Not By Works

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Nov 22, 2015
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Workers of iniquity are those that try to create and maintain their own self-righteousness/holiness and not cling to Christ Himself in His finished work on the cross and resurrection.

It is the message of the good news of the grace of God in Christ alone that teaches us how to live godly in this present world. Titus 2:11-12.

Does the knowledge that the blood of Jesus cleanses from all sin because we are in Christ make us want to go out and sin all we want? No, a thousand times no. Jesus said "He who is forgiven much - loves much."

Knowing the real truth of Christ's work of grace and love for us in His great salvation - We run to our Father for everything including anything that hinders His life from being manifested in our lives. We run to the Father knowing we are secure in Christ's work on the cross and resurrection. We run to the Father boldly to find grace and mercy in time of need.

Sinning brings destruction to us in this world. Sinning distorts our view of God, others as well as ourselves. Sinning in all it's forms ( such as legalism, malice and slandering others in the body of Christ is no different then living a homosexual lifestyle ) is falling short of the glory/goodness of God which is sharing in His quality of life. Sinning is just plain stupid when our minds are renewed to see the effects of it.

Knowing that we have complete forgiveness of sins because of Christ's blood will always draw us back to Him for life and true living when we have gone our own way. This holds true for the prodigal son as well as the prodigal older judgmental brother. As it turns out they both did not know the true nature of the Father.


There will be streams of prodigal sons/daughters that have been dis-illusioned because of religious false teachings and false gospels of self-works and works-righteousness that they have been fed from religion coming to the Father for real life as they hear the true gospel of the grace of God in Christ's finished work.

Let's make sure they are met at the door by the Father Himself and not the self-righteous judgmental older brother who it turns out - does not really know the Father for who He really is.

The gospel is the only thing that has the power to effect real change in a believer. The good news of Christ Himself is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes. Rom. 1:16
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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What I find interesting is future sin forgiven and eternal security.
Both these positions lead on to licentiousness simply because the believer is taken
away from the goal of love and that which hinders, sin, and puts their focus on
something else.

this only *
leads* to licentiousness if sin flows out of a persons heart, and their mind seeks to justify wickedness - so that they abuse the grace of God as privilege in order to pursue lust.

your analysis rests on denying all the power of salvation, as though the Spirit does not renew, and the Lord fails to keep His promise to put in the believer a new heart. it assumes that salvation is effected by saying some majick words and/or performing a ritual; that is, that it is a perfunctory matter of having ticked some box and not an actual supernatural intervention in a man, by spirit through soul to the works of the hand and the words of the mouth.

the criticism that
'the security of salvation and the complete atonement for all sin by one sacrifice leads to licentiousness' is formed on the basis of an ineffective & meaningless redemption which has nowhere in it the work and hand of God. licentiousness is only the result if the heart remains uncircumcised and the Lord abandons the ones who have put their trust in Him: but the circumcision of the heart is not ((and cannot be)) done by human hands, so denying that God will work His will in those who have relied on Him to do so is to deny that there is any salvation whatsoever.

it is impossible that the Law and the oblations of human priesthood can cleanse the conscience ((Hebrews 7:18-19, 9:9, 10:1-4, etc))

in freedom wicked works are expressed only if the conscience is not cleansed; if the Lord indeed keeps His covenant that He has declared, to remove the sin of the whole land in a single hour, to put in His people a new heart, to bring back again all who turn to Him, indeed to cause to turn whoever hopes in Him - then freedom produces fruit, not rot.

[HR][/HR]
does God redeem or not? is He mighty to save, or impotent?
this questions settles the matter.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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Chris, read over that again. He who practices righteousness IS (already) righteous. This is confirmation, not a condition.

Those who are born of God (saved) WILL practice righteousness (this is the evidence), not that one practices righteousness in order to be saved. You're getting them backwards.

Those who don't practice righteousness are those that aren't born of God...

