Only The Cross

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Aug 4, 2021
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#41
This is you.

""""""I have not finished the bible yet. Covered like 25% perhaps. Your verse changes nothing for me."""""

So, i meet a lot of people who are just getting started in their walk of faith, who have decided they are the final authority.

Listed below are 3 verses you need to bond with.......... as if you can master their LIGHT....then they can protect you from dark lights who will lead you into error and keep you there.
Im not one of those, but you have no way to understand this yet.

Hebrews 13:9
1st Corinthians 11:1
Romans 3:21-28
Thank you kindly for the bookrecomendations. Covered them, but will reread them perhaps, important ones. But I read the whole thing, not portions. Doing Joel now, and want to do pentacost after that. Listening to an inspirational song from Cece alled fire, so doing that and the lazaruz. A great album that points me to important books.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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#42
Thank you kindly for the bookrecomendations. Covered them, but will reread them perhaps, important ones. But I read the whole thing, not portions. Doing Joel now, and want to do pentacost after that. Listening to an inspirational song from Cece alled fire, so doing that and the lazaruz. A great album that points me to important books.
Study Paul.
He wrote most of the NT and all of the Church Doctrine.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
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#43
I cannot agree to this at all. Jesus points to God, and salvation is not a freebie kind of a thing. I have to suffer some, I have to sacrifice some, it is not convenient in all aspects. But that is the narrow path. Cannot stray of the path, and do everything I used to do as an atheist. For instance, weed, is that allowed? I am not sure. I talked some about this with a former relative yesterday, we seemed to agree that it was OOK since it is natural. But is it allowed in scripture? I do not think I can smoke weed again, because we are also told to be of clear mind. Have that now, but I used to have some concentrationissues in the past, and weed did actually help me focus better. So I do not know, the verdict is not in. I also slipped a bit back and did use cusswords a few times, and that is not allowed of course. You must not break the commandments, how can you say that we can just violate them? If I violate them, I invalidate my faith.
I think what you are sensing here is that it is not the cross and the cross alone that is the basis of salvation:

I Corinthians 15
14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

It is not faith alone in the cross of Jesus. It is believing the gospel = the good news of the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus.

In the sermons in Acts the disciples mention the resurrection more often than they do the crucifixion.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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#44
In the sermons in Acts the disciples mention the resurrection more often than they do the crucifixion.
The "preaching of the Cross", is the Gospel.
Where did Christ die?
Why did Christ die on the Cross. /???
If there is no Cross, does the resurrection matter?
See the POINT?
Listen.....
Paul said...>"Christ sent me not to water baptize, but to preach the Cross".
Why?
Because "the CROSS is the power of God, unto Salvation". Romans 1:16

Salvation is given to us by God, as Christ on the Cross.
 
Aug 4, 2021
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#45
I think what you are sensing here is that it is not the cross and the cross alone that is the basis of salvation:

I Corinthians 15
14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

It is not faith alone in the cross of Jesus. It is believing the gospel = the good news of the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus.

In the sermons in Acts the disciples mention the resurrection more often than they do the crucifixion.
Yes, yes, you get part of what I am trying to say. Jesus whow us the way, by pain on the cross illustrating our worldly lives, then pointing us towards the heavens and God, by ressurection and ascending heaven calmly and peaceful. The focus must be on the ressurection. For me. I just conversate about it, and cannot cite all verses, I stumbled into faith while not seeking it. I just heard a lot scripture and reasons for faith on political channels, and interviews with folks. So I contemplated some of the stuff, and it tung true to me. So I sought, found, and started reading. I do not even remember all the verses and interpretations from back over the years that changed me. Not a communal thing for me, I do not fit in some box I am told to be in. I am not affiliated with any hurch yet. And probably will not ever. Do not seem as a requirement to me. Gods church is everywhere, me and you are at church right now. Went straight to God, not through Jesus as others seem to do. So, backwards, going back to the Jesus stories after that, and later to God again. If you understand the path.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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#46
Yes, yes, you get part of what I am trying to say. Jesus whow us the way, by pain on the cross illustrating our worldly lives, then pointing us towards the heavens and God, by ressurection and ascending heaven calmly and peaceful. The focus must be on the ressurection. For me. I just conversate about it, and cannot cite all verses, I stumbled into faith while not seeking it. I just heard a lot scripture and reasons for faith on political channels, and interviews with folks. So I contemplated some of the stuff, and it tung true to me. So I sought, found, and started reading. I do not even remember all the verses and interpretations from back over the years that changed me. Not a communal thing for me, I do not fit in some box I am told to be in. I am not affiliated with any hurch yet. And probably will not ever. Do not seem as a requirement to me. Gods church is everywhere, me and you are at church right now. Went straight to God, not through Jesus as others seem to do. So, backwards, going back to the Jesus stories after that, and later to God again. If you understand the path.
-
 
