Proof of a Future Millennial Kingdom

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B

BradC

Guest
wow.....all that and you still said:

"but the sentence of being cast out is progressive and delayed by the future tense, which began at Christ's ascension (Col 2:15)" - does cast out mean cast into the lake of fire? is that said anywhere in there?

you just BOLD every instance of CAST and say it's the same thing (but not really kinda thing)?
cast into the pit and cast into the lake of fire aren't the same...are they?



oh....so he is not in heaven where God is, but is in the place Paul said the rulers and principalities are - in the heavenlies/the air? or is he ON EARTH?

we are not told WHERE he is (precise location, be it somewhere on earth; in a pit; in the air)....if we are, please show me.



okay.....is he ultimately able to prevail over the nations, deceiving them (until he is released his short time)? USE YOUR 1,000 YEARS....is he? not even does Millennialism make that claim - it can't. the text doesn't allow it.

is he ultimately able to deceive the NATIONS who were formerly excluded from the promises away from the promises?

not according the New Testament.

Matthew 16:18
17And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18"I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19"I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

what good are the keys to the Kingdom if the Church didn't use them???
was Peter supposed to put them in his pocket and save them until the Millennium?

*cough*
You brought up the 'keys' that were given for binding and loosening purposes. Would you care to tell us who has used those keys and what has been bound and loosened by them? Is there a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God? If you have studied the gospels you should know if there is a difference and what that difference is in relationship to the church and/or others of God's elect.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I agree. However, those who hold to amil beliefs think that Revelation has been fulfilled completely.
Yes I know. Just like they think Daniel and other prophesies concerning those events are already completed. I was agreeing with you my friend..
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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The bible says plainly 1000 years y do you like questioninG everything are you an antichrist.orarare u to the edifyin of the body?
antichrist?
come on.

and how does a fuzzy future 1,000 NO ONE has explained yet, edify the body?
from what i see, it causes endless confusion and distraction and FEAR!

we are told to look forward to this:

1 Corinthians 15:52
in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

1 Thessalonians 4:17
16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 18Therefore comfort one another with these words.

does that chapter proceed to say everybody comes back to earth for 1,000 years? NO.
it says: "and so we shall always be with the Lord" - full stop.

if that trump isn't the last trump, what is it?
a trump announcing ppl are going into a Millennium?
where does it ever say THAT?

then the trumps sound again and the resurrection happens again, after 1,000 years?

which teaching is antichrist?
which is another Gospel?


The Babylonian Talmud records rabbinic opinions about how long Messiah’s reign would last (Akiba said 40 years and Eliezer ben Hyrcanus said 1000 years). See Sanhedrin 99a and Tanchuma Eikev.

did they get it wrong? clearly!
they even had some of the information!

Millennialism
There is a not dissimilar belief in Judaism. Time is split into 3 periods (1) The world started in year 1 (= 3761 BC), the epoch. For almost two thousand years there was nothing, most people were idolatrous and God's presence was not seen in the world. (2) In 1812 BC, 1948 in Jewish years, Abraham was born. The birth of the first forefather heralded two thousand years of Godliness. This is the period of the Bible, the first and second temples in Jerusalem etc. (3) In 70 AD the Second Temple in Jerusalem was destroyed, and after the Bar Kokhba revolt, Jews were barred from Jerusalem except for the day of Tisha B'av. This started a further two thousand years of non-Godliness. Some Jews believe that the Messiah must come before the end of this period, or by about 2270 AD.

Millennialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia < click

so they say of the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple - "This started a further two thousand years of non-Godliness".
they're clearly referring to Jesus and Christianity.
do Christians believe this? or the OPPOSITE of this?
didn't the Messiah already come?


Jewish eschatology is concerned with events that will happen in the end of days, according to the Hebrew Bible and Jewish thought. This includes the ingathering of the exiled diaspora, the coming of Jewish Messiah, afterlife, and the revival of the dead Tsadikim.

Eschatology is the area of theology and philosophy concerned with the final events in the history of the world, the ultimate destiny of humanity, and related concepts.