V10-12: "In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother. For this is the message that you heard from the beginning, that we should love one another, not as Cain who was of the wicked one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his works were evil and his brother’s righteous"

1 John 2:29: "If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him"
Amen! Excellent post! :)
 
Apr 30, 2016
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The sky is blue....


What happens in some people's minds is this:

Someone makes the statement:

"What a beautiful blue sky the Lord gave us today."

Someone else responds back to the above statement:

"What? The sky is not green- everyone knows that the sky is blue - that is a lie, you are lawless and an enemy of Christ, this is heresy, you want to live like the world, ......and other garbage just like this".

When people have this kind of a mindset - it is impossible to have any kind of a rational discussion with them as they continually "see" something else than what is actually said. They then proceed to talk as if this "made-up thought" is real.

There is something wrong in Denmark as the saying goes.
You can explain it how you want Grace.

Jesus DID NOT preach what modern preachers are preaching.
He preached THE KINGDOM.
We're either a part of it or not.
We either belong to this "country" that Jesus said we are to belong to, or we do not belong to it.

Please read my post no. 14034 again.

Do you not trust Igantius of Antioch?
He KNEW JOHN THE APOSTLE personally.

You trust that guy you posted more?

I trust Ignatius more.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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The forgiveness of sins is the gospel message. All sins except for the sin of unbelief in Christ's sacrifice is done away with at the cross. Behold the Lamb of God which takes away the sin of the world. This truth "conflicts" with our church teachings but its time to be preaching the true gospel so that people can be truly free.

Forgiveness is a done deal - either believe it or don't believe it.

On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

perfect = The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time.
It is continuously happening in the present.

passive = voice =
action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.

Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins
...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins


Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.


Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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Amen! Excellent post! :)
WHY is it excellent?

If those that are born again should practice righteousness,,,

WHY are you afraid to say that it is NECESSARY that it be practiced?

What's the difference if you're going to practice it anyway???
 
Apr 30, 2016
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The forgiveness of sins is the gospel message. All sins except for the sin of unbelief in Christ's sacrifice is done away with at the cross. Behold the Lamb of God which takes away the sin of the world. This truth "conflicts" with our church teachings but its time to be preaching the true gospel so that people can be truly free.

Forgiveness is a done deal - either believe it or don't believe it.

On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

perfect = The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time.
It is continuously happening in the present.

passive = voice =
action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.

Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins
...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins


Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.


Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.
1. There is NO SUCH CONCEPT IN CHRISTIANITY as a "past action that continues into the future".

2. Jesus' work IS FINISHED.
What about YOUR work???

=Please read post no. 14034.
It would behoove you to read it a few times.

WHY do you not agree with those who knew the Apostles?
Do you think YOU know more??
 
Apr 30, 2016
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this only *
leads* to licentiousness if sin flows out of a persons heart, and their mind seeks to justify wickedness - so that they abuse the grace of God as privilege in order to pursue lust.

your analysis rests on denying all the power of salvation, as though the Spirit does not renew, and the Lord fails to keep His promise to put in the believer a new heart. it assumes that salvation is effected by saying some majick words and/or performing a ritual; that is, that it is a perfunctory matter of having ticked some box and not an actual supernatural intervention in a man, by spirit through soul to the works of the hand and the words of the mouth.

the criticism that
'the security of salvation and the complete atonement for all sin by one sacrifice leads to licentiousness' is formed on the basis of an ineffective & meaningless redemption which has nowhere in it the work and hand of God. licentiousness is only the result if the heart remains uncircumcised and the Lord abandons the ones who have put their trust in Him: but the circumcision of the heart is not ((and cannot be)) done by human hands, so denying that God will work His will in those who have relied on Him to do so is to deny that there is any salvation whatsoever.

it is impossible that the Law and the oblations of human priesthood can cleanse the conscience ((Hebrews 7:18-19, 9:9, 10:1-4, etc))

in freedom wicked works are expressed only if the conscience is not cleansed; if the Lord indeed keeps His covenant that He has declared, to remove the sin of the whole land in a single hour, to put in His people a new heart, to bring back again all who turn to Him, indeed to cause to turn whoever hopes in Him - then freedom produces fruit, not rot.