S

SophieT

Guest
#47
The cross was just two pieces of wood tied together which the Romans used to crucify, murder, thousands of people.

IT IS ONLY JESUS that is our salvation!

ONLY JESUS! What He did on the cross established the New Covenant Grace, and the precious blood He shed IS WHAT MAKES us worthy to become the children of God.

THE CROSS DOES NOT SAVE US!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I don't know what's up with people thinking the op said anything different.

In fact, he emphasized that Jesus and ONLY Jesus is our salvation.

go figure
 
S

SophieT

Guest
#48
I do not believe the verse is speaking about Satan being the God of this world. Satan is called the Prince of the world but not the God of it. Certainly much of the world worships Satan in one form or another but in order to know whom is being spoken of we simply have to use the context:



2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

So who was it that "blinded the minds of them which believe not"?

It was God.

dude if it was God blinding their eyes He was wasting His time since they already did not believe

the god of this world is the devil whether or not you have been enlightened in that area or not does not matter...perhaps...better not say what I'm thinking :oops: :censored:
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
4,279
1,411
113
#49
Yes, yes, you get part of what I am trying to say. Jesus whow us the way, by pain on the cross illustrating our worldly lives, then pointing us towards the heavens and God, by ressurection and ascending heaven calmly and peaceful. The focus must be on the ressurection. For me. I just conversate about it, and cannot cite all verses, I stumbled into faith while not seeking it. I just heard a lot scripture and reasons for faith on political channels, and interviews with folks. So I contemplated some of the stuff, and it tung true to me. So I sought, found, and started reading. I do not even remember all the verses and interpretations from back over the years that changed me. Not a communal thing for me, I do not fit in some box I am told to be in. I am not affiliated with any hurch yet. And probably will not ever. Do not seem as a requirement to me. Gods church is everywhere, me and you are at church right now. Went straight to God, not through Jesus as others seem to do. So, backwards, going back to the Jesus stories after that, and later to God again. If you understand the path.
I think you are getting it:

- the death of Christ on the cross is pivotal and the key to forgiveness of sin and redemption
- the resurrection of Christ gives us the hope and the power to be able to live above sin in this present world
- together they form a solid basis for salvation

But I would encourage you to find others with whom you can fellowship: iron sharpens iron - the Spirit in you speaks to others, and the Spirit in others speaks to you: having brothers around me has been a huge blessing in my own Christian journey. It does not need to be (and maybe shouldn't be) what most consider formal church. The church (ekklesia) is wherever a group of called out ones gather together for encouragement and nourishment.
 

Chester

Senior Member
May 23, 2016
4,279
1,411
113
#50
The "preaching of the Cross", is the Gospel.
Where did Christ die?
Why did Christ die on the Cross. /???
If there is no Cross, does the resurrection matter?
See the POINT?
Listen.....
Paul said...>"Christ sent me not to water baptize, but to preach the Cross".
Why?
Because "the CROSS is the power of God, unto Salvation". Romans 1:16

Salvation is given to us by God, as Christ on the Cross.

If there is no resurrection, does the cross matter? Both are critical and nonnegotiable parts of our salvation.
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,874
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#51
You are wrong again.

