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E
Yep. The 12 tribes, His bretheren, WHo were the first to be called the church, after Jesus ascended into heaven.
James was an elder of the church in jerusalem an apostle to the jewish part of the church. who had the same issues the gentile parts of the Church had. They are no different than us The new covenant had already been established, The old was already done away by the cross.
That does not discount the fact his told us, He spoke of those in THAT PASSAGE who CLAIMED TO HAVE FAITH.
He never said they had any faith at all. Thats a lie. A dead faith is no faith. whether your a jew, a gentile or whoever you are.
James was an elder of the church in jerusalem an apostle to the jewish part of the church. who had the same issues the gentile parts of the Church had. They are no different than us The new covenant had already been established, The old was already done away by the cross.
That does not discount the fact his told us, He spoke of those in THAT PASSAGE who CLAIMED TO HAVE FAITH.
He never said they had any faith at all. Thats a lie. A dead faith is no faith. whether your a jew, a gentile or whoever you are.
You give man a lot of credit. What ever book you got that from is in error. James is writing to the twelve tribes scattered abroad but not specifically during the time of Jacobs trouble. The twelve tribes were scattered during the time when James penned this epistle. Scattered into the Roman empire and the known world from previous captivities.
If the book of James were prophetic it would not be confined to chronological order as you wish to ascribe to it.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
If the book of James were prophetic it would not be confined to chronological order as you wish to ascribe to it.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
E
where do you get this stuff from?? This makes no sense.
1. It was written by James, an apostle to the jewish church, to the jewish church.
2. It was written post the ressurection and ascention of Christ. So james is speaking to them as the church, Not jews.He just wrte to the jews because had a place in his heart from them (plus he was their apostle)
3. It was not written to place people under law. Or under the old ways, Jesus already fulfiled the law.
B
I think I see a difference in understanding of 'faith' here.
Some folks communicate that a dead faith is no faith--this would imply that faith in a false god is no faith.
On the other hand, other folks understand faith to simply be belief or 'complete trust'--which leads to statements such as: 'Muslims have real faith'
I see the word 'faith' being used to carry multiple meanings in a couple of threads lately.
--Perhaps someone could define 'biblical faith'?
Some folks communicate that a dead faith is no faith--this would imply that faith in a false god is no faith.
On the other hand, other folks understand faith to simply be belief or 'complete trust'--which leads to statements such as: 'Muslims have real faith'
I see the word 'faith' being used to carry multiple meanings in a couple of threads lately.
--Perhaps someone could define 'biblical faith'?
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E
Yes, as we saw earlier, someone who said belief and faith are the same.
I believe the faith scripture talks about is the trust and assurance in christ.
Noah trusted God, and built the ark
Abraham trusted God could raise his son from the dead, so he offered him up
David trusted God, and slew Goliath.
Faith is no dead. it acts. it does not stand still
If you have faith God can save you, and will save you, You will receive his gift
If you just believe maybe he will do it. You will not recieve his gift. You may think you have, you may claim you have, But you in reality have not. God is not going to give his gift of eternal life to someone who does not trust him (has yet to fully repent)
Paul spoke alot to people who had faith in the law. And not God. so he fought works with faith alone. James spoke against people who maye have said some sinners prayer, but never fully trusted in God. they believed, but they had yet to repent. Thats why there were no actions (works) which would naturally flow from faith.
Christ's faith justifies the believer.
Galatians 2:16, "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified."
Galatians 2:20, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."
Christ's faith not only justifies the believer, but it's the faith the believer now lives in. Even when my individual faith waivers, Christ's faith never waivers. Thank God I'm not justified by my own individual puny faith.
Galatians 2:16, "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified."
Galatians 2:20, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."
Christ's faith not only justifies the believer, but it's the faith the believer now lives in. Even when my individual faith waivers, Christ's faith never waivers. Thank God I'm not justified by my own individual puny faith.
Romans 1:17, "For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith."
Notice that something has changed. The Holy Spirit has led Paul to exclude the word his from the OT Scripture.
Habakkuk 2:4, "Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith."
In the OT a man was justified and lived in his own faith. After the cross, a believer is justified by the faith of Christ and lives by the faith of Christ.
Galatians 2:20, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."
Notice that something has changed. The Holy Spirit has led Paul to exclude the word his from the OT Scripture.
Habakkuk 2:4, "Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith."
In the OT a man was justified and lived in his own faith. After the cross, a believer is justified by the faith of Christ and lives by the faith of Christ.
Galatians 2:20, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me."
Sometimes I am poor in describing so let's go to Scripture.
Galatians 2:16, "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified."
The faith of Christ is given to the believer in Jesus Christ, the gospel spoken about Him. Once a man believes the gospel, the faith of Christ now justifies that man forever. Should a justified believer go on to good works? Absolutely, he should. But the presence or absence of good works thereafter does nothing to justify that man. A believer, once justified, is now working and laboring for the Lord and will be held accountable at the Judgment Seat of Christ. That's why going on to good works is important to a believer. Inheritance and rewards are at stake, not salvation.
Galatians 2:16, "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified."
The faith of Christ is given to the believer in Jesus Christ, the gospel spoken about Him. Once a man believes the gospel, the faith of Christ now justifies that man forever. Should a justified believer go on to good works? Absolutely, he should. But the presence or absence of good works thereafter does nothing to justify that man. A believer, once justified, is now working and laboring for the Lord and will be held accountable at the Judgment Seat of Christ. That's why going on to good works is important to a believer. Inheritance and rewards are at stake, not salvation.
I would say yes. But my whole point about James is he's talking to a different audience addressing their individual faith and works to justify man before God. Students of Scripture have never been successful making James a Christian epistle. James is writing to the twelve tribes not the body of Christ. That's where most disagreements come in. I love the book of James. We can reap some good stuff to apply to our lives, but I read it with the understanding that it's not written directly to me as doctrine, a church age believer. I never try to make James and Paul agree.
