Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
E

EleventhHour

Guest
The part you left out, the part about you being able to go back to satan's camp in heart, mind, and soul, and body and you get to keep the salvation of Christ--that's what causes one to wonder if one is of the devil rather than God.
The part that you seem to miss over and over again is simply this....

King James Bible
It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Hebrews 10:31

Read it over and over again until you understand.

I know a living God involved in my life not a dead helpless laissez-faire do as you please God.

You focus on sin to the exclusion of God as loving Father as though He cannot deal with His adopted children.

Your lens is so skewed it is really pitiful!
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
ma'am please cease adding these negative to your signature!
you are a child of God,a part of the royal priest-hood,a princess. Do not take on any negatives that someone throws at you but put on the whole armour of God,which keeps us free!
I am not troubled by it.

My sense of humor it does get me in trouble sometimes... I will think on it
 

preacher4truth

Senior Member
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,715
113
Jesus preached perseverance of the Saints; Philippians 1:6; that all his will never lose salvation; John 10:27-28; John 6:37-40; John 6:44.

According to @lightbearer this preaching is of the devil.

Let that sink in brothers and sisters...
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
Believing in Christ is self effort.
Amazing.
Again you stated endurance makes us worthy of salvation.
That is self-effort
If you properly understood scripture you would not end up with these contradictions
Matthew 24:13 is solely speaking to physical life being saved.. it is during the tribulation.
 

DJ3

Member
Jun 22, 2019
88
21
8
Absolute nonsense to claim verse 13 refers to the physical life when verse 12 is clearly referring to a declension in the spiritual life. Does it not say that Godly "agape" love will wax cold as the world gets worse? Only the saints can be recipients of agape, yet Jesus says the agape of some of the saints is gonna grow cold and dead!

Therefore, since verse 13 is in the same context of verse 12, the message of Jesus is that some of the saints are gonna die spiritually and those that endure to the end the temptation to join them in spiritual death shall be saved.

Why would Jesus supposedly concern us with preservation of physical life in the tribulation, as you suggest, when over and over He tells us our lives are but sheep to the slaughter, vapor here then gone, crucified all the day long? He ain't concerned about the physical in the least - He's got new bodies ready to go. What He is concerned with is our spiritual life, without which those new physical bodies mean nuthin.
They have to believe it's referring to physical life, they have no other choice. Stubborn people will believe and embrace strangle notions to keep up the pretense. You and I see the puerile nature of this thinking but spiritual blindness can cause madness in time. You will be blessed for your efforts, you may not change the minds of those in the deepest of ditches but you may very well save a few from playing in the more shallow ones.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
12,149
2,351
113
Agree on this part for sure!
I know you and others do not agree with the way I rightly divide the word of truth, but one really has to go outside Paul’s teachings to the body of Christ to show a loss of salvation, specifically in Hebrews and other Jewish epistles.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
They have to believe it's referring to physical life, they have no other choice. Stubborn people will believe and embrace strangle notions to keep up the pretense. You and I see the puerile nature of this thinking but spiritual blindness can cause madness in time. You will be blessed for your efforts, you may not change the minds of those in the deepest of ditches but you may very well save a few from playing in the more shallow ones.

The context is absolutely clear in Matthew 24... how can you deny this?

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Clearly referring to physical life.
It is really wrong to go against Christ and make Him state something He did not!
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
I know you and others do not agree with the way I rightly divide the word of truth, but one really has to go outside Paul’s teachings to the body of Christ to show a loss of salvation, specifically in Hebrews and other Jewish epistles.
I am very thankful you got that right....LOL
 

Phoneman-777

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2019
2,263
332
83
How can you get us to do anything while displaying fear in refusing to answer whether hypocrisy is a presumptuous sin or not?

You lack credibility.
Fear? I asked you to clarify for me what kind of sin you mean...the kind the just man who falls seven times, or the "Great Transgression" of presumptuous sins David begged God to keep him from. If you did answer, please tell me what post number.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
21,748
10,526
113
55
You directly contradict what you believe about 1 John 2:19 then.
It says nothing about 'permanently' falling away. How would you define that anyway? 6 months? A year? 10 years?
Obviously, you can only know what 'permanently' is until this life has ended.
It's an incredibly stupid doctrine
No contradiction at all and you don’t know what permanent means? Calling OSAS a stupid doctrine makes you sound arrogant. There is nothing stupid about God’s preservation.
 

Phoneman-777

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2019
2,263
332
83
You are the one that wants to slice and dice different types of sin. I don't.

Why do you fear saying hypocrisy is a presumptuous sin? Is it or isn't it? I mean a person who knowingly practices hypocrisy would be committing a presumptuous sin right?
I already told you to if you can't differentiate between the two, then get back in the Bible until you do.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
9,704
6,134
113
Fear? I asked you to clarify for me what kind of sin you mean...the kind the just man who falls seven times, or the "Great Transgression" of presumptuous sins David begged God to keep him from. If you did answer, please tell me what post number.
This is my answer:

Matthew 12:31 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Unpardonable Sin
31 “Therefore I say to you, EVERY sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men.

Jesus' Blood removes ALL sin from the born again believer.


Now answer mine before asking me another. Is hypocrisy a presumptuous sin?
 

Phoneman-777

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2019
2,263
332
83
You referenced this verse in your post...

"but he that shall endure to the end, the same shall be saved"

that is Matthew 24:13

Is this what you are referring to?
Yes, I was referring to both 12 and 13, showing that since the context of 12 is spiritual life and 13 is a continuation of the same context, 13 must refer to spiritual life, as well.
 

Phoneman-777

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2019
2,263
332
83
They have to believe it's referring to physical life, they have no other choice. Stubborn people will believe and embrace strangle notions to keep up the pretense. You and I see the puerile nature of this thinking but spiritual blindness can cause madness in time. You will be blessed for your efforts, you may not change the minds of those in the deepest of ditches but you may very well save a few from playing in the more shallow ones.
Thanks. I'm just trying to get people to let go of popular myths or avoid taking hold of them all together...I just trust that God's word will not return unto Him void.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
9,704
6,134
113
Why is Phoneman's line always saying " the number you have reached is afraid to answer"?
 
G

G2RBeliever

Guest
Why must we be childish and report and ignore others. Is it NOT God that see the heart and is our final judge?
I love the Father,Jesus and the Holy Ghost. I am born again from above!