Read 2nd Corinthians 4:4

"""""""In whom the god of this world (satan) = hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them."""""
The God of world is God. He blinds people:

Joh 12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
Joh 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
Joh 12:40 He (God) hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
 
S

SophieT

Guest
#52
The God of world is God. He blinds people:
I sure do hope you are not out there teaching people

you have composted compiled scriptures you believe show that God is doing the devil's work. He is not

as I stated previously, why would God blind people that are already blind? wakey do dah
 
Aug 4, 2021
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#53
I think you are getting it:

- the death of Christ on the cross is pivotal and the key to forgiveness of sin and redemption
- the resurrection of Christ gives us the hope and the power to be able to live above sin in this present world
- together they form a solid basis for salvation

But I would encourage you to find others with whom you can fellowship: iron sharpens iron - the Spirit in you speaks to others, and the Spirit in others speaks to you: having brothers around me has been a huge blessing in my own Christian journey. It does not need to be (and maybe shouldn't be) what most consider formal church. The church (ekklesia) is wherever a group of called out ones gather together for encouragement and nourishment.
Actually that is not quite how I get it. The death on the cross is pivotal, a parabel to our torment on earth, or terrific lives which is another test of a different sort that may make it even harder for us to turn to God, because it is so great on earth. So the hardest tests, might be given to people like Michael Jordan, Trump, Elon musk. But for us others with some bad stuff to go through as our tests, this is to signify our worldly struggles. My take on it, is that I am not granted forgiveness from his act, and not redemption. I am offered the opportunity to seek it and ask for it.

Here is where it gets a bit onfusing and contradictory for you maybe. I must ask God for forgiveness and redemption before I can be granted it. I have not done that. But as for me among people, I cannot beg for forgiveness, or be begged for it, it must be offered freely, without demand. Because it can only be given, not demanded amongs us. And for me, this speaks of how to be christlike among my fellow man on earth, Jesus did not demand, he gave freely, so we have to do it freely here, but when we seek God, we must beg. We must truly mean it, and stick to it, if we make the ask. And before that, we had better act christlike here on earth to others, which to me means truth, to be real with the people around me. Very simple really. Forgiveness and sin is months down the line, perhaps I never even get there. To live right, that is the pointing to God, and pointing us to my last paragraph. And points us to relief, of not being bound to this world by earthly desires that are like chains keeping us from God.



Yes, the ressurection of Jesus gives us the hope and power to be able to live above sin in this present world. And to quote an atheist philosopher on that. He said that there was no meaning to life or in life, but there is sufficient meaning to fill your life with to make it meaningful". It never left me from my atheist days, and it fits with the bible. Even if he meant fun stuff. This means God to, if that is the meaning to you.

Thank you for the advice on church, but no such church were I live. 3 hours to such a church, and it is in another language. AndI do not need it now. Have not read the bible yet. If I do it, I will just join a local private church closer by, which is a long way away, 1 hour. Only statechurch here, and they have erased a lot of the bible, not joining such a church, rather be outside then. Would be condoning blasphemy. . Few private churches here, would be easiest to start my own really. But I have not read the book yet, so I think it would be wrong to do so. You are my community. Never surrounded myself with christians in my life. I do not know any. All the people in my life has been atheists, as was IBeing very literal about the bible is frowned upon, and kind of not accepted here. Regarded as hatespeech. I get in trouble if I were to say that such and such is a mortal sin, considered rude, to not lie and condone stuff like that. Being against abortion is a big nono. Best not to speak of it really.
 
