Not By Works

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Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
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Who here on CC does not believe in being obedient to God’s word?
No responses from any worker bees. And churchbuilder refused to answer whether or not he’s a god after implying that he is one. These guys make bold proclamations then run when challenged.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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No responses from any worker bees. And churchbuilder refused to answer whether or not he’s a god after implying that he is one. These guys make bold proclamations then run when challenged.

Oh brother ...... I bet JadenS is back.....

Disagree

  1. L
    LetDisobedientBeAnathema
    3 minutes ago
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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Jesus said the MANY come before his throne peddling the same crap that Judges, PS and the other clown are peddling.....within Christianity ---> The few preach saved eternally by faith without some sort of religious hoop jumping farce....!!
The few preach saved eternally by faith
A Google search will show this to be true.

"They" (the clowns, and there are many) are definitely working overtime to extinguish the Truth.:(
 
Nov 24, 2019
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My point was I was quoting exactly what the Bible says about those who believe in Jesus Christ. It is easy to say those who believe in Jesus Christ have eternal life, which is true. I posted several other Scriptures yesterday of other things the Bible also says about those who believe in Jesus Christ which most people posting here would never claim.

There are millions upon millions of people who claim to believe in Jesus who really don't. They claim to be righteous with His righteousness, but they aren't. Everyone sees it. The Kingdom of God is not the Magic Kingdom. "He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous. He who does what is sinful is of the devil. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil." "Everyone who sins is a slave of sin and a slave doesn't have a permanent place in the household." "Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means!"

You quote from 1 John where it says that if we claim to be without sin we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. We're all born miserable sinners, aren't we? John says he was writing these things to us so that we will not sin. 99.99999% of Christians say, "Impossible!!!!" You have to be able to accept everything in the book and not drop parts off or explain them away.

"He bore our sins in His body on the tree so that we would be dead to sins." Living in the Spirit we will not gratify the desires of the flesh. Our hearts have to be circumcised under the New Covenant precisely as their male organs had to be under the Old. The removal of the sinful nature as it says in Col.2? Who can believe that? And there you have half the problem with the confessing church in this country, in this century. The other half? Well, I've touched on the death part of the Gospel (since you asked me yesterday.) The other part is the resurrection part. He took away the first, where we had to keep coming back to him for forgiveness b/c the sin problem was never finally taken care of in our hearts, to establish the 2nd: "I have come to do Thy will, O God."

Why do you have a body today? So you can put it on His altar, being conformed to the image of Christ, and that purchased body would do the will of God today, not the will of mailmandan. A disciple of Jesus Christ denies his soul. Says 'no' to it. No option. We can't be soulish anymore, we have to be spiritual. Romans 8. We don't live according to the sinful nature anymore, we live according to the Spirit. If we are God's sons, like Jesus, it is God's Spirit which leads us now. Very narrow gate! OSAS very wide, very easy! But it's not true. The Gospel I'm proclaiming, which is all through the Bible, is. This is why each Gospel states why Jesus came. And each Gospel does not state so that we would be forgiven, or that we would go to heaven.

"I baptize you with water but One stands among you, the thongs of whose sandals I am unworthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire." Each Gospel restates that Jesus came for the purpose of baptizing us with the Holy Spirit. Is that why Christians think he came? The Father and the Son are in Heaven right now. Genuine followers of Jesus Christ cannot follow Him, listen to His voice right now, without the Holy Spirit. They don't go their own way, do as they please, or speak their own words. Sounds like Jesus, doesn't it? And that's what "Christians" were supposed to be - little Christs. Historically, hasn't turned out that way. But, then again, Jesus didn't come to start Christianity.

Let's talk passing through the Red Sea and then receiving the pillar of fire and no one made a move for as long as that pillar of fire was stationary. There's a good Gospel lesson. How did that all start? The blood of the Lamb. Strict rules were imposed. The father did it. If anyone went out the door of the house, they died. No leaven was to be in the bread. During Passover, no leaven could be in their houses (bodies) or in their country (church) for 7 days, signifying that is how it was to be. How? By faith, they kept the Passover.

The Kingdom of God is a paradox. To really live, you have to die. If you hold on to your soul life, you will die. In this Sabbath Rest for the people of God, we quit. "Works salvationist?" Insane. We are crucified with Him. We no longer live. But the life we now live in the body we live by the faith of the Son of God. He did nothing on His own initiative. Abiding in Him we must walk as He walked. The Gospel of the Kingdom is simple. It is a change of government. Out from under Satan, Jesus become our King. We don't do as we see fit today because Jesus is our King. When the pillar of fire moves, we move. Being close to His rod and His staff, the wolves have to stay at bay. Seeking first His Kingdom and His righteousness like this, we don't have to go after material things like the world. He provides. Righteousness results in peace. People feel it when they enter our home.