[HR][/HR]
does God redeem or not? is He mighty to save, or impotent?
this questions settles the matter.
Does the New Covenant say it will give everyone a new heart...

OR

Does it say THE LAW will be WRITTEN ON THE HEART???

I'll give no scripture since you're such an expert.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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I trust the Lord Jesus Christ and I also am a firm believer that Jesus is NOT a liar.

Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will be in you forever.

Jesus said that no man can pluck us out of His hands nor the Father's.

Jesus said that all who come to Me - I will not lose one of them. It is My Father's will.

Jesus said I give unto them eternal life and they shall never perish.

Jesus is NOT a liar. We can trust Him. Believe Him and rely totally on Him alone for all things.

Brethren - we are not redeemed until our next failure. The blood of the Lord Jesus Christ speaks of better things.

We have eternal redemption
because of what Christ has already done and the fact that we are one spirit with Him. In Him we have eternal redemption through His blood - not by what we do or don't do.

Hebrews 9:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.


Ephesians 1:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

We have = present tense - present tense is always present tense. When tomorrow comes - it will be present tense then too.

Does this make us want to go out and sin all we want? No, a thousand times No! Of course not - why?

Because "knowing this truth" releases the grace of God in our lives to operate to produce His life in and through us. Jesus said "You shall know the truth and that truth shall make you free."

It's time to "repent and believe the gospel" like Jesus said in Mark 1:15 After all it is not called the "good news" for no reason.

We have a great and wondrous salvation but it is all in Christ and what He has already done. We receive this all by grace through faith. As we have received Christ - so we walk in Him in like manner.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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WHY is it excellent?

If those that are born again should practice righteousness,,,

WHY are you afraid to say that it is NECESSARY that it be practiced?

What's the difference if you're going to practice it anyway???
Because as Katy correctly pointed out to Chris, "He who practices righteousness IS (already) righteous. This is confirmation, not a condition. Those who are born of God (saved) WILL practice righteousness (this is the evidence), not that one practices righteousness in order to be saved."

Those who are born of God practice righteousness BECAUSE they are righteous and not in order to become righteous. Certain people get this backwards and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture. Practicing righteousness is not forced or legalistic for those who are born of God.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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I trust the Lord Jesus Christ and I also am a firm believer that Jesus is NOT a liar.

Jesus aid that the Holy Spirit will be in you forever.

Jesus said that no man can pluck us out of His hands nor the Father's.

Jesus said that all who come to Me - I will not lose one of them. It is My Father's will.

Jesus said I give unto them eternal life and they shall never perish.

Jesus is NOT a liar. We can trust Him. Believe Him and rely totally on Him alone for all things.

Brethren - we are not redeemed until our next failure. The blood of the Lord Jesus Christ speaks of better things.

We have eternal redemption
because of what Christ has already done and the fact that we are one spirit with Him. In Him we have eternal redemption through His blood - not by what we do or don't do.

Hebrews 9:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.


Ephesians 1:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace

Colossians 1:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

We have = present tense - present tense is always present tense. When tomorrow comes - it will be present tense then too.

Does this make us want to go out and sin all we want? No, a thousand times No! Of course not - why?

Because "knowing this truth" releases the grace of God in our lives to operate to produce His life in and through us. Jesus said "You shall know the truth and that truth shall make you free."

It's time to "repent and believe the gospel" like Jesus said in Mark 1:15 After all it is not called the "good news" for no reason.

We have a great and wondrous salvation but it is all in Christ and what He has already done. We receive this all by grace through faith. As we have received Christ - so we walk in Him in like manner.
Sounds nice.

But does it agree with post no. 14034?

THOSE ARE THE EXPERTS.

NOT what YOU think or post.