Aug 4, 2021
586
185
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#54
I think you are getting it:

- the death of Christ on the cross is pivotal and the key to forgiveness of sin and redemption
- the resurrection of Christ gives us the hope and the power to be able to live above sin in this present world
- together they form a solid basis for salvation

But I would encourage you to find others with whom you can fellowship: iron sharpens iron - the Spirit in you speaks to others, and the Spirit in others speaks to you: having brothers around me has been a huge blessing in my own Christian journey. It does not need to be (and maybe shouldn't be) what most consider formal church. The church (ekklesia) is wherever a group of called out ones gather together for encouragement and nourishment.
Forgot a point. I have not read about the pentacostle yet, just heard about it. So I must read it for myself first, after another book I currently read. I am skipping around and doing books people say is important. But I want to do the historic facts of the empire that overtook bablon 600 BC, then go throughh that till 100 AD. Then do it chronological learning about the two herodes, and go through the betrayal of Jesus, the persecution, and the journey that lead to the ressurection. And then I think I want to go onto the apostles that lived on, and got their own diciples after that, and move off the bible researching that stuff. Because this seems to be important. I never knew the apostles had their own diciples, this was news to me. After that, I may have more answers for myself, and can opine better to others. If I miss a step, please tell me some other books I should read before that.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
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#55
Forgot a point. I have not read about the pentacostle yet, just heard about it. So I must read it for myself first, after another book I currently read. I am skipping around and doing books people say is important. But I want to do the historic facts of the empire that overtook bablon 600 BC, then go throughh that till 100 AD. Then do it chronological learning about the two herodes, and go through the betrayal of Jesus, the persecution, and the journey that lead to the ressurection. And then I think I want to go onto the apostles that lived on, and got their own diciples after that, and move off the bible researching that stuff. Because this seems to be important. I never knew the apostles had their own diciples, this was news to me. After that, I may have more answers for myself, and can opine better to others. If I miss a step, please tell me some other books I should read before that.
If you want to cut to the chase, read the commentary on the first five books of scripture by Tom Bradford. The reason for this commentary above all others is that you are taking advantage of his eight years of study of Hebrew culture and history along with scripture. He relates history, all scripture, and shows how the old and new testament correlate. It is not a commentary on theory and interpretation, Tom warns against that.
 
Aug 4, 2021
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#56
If you want to cut to the chase, read the commentary on the first five books of scripture by Tom Bradford. The reason for this commentary above all others is that you are taking advantage of his eight years of study of Hebrew culture and history along with scripture. He relates history, all scripture, and shows how the old and new testament correlate. It is not a commentary on theory and interpretation, Tom warns against that.
Not awere of it, but this is my thinking too. I was going to get a book that did the chronological timeline and mishmashed the books to fit it. That way you get the evolving message of the entire bible without having to put it in order yourself, and research the political situation there and then, and do the jigsawpuzzle yourself. In ombination with another book that was a 365 studyguide for doing it in a year, with some notetaking portion of it. Then apcryfs, ignatious and the other apostles of the apostles. Good thinking.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#58
Not awere of it, but this is my thinking too. I was going to get a book that did the chronological timeline and mishmashed the books to fit it. That way you get the evolving message of the entire bible without having to put it in order yourself, and research the political situation there and then, and do the jigsawpuzzle yourself. In ombination with another book that was a 365 studyguide for doing it in a year, with some notetaking portion of it. Then apcryfs, ignatious and the other apostles of the apostles. Good thinking.
Tom does this for you. He puts his eight years of study at your fingertips.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
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#59
The god of this world is Satan.
That is what the world is all about. Satan leads our media, our culture, Satan is everywhere in our world. Everything is either on Satan's side or the Lord's side. It is either for the Lord or a distortion of the Lord. It is even called our culture. We must choose to live by the Lord within or by the world.
 
Feb 16, 2017
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#60
That is what the world is all about. Satan leads our media, our culture, Satan is everywhere in our world. Everything is either on Satan's side or the Lord's side. It is either for the Lord or a distortion of the Lord. It is even called our culture. We must choose to live by the Lord within or by the world.
Sister,

the Devil has had a long time to get his world system completely locked in.
Before i came here, i was watching the Kabul airport terrorist attack report on the news with tears in my eyes.
Such a dark world the Devil has created. Such Chaos. Such deception.
And you are correct. He is at work everywhere, deceiving, harming, confusing, destroying..