Not By Works

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oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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How do you interpret 1 John? I have read through it before and don't think I understand it all. Certain things sound like they could be applied in a subjective way such as doing righteousness.
All our Lord requires of us is to continue walking in the light. It is not a grievous thing. Actually it is rather warm and wonderful.:) We are blessed to have such a high calling in Christ.
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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Yes they are. It is such a shame that they neglected their Salvation and did not abide in Him.
It is such a shame that those who believe in Christ , believe Christ will cast them out when Christ said He never would , that is truly sad...
...xox...
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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Abiding is not about salvation.
John
15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.

You are correct in your assertion that vv.2-4 speak of fruit. I agree with that, but v.6 speaks of the end of the man himself, not just his fruit.
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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John
15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.

You are correct in your assertion that vv.2-4 speak of fruit. I agree with that, but v.6 speaks of the end of the man himself, not just his fruit.
There are those like Judas who who walked around with Jesus , but he was never in Jesus...
There are many who " claim " to be in Chris but are not , these are cut from the branch , the ones who take up space and are useless , bearing no fruit , the hanger ons...
...xox...
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
John
15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.

You are correct in your assertion that vv.2-4 speak of fruit. I agree with that, but v.6 speaks of the end of the man himself, not just his fruit.
Did you know that believers do not always abide, sometimes they actually do not abide .... abiding is not about salvation.

It states "men" cast them into fire ... it does not state God.
So what is this passage really about? :unsure:
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
There are those like Judas who who walked around with Jesus , but he was never in Jesus...
There are many who " claim " to be in Chris but are not , these are cut from the branch , the ones who take up space and are useless , bearing no fruit , the hanger ons...
...xox...

Many branches do not bear fruit but they are not useless and are quite necessary to the health of the tree.
Abiding is not about salvation
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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The unbelievers...
Please stop chopping my words to make it look like I am agreeing with you because I am not...
I believe I am secure in Christ until He calls me home , I believe He is the One who keeps me...
You believe the opposite , you believe we can lose our Salvation , I do not believe this...
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
There are those like Judas who who walked around with Jesus , but he was never in Jesus...
There are many who " claim " to be in Chris but are not , these are cut from the branch , the ones who take up space and are useless , bearing no fruit , the hanger ons...
...xox...
Not sure which verse you are considering, but they are not "cut" but "lifted up" that is the correct understanding in Greek.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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Did you know that believers do not always abide, sometimes they actually do not abide .... abiding is not about salvation.

It states "men" cast them into fire ... it does not state God.
So what is this passage really about? :unsure:
It is about fruit bearing and the end of believers who do not do it. We agree on 99%. Who do you believe these men represent? What do you believe fire represents? You and I both have blessed assurance, but some have no desire to do more than what they feel is the absolute minimum. God knows who they are. He will say to them, "I never knew you. Depart into the fire." Godspeed, dear sister.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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Yes they are. It is such a shame that they neglected their Salvation and did not abide in Him.

You have to be careful, not to limit it to ONE denomination, because the LORD walks among 7 distinctly different Denominations or TYPES of Churches in the first three chapters of Revelation.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
10,969
4,074
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You have to be careful, not to limit it to ONE denomination, because the LORD walks among 7 distinctly different Denominations or TYPES of Churches in the first three chapters of Revelation.
It is not like we would call a Denomination. It is Types of Churches. All Evangelicals would be one TYPE, all Ritualistic Orders of Service would be another TYPE, all Liberals would be another TYPE, etc.
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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Not sure which verse you are considering, but they are not "cut" but "lifted up" that is the correct understanding in Greek.
Yes I agree , when we are weak , we are lifted up , also we are pruned by our Father , cutting away our bad attitudes etc...
But I was also talking about those who " claim " to be in Christ , they may look like christians , but God knows those who are His , for He is the gardener of the true Vine...
...xox...
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Yes I agree , when we are weak , we are lifted up , also we are pruned by our Father , cutting away our bad attitudes etc...
But I was also talking about those who " claim " to be in Christ , they may look like christians , but God knows those who are His , for He is the gardener of the true Vine...
...xox...
I do not think the passage is about those who are not Christians.. that is a modern day lens... Jesus was speaking to Jews about the Jews.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Not sure which verse you are considering, but they are not "cut" but "lifted up" that is the correct understanding in Greek.
What about the verse where branches are thrown into the fire and burned? John 15:6~

If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away
and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned.
 
Mar 14, 2011
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How do you interpret 1 John? I have read through it before and don't think I understand it all. Certain things sound like they could be applied in a subjective way such as doing righteousness.
I think it is complex. much like his gospel. and Is written to do just as he said give Gods children confidence of they position in Christ,