Scripture can be taken out of context, as you well know.
The early theologians knew Christianity much better than the modern concetps that have crept into the Church.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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Because as Katy correctly pointed out to Chris, "He who practices righteousness IS (already) righteous. This is confirmation, not a condition. Those who are born of God (saved) WILL practice righteousness (this is the evidence), not that one practices righteousness in order to be saved."

Those who are born of God practice righteousness BECAUSE they are righteous and not in order to become righteous. Certain people get this backwards and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture. Practicing righteousness is not forced or legalistic for those who are born of God.
Unfortunately in the false religion of works-righteousness ( which is the complete opposite of faith righteousness in Christ's finished work alone which is the true gospel message ) - they must "do things" in order to obtain and maintain their own righteousness.

Romans 10:2-4 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge.

[SUP]3 [/SUP] For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.

[SUP]4 [/SUP] For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

The law is the "doing of things or the not doing of things" to achieve and maintain righteousness. In the gospel - believers in Christ receive the gift of His righteousness by faith in His grace that He has already done for us.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
WHY is it excellent?

If those that are born again should practice righteousness,,,

WHY are you afraid to say that it is NECESSARY that it be practiced?

What's the difference if you're going to practice it anyway???
I am actually confused as to why you can. Not see it,

Practicing righteousness as a result of salvation and practicing righteousness because it is necessary in order to earn or maintain salvation are two different things

the first is cause and affect, the person is born again, and the resulting faith and dwelling Holy Spirit cause a person the practice his or her new nature, which is righteousness (the nature of God, his redeemer, savior, intercession, teacher and father)

the second is legalistic, self righteous person who is trying to earn something he can never earn, thus rejecting the very cross that has the powers to save them completely, but can not because the person insists he must work to earn it, thus rejecting grace.

Romans 1:16[ The Just Live by Faith ] For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power ofGod to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.

1 Peter 1:5
who are kept by the power of God through faith for salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
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1. There is NO SUCH CONCEPT IN CHRISTIANITY as a "past action that continues into the future".

2. Jesus' work IS FINISHED.
What about YOUR work???

=Please read post no. 14034.
It would behoove you to read it a few times.

WHY do you not agree with those who knew the Apostles?
Do you think YOU know more??
The fact that you know nothing about Greek grammar is all that is clear here!

There most definitely is a tense in Greek - the perfect tense - which is a form of past tense with effects continuing into the future.
The fact that you don't realise this fact this does not invalidate its existence.

I am pretty sure that the instances quoted to you concerning the use of this tense in the NT and its theological implications are exactly correct.

I say again, ignorance on your part does not invalidate actual reality - all it does is show up the ignorance.
There are plenty of independent resources that will confirm for you the use of the perfect tense in the NT and the theology that it informs.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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Because as Katy correctly pointed out to Chris, "He who practices righteousness IS (already) righteous. This is confirmation, not a condition. Those who are born of God (saved) WILL practice righteousness (this is the evidence), not that one practices righteousness in order to be saved."

Those who are born of God practice righteousness BECAUSE they are righteous and not in order to become righteous. Certain people get this backwards and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture. Practicing righteousness is not forced or legalistic for those who are born of God.
NO!

It is NOT a confirmation.

GOD HAS CONDITIONS.

There are conditions to belonging to the Kingdom of God.







Matthew 6:33 ESV / 117 helpful votes

But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

John 18:36 ESV / 83 helpful votes

Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.”

Romans 14:17 ESV / 79 helpful votes

For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Mark 1:15 ESV / 74 helpful votes

And saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”

Luke 17:20-21 ESV / 64 helpful votes

Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, “The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed, nor will they say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or ‘There!’ for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.”

1 Corinthians 6:9 ESV / 44 helpful votes

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,

Matthew 6:9-13 ESV / 41 helpful votes

Pray then like this: “Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Revelation 21:1-4 ESV / 37 helpful votes

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God. He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”

Matthew 16:19 ESV / 36 helpful votes

I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

Acts 28:31 ESV / 31 helpful votes

Proclaiming the kingdom of God and teaching about the Lord Jesus Christ with all boldness and without hindrance.