The righteous live by faith. Christ is all. "Whatever we do, whether in word or deed, we do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ." That's what faith does. It's simple. But its a difficult Way. We are heaven's ambassadors in a foreign land. Glory to God, Jesus Christ is Lord today.
p.s.
But certain persons have crept in, whose condemnation was written about long ago, ungodly persons who turn the grace of God into the licentiousness, denying our only Master and Lord Jesus Christ. Jude 4

Licentiousness is marked a disregard for strict rules of correctness. Try to impose 1 Corinthians 11 in a church today, when it says we have no other practice nor do the churches of God
No responses from any worker bees. And churchbuilder refused to answer whether or not he’s a god after implying that he is one. These guys make bold proclamations then run when challenged.
Hilarious. The Word of God is pretty bold. But you are bold behind your keyboard. Some of us have careers and young families. It’s not running. I’m busy weightlifting right now friend.

You guys dig at something when you have no response to the Scripture stated. Whoever believes in Him has eternal life, and whoever believes in Him is born of God and no one born of God sins. And anyone who has faith in Him will do what He was doing, referring to His miracles.

You folks claim a couple of those things, reject one and ignore or explain away another. Point being most who claim to believe don’t in reality.

But I’ll follow the diversion. Is it like God when one’s face shines as the face of an angel? Is it like God when the sick are healed immediately and deaf ears opened all in the name of Jesus Christ? He called them gods to whom the Word of God came. Clothed with His righteousness, led of His Spirit, abiding in His Word, set apart to God by His choice, living by faith, walking as Jesus walked. Is that to be a god or a “little Christ” as a Christian was meant to be originally? I could be guilty of being like my Lord.

Is this the part where you all cover your ears, shout blasphemy and rush at me? There was a riot many places Paul went. God knows we need more riots.

Gotta get back to life. It’s not running away.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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In Hebrews 3:14 the protasis is "if we hold fast to the end".

The apodosis is "we are made partakers"

.


Hebrews 3:14 is an interesting construction, in that the apodosis comes before the protasis...

We are made partakers (apodosis)

If we hold fast the beginning of our confidence...(protasis)

The apodosis (we have been made partakers) is true only if the protasis (if we hold fast) is true. In this case, the apodosis is in the perfect tense, so the protasis is true because of something that already happened. In other words, we hold fast because we have already been made partakers with Christ.

The only other option is if you accept Judge's understanding of the verse. Unless someone can show me a third way of understanding the relationship of protasis and apodosis in the verse. If you can, Eleventh Hour, I'm all ears.
I will never, ever accept @Judges1318 .. view ......it is outside of scripture.

I will need to look what you are stating ... since this an exception to how apodosis and protasis usually work.

My main point is this.... the writer does not have loss of salvation in view.

I read the entire passage that is critical.... then this is what is being stated... the warning/exhoration is to "faithfulness" not to salvation... there is a difference.

The writer is telling them to not be like the Israelite that rejected the promise land and accepted a spies report.
If they continue in "faithfulness" they will have a better end .. better than the Israelites.

An emphasis on perseverance but only in the sense of what we should do.
 

Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
3,165
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Oh brother ...... I bet JadenS is back.....

Disagree

  1. L
    LetDisobedientBeAnathema
    3 minutes ago
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EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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Whoever believes in Him has eternal life, and whoever believes in Him is born of God and no one born of God sins.
In all seriousness... do you really believe you are sinless?

You come to this thread of your own volition to spread your dogma so ... give a straight answer.
 

Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
3,165
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p.s.
But certain persons have crept in, whose condemnation was written about long ago, ungodly persons who turn the grace of God into the licentiousness, denying our only Master and Lord Jesus Christ. Jude 4

Licentiousness is marked a disregard for strict rules of correctness. Try to impose 1 Corinthians 11 in a church today, when it says we have no other practice nor do the churches of God

Hilarious. The Word of God is pretty bold. But you are bold behind your keyboard. Some of us have careers and young families. It’s not running. I’m busy weightlifting right now friend.

You guys dig at something when you have no response to the Scripture stated. Whoever believes in Him has eternal life, and whoever believes in Him is born of God and no one born of God sins. And anyone who has faith in Him will do what He was doing, referring to His miracles.

You folks claim a couple of those things, reject one and ignore or explain away another. Point being most who claim to believe don’t in reality.

