Not By Works

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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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There were no believers before the cross?
No Christians before the cross. No one was in Christ until their was a body to be in after the resurrection. To get into Christ one must believe in the she’d blood of Jesus.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,773
8,264
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National Library of Medicine ->History and Pathology of Cruicifixion --> Originated with Assyrians

The Times of Israel -->In fact the Assyrians, Babylonians, Persians and Phoenicians all practiced crucifixion

Life Science -->Most likely crucifixion began with the Assyrians

Bible Ca-->History of crucifixion and archaeology proof of the cross-->Derived from the Assyrian practice of impalement and implemented by Alexander the Great

Biblical Archaeology -->The history of crucifixion extends all the way back to the Assyrians

IN FACT, not one source I looked at indicated anyone other than the Assyrians as the originator of Crucifixion....!!!
As they say "the facts don't lie."

Very interesting when one looks at it from a biblical lens as to how this practice was already in place way before Christ's Crucifixion and referenced in the Old Testament.
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
4,330
751
113
You should rethink this now.
Paul was not the first to know, understand the Gospel.
Galatians 1
11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,773
8,264
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Galatians 1
11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
That does not state he was first, only that hear learned about it directly from Christ.

As well he is making the point that this is not some human philosophy, made up by people, but came right from the source and as a revelation.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
10,400
1,494
113
So no one was saved prior to Christ?
Saved? How? I thought only through the shed blood of Christ can one be saved. How could that blood be applied before it was shed? If people were saved before the cross, then why the cross?
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
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He was kept safe from wrath, but no, he was not absent from the body and present with the Lord. He had to wait for the blood to be shed to be saved.
Saved meaning justified, was he justified...... in right standing before God?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
10,400
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That does not state he was first, only that hear learned about it directly from Christ.

As well he is making the point that this is not some human philosophy, made up by people, but came right from the source and as a revelation.
Philippians 4:15 Now ye Philippians know also, that in the beginning of the gospel, when I departed from Macedonia, no church communicated with me as concerning giving and receiving, but ye only.

what gospel? Paul’s gospel message that was given unto him directly by the Lord. Why didn’t the Lord just use Peter or someone else to explain the gospel to Paul if it were the exact same message?
 

Micaiah-imla

Well-known member
Feb 29, 2020
1,353
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Paul’s gospel message that was given unto him directly by the Lord. Why didn’t the Lord just use Peter or someone else to explain the gospel to Paul if it were the exact same message?
Because that is how Jesus chose to convert Paul.

To offer a great testimony of conversion into the faith that was already being preached by the other apostles as well.
 

EleventhHour

Well-known member
Nov 11, 2019
7,773
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Philippians 4:15 Now ye Philippians know also, that in the beginning of the gospel, when I departed from Macedonia, no church communicated with me as concerning giving and receiving, but ye only.

what gospel? Paul’s gospel message that was given unto him directly by the Lord. Why didn’t the Lord just use Peter or someone else to explain the gospel to Paul if it were the exact same message?
Paul had a personality God could use, that is just me thinking though...... but I will state his conversion from what he "was" to what he

"became" is a great testimony to a fledgling, beginning church
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
45,726
19,564
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So, you believe it was the Holy Spirit that moved Judas to betray Jesus and not Satan. You believe it was the Holy Spirit that moved the crowd to cry crucify him!
My only response to this is....this has got to be one of the most idiotic and moronic things you have said.....

Quote a verse that said SATAN put Jesus on the cross.....we will all wait!
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
45,726
19,564
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Absolutely! For four thousand years Satan had been trying to eliminate this promised seed. Now he’s got him hanging on the cross Thinking he’s gained the victory and nullified the promise.
HAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHHHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAH

Folks.....the quote in this post is a fine example of religion for you......!!!!
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
45,726
19,564
113
There were no believers before the cross?
Most of these jokers believed no one was saved until the cross....EVEN though David speaks of his salvation IN THE PRESENT TENSE and JOB fully understood the resurrection, when it would occur and that he would have a new body after the one he had had rotted in the ground.....Rather sickening to be frank <--their unbiblical religionist view!