Romans 2:6-8 ESV / 28 helpful votes

He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
Matthew 25:34 ESV / 28 helpful votes

Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

Psalm 103:19 ESV / 27 helpful votes

The Lord has established his throne in the heavens, and his kingdom rules over all.

Daniel 7:27 ESV / 26 helpful votes

And the kingdom and the dominion and the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High; their kingdom shall be an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey them.’


Luke 13:28-29 ESV / 25 helpful votes

In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out. And people will come from east and west, and from north and south, and recline at table in the kingdom of God.


1 Corinthians 6:10 ESV / 22 helpful votes

Nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

John 14:6 ESV / 21 helpful votes

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

John 11:25-26 ESV / 19 helpful votes

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

1 Corinthians 15:50 ESV / 18 helpful votes

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

Revelation 21:3-4 ESV / 16 helpful votes

And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God. He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”

Acts 28:23 ESV / 16 helpful votes

When they had appointed a day for him, they came to him at his lodging in greater numbers. From morning till evening he expounded to them, testifying to the kingdom of God and trying to convince them about Jesus both from the Law of Moses and from the Prophets.

Matthew 5:8 ESV / 16 helpful votes

“Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.

Psalm 115:16 ESV / 16 helpful votes

The heavens are the Lord's heavens, but the earth he has given to the children of man.

Galatians 3:27-29 ESV / 14 helpful votes

For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Galatians 1:8-9 ESV / 14 helpful votes

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.

Romans 5:8 ESV / 14 helpful votes

But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

John 6:50-71 ESV / 14 helpful votes

This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.” The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day. ...

Matthew 5:5 ESV / 14 helpful votes

“Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.

2 Peter 3:13 ESV / 13 helpful votes

But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.

James 2:20-24 ESV / 13 helpful votes

Do you want to be shown, you foolish person, that faith apart from works is useless? Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar? You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by his works; and the Scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness”—and he was called a friend of God. You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 ESV / 13 helpful votes

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

Romans 14:17-19 ESV / 13 helpful votes

For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. Whoever thus serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding.

John 6:67-71 ESV / 12 helpful votes

So Jesus said to the Twelve, “Do you want to go away as well?” Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life, and we have believed, and have come to know, that you are the Holy One of God.” Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.” He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the Twelve, was going to betray him.

John 5:24 ESV / 12 helpful votes

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

John 3:13 ESV / 12 helpful votes

No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

Matthew 18:4 ESV / 12 helpful votes

Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 13:47-50 ESV / 12 helpful votes

“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was thrown into the sea and gathered fish of every kind. When it was full, men drew it ashore and sat down and sorted the good into containers but threw away the bad. So it will be at the close of the age. The angels will come out and separate the evil from the righteous and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Romans 4:13 ESV / 11 helpful votes

For the promise to Abraham and his offspring that he would be heir of the world did not come through the law but through the righteousness of faith.

Acts 2:34 ESV / 11 helpful votes

For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “‘The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand,

Luke 17:21 ESV / 11 helpful votes

Nor will they say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or ‘There!’ for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.”

Acts 19:8 ESV / 10 helpful votes

And he entered the synagogue and for three months spoke boldly, reasoning and persuading them about the kingdom of God.

Amos 9:11 ESV / 10 helpful votes

“In that day I will raise up the booth of David that is fallen and repair its breaches, and raise up its ruins and rebuild it as in the days of old,

Isaiah 45:18 ESV / 10 helpful votes

For thus says the Lord, who created the heavens (he is God!), who formed the earth and made it (he established it; he did not create it empty, he formed it to be inhabited!): “I am the Lord, and there is no other.

Revelation 3:21 ESV / 9 helpful votes

The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.

1 Peter 2:1-25 ESV / 9 helpful votes

So put away all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander. Like newborn infants, long for the pure spiritual milk, that by it you may grow up into salvation— if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is good. As you come to him, a living stone rejected by men but in the sight of God chosen and precious, you yourselves like living stones are being built up as a spiritual house, to be a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. ...