In Judaism, end times are usually called the "end of days" (aḥarit ha-yamim, אחרית הימים), a phrase that appears several times in the Tanakh. The idea of a messianic age has a prominent place in Jewish thought, and is incorporated as part of the end of days.

Jewish eschatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Messianic Age: Judaism

Advent of the Messianic Era
According to the Talmud,[2] the Midrash,[3] and the ancient Kabbalistic work, the Zohar,[4] the Messiah must arrive before the year 6000 from the time of creation. In Orthodox Jewish belief, the Hebrew calendar dates to the time of creation, making this correspond to the year 2230.

The Midrash comments:

"Six eons for going in and coming out, for war and peace. The seventh eon is entirely Shabbat and rest for life everlasting.[5]"

There is a kabbalistic tradition[6] that maintains that each of the seven days of the week, which are based upon the seven days of creation, correspond to the seven millennia of creation. The tradition teaches that the seventh day of the week, the Sabbath day of rest, corresponds to the seventh millennium, the age of universal 'rest' - the Messianic Era. The seventh millennium perforce begins with the year 6000, and is the latest time the Messiah can come. Supporting and elaborating on this theme are numerous early and late Jewish scholars, including Rabbeinu Bachya,[7] Abraham ibn Ezra,[8] the Ramban,[9] Isaac Abrabanel,[10] the Ramchal,[11] the Vilna Gaon,[12] Aryeh Kaplan,[13] and the Lubavitcher Rebbe.[14]

Messianic Age - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

did they get it wrong?
yes....they DID.


Messianic Age: Christianity

According to a realized eschatology, the Messianic Era, a time of universal peace and brotherhood on the earth, without crime, war and poverty, is already here. With the death of Christ himself, see Atonement in Christianity, the Messianic Era had begun, but, according to an inaugurated eschatology, it will only be fulfilled by the parusia of Christ. Commonly, the Book of Revelation is interpreted as referring to the "unveiling" or "revelation" of Jesus Christ as Christian Messiah in the apocalypse or end of the world.

The Nicene Creed, professed by most Christians, expresses the belief that Christ ascended to Heaven, where he now sits at the Right Hand of God and will return to earth at the Second Coming of Christ to establish the Kingdom of God of the World to Come.

Messianic Age - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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Yes I know. Just like they think Daniel and other prophesies concerning those events are already completed. I was agreeing with you my friend..
Daniel is fulfilled EG. ALL OF IT (with the exception of eternity visions - there are a few.).....same as Revelation.

there's sure no 2000 year gap between week 69 & 70.

and no, amillennialists do not believe the whole book of Revelation has been fulfilled.
h'obviously.

we're not in eternity yet.
 
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E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
This is utter nonsense. You cannot show me a single example in scripture that supports this idea. And it directly contradicts everything Paul said in Romans 9-11.
lol.. Ok

then explain this. And remember, This is spoken of LONG after pentecost. And speaking in future tense!


Rom 11
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And they also, (Israel) if they do not continue in unbelief,(Which was the status of the nation in the time of this writing even up until today) will be grafted in, (restored due to repentance) for God is able to graft them in again. [SUP]24 [/SUP]For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? [SUP]25 [/SUP]For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel (the remnant you spoke of. They were not toally blind. but in part. a remnant remained. And again, THIS IS LONG AFTER PENTECOST) until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. [SUP]26 [/SUP]And so all Israel will be saved, (Again, this is a FUTURE PROPHESY! WHEN DID THIS HAPPEN?? AND you CANT SAY THIS IS GENTILE AND JEW BEING SAVED, BECAUSE THEY CONTEXT IS JEW VS GENTILE) as it is written:

“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob; (he will not save them from their sin, he will TURN THEM FROM THEIR SIN. As Ezekial said, [SUP]23[/SUP]They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions;)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”[SUP][h][/SUP]


[SUP]28 [/SUP]Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.