But I’ll follow the diversion. Is it like God when one’s face shines as the face of an angel? Is it like God when the sick are healed immediately and deaf ears opened all in the name of Jesus Christ? He called them gods to whom the Word of God came. Clothed with His righteousness, led of His Spirit, abiding in His Word, set apart to God by His choice, living by faith, walking as Jesus walked. Is that to be a god or a “little Christ” as a Christian was meant to be originally? I could be guilty of being like my Lord.

Is this the part where you all cover your ears, shout blasphemy and rush at me? There was a riot many places Paul went. God knows we need more riots.

Gotta get back to life. It’s not running away.
Blah, blah, blah. You’re far from being Christlike, and you sure as heck aren’t my friend. I’m a hospice chaplain; how’s that for a vocation and career.

And for the record I’ve been lifting weights for 35 years. You’ve got nothing on me kid.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
8,440
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Hebrews 3:14 is a third class conditional sentence.
Yes another reason this is not perseverance of the saints... because if it was it would be a first class condition (since) not a third class condition.

Also .. I am not convinced partakers of Christ is a reference to salvation but rather partner or sharer of Christ as in discipleship.

This makes much more sense to see the entire section as faithfulness to the faith.

So in this understanding/view it is not necessary to flip the condition and the consequence.

As well, the rest is not eternal life... this does not work with regards to Moses who did not enter the promised land... the rest is temporal blessings.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,254
3,719
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Just put me on ignore. It will go better for you, then you won't get so worked up about me posting scriptures.

LOL, I am not What you think too. I am 70 years old, and I still go by OLD RULES, and I do not care for FACE BOOK RULES, I have Never even had a single Face Book Accout. THEY CALL USING BOLD TAPE A WAY TO SHOW ANGRY. I do not Go by Face Book Rules, I use BOLD TYPE and colors, to only show EMPHASIS. Do you remember what that is? I am a product of the late 60's, CLASS OF 1967 to be exact. To do THIS was to show EMPHASIS, And still IS as far as I am concerned. Have you ever used an Underwood Electric Typewriter. I had Two Colors, BLACK and RED with the UNDERLINE OPTION, available if you back up and type over it. OLD SCHOOL, will not die until I am dead.
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,409
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LOL, I am not What you think too. I am 70 years old, and I still go by OLD RULES, and I do not care for FACE BOOK RULES, I have Never even had a single Face Book Accout. THEY CALL USING BOLD TAPE A WAY TO SHOW ANGRY. I do not Go by Face Book Rules, I use BOLD TYPE and colors, to only show EMPHASIS. Do you remember what that is? I am a product of the late 60's, CLASS OF 1967 to be exact. To do THIS was to show EMPHASIS, And still IS as far as I am concerned. Have you ever used an Underwood Electric Typewriter. I had Two Colors, BLACK and RED with the UNDERLINE OPTION, available if you back up and type over it. OLD SCHOOL, will not die until I am dead.
Bro dont worry, I keep it oldschool too, I use CAPS for emphasis too, ive had folks tell me that thing DONT YELL I said im not yelling i aint making a SOUND im TYPING with large letters like Paul did to the Galatians, ITS BIBLICAL!

All this internet etiquette is dumb if you ask me.
 

Chris1975

Senior Member
Apr 27, 2017
2,379
467
83
Hebrews 2

2 Therefore we must give [a]the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, lest we drift away. 2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just [b]reward, 3 how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him,
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,254
3,719
113
You win that bet, dear sister. 😆

Lightskin, this is not funny. He has plagued us for almost 2 years. He is a Catholic who puts RED X on every Protestant Posts. He gets BANNED FREQUENTLY, changes his name, and starts to put Red X's oh us that he thinks we are heretics. He on rare occasions posts Catholic info on want they think are Heretics. So our only defense is to report him quickly, and get management to BAN him yet again.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,118
20,044
113
A Google search will show this to be true.

"They" (the clowns, and there are many) are definitely working overtime to extinguish the Truth.:(
Amen...bad day coming for them....these religionists and cainologists make the way broad by their fraudulent gospels and faux salvation that may he lost or forfeit.....
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
46,118
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I will never, ever accept @Judges1318 .. view ......it is outside of scripture.

I will need to look what you are stating ... since this an exception to how apodosis and protasis usually work.

My main point is this.... the writer does not have loss of salvation in view.

I read the entire passage that is critical.... then this is what is being stated... the warning/exhoration is to "faithfulness" not to salvation... there is a difference.

The writer is telling them to not be like the Israelite that rejected the promise land and accepted a spies report.
If they continue in "faithfulness" they will have a better end .. better than the Israelites.

An emphasis on perseverance but only in the sense of what we should do.
Only a fool would accept it....or one deceived or blind....!