2 Samuel 7:12-16 ESV / 9 helpful votes

When your days are fulfilled and you lie down with your fathers, I will raise up your offspring after you, who shall come from your body, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. I will be to him a father, and he shall be to me a son. When he commits iniquity, I will discipline him with the rod of men, with the stripes of the sons of men, but my steadfast love will not depart from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I put away from before you. And your house and your kingdom shall be made sure forever before me. Your throne shall be established forever.’”

Acts 1:6 ESV / 8 helpful votes

So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?”

John 3:1-36 ESV / 8 helpful votes

Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. This man came to Jesus by night and said to him, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him.” Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.” Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?” Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. ...

Luke 6:20 ESV / 8 helpful votes

And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said: “Blessed are you who are poor, for yours is the kingdom of God.

Ezekiel 36:24-28 ESV / 8 helpful votes

I will take you from the nations and gather you from all the countries and bring you into your own land. I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules. You shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers, and you shall be my people, and I will be your God.

Psalm 37:9 ESV / 8 helpful votes

For the evildoers shall be cut off, but those who wait for the Lord shall inherit the land.

Revelation 1:5-6 ESV / 7 helpful votes

And from Jesus Christ the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of kings on earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

Jude 1:7 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.

Hebrews 12:28 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Therefore let us be grateful for receiving a kingdom that cannot be shaken, and thus let us offer to God acceptable worship, with reverence and awe,

Hebrews 12:22 ESV / 7 helpful votes

But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering,

Romans 1:24-27 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

Romans 1:1-32 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the holy Scriptures, concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh and was declared to be the Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord, through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith for the sake of his name among all the nations, ...

John 17:24 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Father, I desire that they also, whom you have given me, may be with me where I am, to see my glory that you have given me because you loved me before the foundation of the world.

Mark 10:25 ESV / 7 helpful votes

It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”

Mark 9:1 ESV / 7 helpful votes

And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power.”

Matthew 13:11 ESV / 7 helpful votes

And he answered them, “To you it has been given to know the secrets of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.

Matthew 11:28 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Matthew 7:13-14 ESV / 7 helpful votes

“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

Matthew 5:20 ESV / 7 helpful votes

For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 4:17 ESV / 7 helpful votes

From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”

Genesis 13:14-15 ESV / 7 helpful votes

The Lord said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him, “Lift up your eyes and look from the place where you are, northward and southward and eastward and westward, for all the land that you see I will give to you and to your offspring forever.

Revelation 21:3 ESV / 6 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God.

James 2:25-26 ESV / 6 helpful votes

And in the same way was not also Rahab the prostitute justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way? For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead.

Titus 3:3 ESV / 6 helpful votes

For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one ano
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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WHY is it excellent?

If those that are born again should practice righteousness,,,

WHY are you afraid to say that it is NECESSARY that it be practiced?

What's the difference if you're going to practice it anyway???
The difference is the Spirit. Necessary takes it into the realm of works and out of the realm of grace.

Jesus remarked that the Jews being evil knew how to do good works.

Mt 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Israel had conditions for living in peace in the land given her "the promised kingdom of Israeli"

they were here born into that kingdom by birth, just like we are born into the kingdom of God by new birth, but have conditions if we are to enjoy all it has to offer here on earth
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
This refers to Jesus imputed righteousness.

Why do you fight against the statement?

You say you believe in imputed righteousness.

Before we can learn to live godly lives we have to be sealed with the Holy Spirit.

The only difference is when do you count someone saved?

When they receive the Holy spirit or when they are glorified/resurrected upon Christ's return?

Mainly it seems you are arguing that people can't know they will be saved until judgement day?

While others say that you can have assurance that you are God's child when you receive His Holy spirit. That what God starts God will finish and is able to save someone fully.

Matthew 6:33 ESV

But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.