:
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,187
113
11 It is written: "'As surely as I live,' says the Lord,
'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.'"
12 So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God.
Rom 14

9 Would he thank the servant because he did what he was told to do?
10 So you also, when you have done everything you were told to do,
should say, 'We are unworthy servants; we have only done our duty.'
Luke 17

12 In a loud voice they sang: "Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive
power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!"
13 Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and
on the sea, and all that is in them, singing: "To him who sits on the throne and
to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!"
Rev 5

2 Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the
joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the
right hand of the throne of God.
3 Consider him who endured such opposition from sinful men, so that you will
not grow weary and lose heart.
Heb 12
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,187
113
My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me.
I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can
snatch them out of my hand.
John 10:27-28

Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them
into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
Matt 7:24

I tell you the truth, if anyone keeps my word, he will never see death
John 8:51

As for the person who hears my words but does not keep them,
I do not judge him. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it.
There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words;
that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.
John 12:47-48

Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me.
John 14:21

If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and
we will come to him and make our home with him.
John 14:23

for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. The commandments,
"Do not commit adultery,Do not murder,Do not steal,Do not covet," and
whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule:
"Love your neighbor as yourself." Love does no harm to its neighbor.
Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
Rom 13:8-10

Aim for perfection, listen to my appeal, be of one mind, live in peace.
And the God of love and peace will be with you.
2 Cor 13:11
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
3,674
1,187
113
Universalism is God cannot judge anyone, all will in the end enter heaven.
Easy believism - all who call on Jesus's name are in not matter the mess they are and continue to stay.

God is not looking for sinners, but sinners who are prepared to become saints and walk as saints.
It is really this simple. No walking like a saint, no entry.

The farce is the idea that sinners can be forced to be saints against their will.
Only those who do not understand love and righteousness would even think such a thing.
But if that is your God, you will meet the real Saviour and it will be all too late.

God bless you
There is a strange thing here. I mentioned the name easy believism, and it strikes me some thought
I was referring to them and suggested I was miss-representing it.

There are many positions people take, but my criticism is those who easily claim Jesus at no cost
and have no intention to walk His path. I am told no-one believes this or does this.

If this is so then why the response? These few sentences only hurt because they speak the truth
and shine a light on it. Jesus is so much more, and through real repentance and faith changes us,
transforms us into His likeness.

15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts.
16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18 And we, who with unveiled faces all reflect the Lord's glory, are being transformed
into his likeness with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.
2 Cor 3

You believe in the cross and the Lord giving Himself for you for the forgiveness of sins, so also
believe He has the power to transform through obedience into His likeness. This is the gospel
of Christ and the crown for which we strive. Amen.
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
6,761
2,627
113
I think you have miss-understood the gospel. It is to save people to bring them to completion,
to the likeness of Jesus, to be blameless, as wedding guests of the Lamb.

23 May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.
1 Thess 5

27 And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.
28 "Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Will he not first sit down and estimate the cost to see if he has enough money to complete it?
29 For if he lays the foundation and is not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule him,
30 saying, 'This fellow began to build and was not able to finish.'
31 "Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Will he not first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand?
32 If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace.
33 In the same way, any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14

There are no free rides, no easy options, no compromise. God is not one for compromise.
Do you see people dying in pain and anguish? Do you see tremendous suffering and hardship,
yet it continues? God is just and true, and things work to His will.

Christ died for those who will listen and follow. And it is almost impossible, because we are
so lost, yet He will work with people as they are willing. There is no compromise, God has
done enough in the cross, it is up to us to walk and follow. God is the Lord, it is His judgement
yet sinful man will always wish to compromise because sinful man does not understand purity,
righteousness, truth, integrity and lives in unbelief that He who raised Christ from the dead cannot
change the heart of man to follow like Jesus. And that is it. Unbelief.
I have misunderstood nothing.
 

Milee777

Active member
Dec 24, 2018
173
119
43
My background was that of the Islamic faith.

So no spirit filled upbringing.

Do I feel the difference now before I saved?

Yes I sure do.

And it's an encompassing.

Want to be like Jesus and know when I'm not.
And when I'm not I acknowledge it and ask fot help.
I have a Muslim friend, sad thing that by mistake I questioned his beliefs in ways i shouldn't have but I know that he doesn't believe Jesus is the Son of God. He considers it wrong that we as Christians drink an alcoholic drink(wine) for communion... he is very knowledgable too actually.. he knows many things about Christianity but keeps telling me that the Bible is adulterated.. and firmly believes in Islam. Am afraid we won't be talking anymore which makes me feel bad...and i suppose it's my life and my actions that must bear a testimony than my words.. but the least i could do is pray for him... and stop being selfish..
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,859
380
83
53
HBG. Pa. USA
I think you have miss-understood the gospel. It is to save people to bring them to completion,
to the likeness of Jesus, to be blameless, as wedding guests of the Lamb.

23 May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24 The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it.
1 Thess 5
In verse 23 The KJV translates the conjunction to "and" rather than "may". Sanctification is conditional.
1Thess 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
1Thess 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The conjunction is translated from the Greek word "de".

δέ
de
Thayer Definition:
1) but, moreover, and, etc.
Part of Speech: conjunction
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: a primary particle (adversative or continuative)
Total KJV Occurrences: 397
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,859
380
83
53
HBG. Pa. USA
In verse 23 The KJV translates the conjunction to "and" rather than "may". Sanctification is conditional.
1Thess 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
1Thess 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

The conjunction is translated from the Greek word "de".

δέ
de
Thayer Definition:
1) but, moreover, and, etc.
Part of Speech: conjunction
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: a primary particle (adversative or continuative)
Total KJV Occurrences: 397
From the BDAG
δέ (Hom.+) one of the most common Gk. particles, used to connect one clause to another, either to express contrast or simple continuation. When it is felt that there is some contrast betw. clauses—though the contrast is oft. scarcely discernible—the most common translation is ‘but’. When a simple connective is desired, without contrast being clearly implied, ‘and’ will suffice, and in certain occurrences the marker may be left untranslated (Denniston 162–89; Schwyzer 2, 562; B-D-F §447).—
 

Macabeus

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2018
2,535
705
113
Here speaks someone who does not know the biblical definition of sin.
We are commanded to confront brothers in Christ regarding their sin.

Amen to raising issues that matter.
I think whether or not a new Christian is able to bear fruit is a very important issue.