Why is it that these unbelieving jews are enemies because of the gospel and their unbelief and fighting against it, But yet the election still stands if it was all fulfilled at pentecost?? Sorry. But your belief has major flaws..
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
The bible says plainly 1000 years y do you like questioninG everything are you an antichrist.orarare u to the edifyin of the body?
Thats a prety harsh tone my friend. You can not condemn someone because of this. This is not a salvic nature.. Judge not lest ye be judged!
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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Messianic Age: Christianity

According to a realized eschatology, the Messianic Era, a time of universal peace and brotherhood on the earth, without crime, war and poverty, is already here. With the death of Christ himself, see Atonement in Christianity, the Messianic Era had begun, but, according to an inaugurated eschatology, it will only be fulfilled by the parusia of Christ. Commonly, the Book of Revelation is interpreted as referring to the "unveiling" or "revelation" of Jesus Christ as Christian Messiah in the apocalypse or end of the world.

The Nicene Creed, professed by most Christians, expresses the belief that Christ ascended to Heaven, where he now sits at the Right Hand of God and will return to earth at the Second Coming of Christ to establish the Kingdom of God of the World to Come.

Messianic Age - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Matthew 12:32
Anyone who speaks against the Son of Man can be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven, either in this world or in the world to come.

Mark 10
28Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee. 29And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, 30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
So let me get this straight.


  • Satan was bound 2000 years ago so he could no longer deceive the nations
  • Satan was thrown down from heaven to earth 2000 years ago
  • A woe was pronounced upon the earth and sea 2000 years ago because of satan's great wrath for being evicted from heaven (even though he's now bound)

Things have continued on earth for the past 2000 years just as they have for the past 4000 years. Except for the past century or so, the earth and sea haven't been hurt any more than they were before the cross. This scenario has a bound satan causing more grief and harm to the earth and sea than an unbound satan could. Satan can't hurt the earth and sea by himself; he has to get man to do it for him, and the only way he can do that is to deceive them. But satan can't deceive men because he is bound.

Don't you see how implausible and ridiculous this is beginning to sound?
reminds me of the argument peter made;

2 Peter 3: [SUP]3 [/SUP]knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, [SUP]4 [/SUP]and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest

But isn't there a conudrum in that God never said that THIS earth would endure forever in fact the Lord says this earth will BE BURNED UP? There will be a NEW HEAVEN AND NEW EARTH. And didn't the Lord lay down CONDITIONS for them to remain in the land? And didn't Jesus tell the Pharisees there were NOT of Abraham? So when talks about all Israel is Paul talking about the same children of Abraham that Jesus is talking about? Points to ponder.

1. All this means is that as long as the land is in existance, the covenant remains. Once the land is gone.. there is no land to keep the covenant. If the covenant is done away before the land is gone, then God is a liar
2. There were not conditions given to abraham. God did not say if you do this, the land is yours. If you do not. I will take away the land. He said I GIVE TO YOU AND YOUR DESCENDANTS FOREVER AS AN ETERNAL COVENANT.
2. The only condition which was ever given was their ability to LIVE in the land God gave to them (lev 26) that condition however, did not say the land would no longer be theirs. Only that they would be removed from THEIR LAND and foriegners who do not own the land will live in it. But if they repent. God will return them to THEIR LAND as he remembers the covenant he made with their fathers.


lev 26:
[SUP]40 [/SUP]‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me,
[SUP]41 [/SUP]and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies;
if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt—
[SUP]42 [/SUP]then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;
I will remember the land.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
It seems there is more evidence to the Amil position. Is what satan is doing the main objection?
If so i dont see it as a very strong one. Ive been delivered out of his kingdom. So hes restrained.
Jesus, Paul, Peter...etc never wrote about a 1000 yr kingdom did they? Or Hebrews, so......?
One verse? then reverse engineering with OT prophecies that were fulfilled? im still a tad unsure:eek:
You have been delivered. He can;t hurt your eternity.

But he can hurt you on earth, and he still decieved leaders and nations and people (HITLER COMES TO MIND) That is why we do not believe he is bound. One who is bound has no power. he can not decieve anyone.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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Jewish eschatology is concerned with events that will happen in the end of days, according to the Hebrew Bible and Jewish thought. This includes the ingathering of the exiled diaspora, the coming of Jewish Messiah, afterlife, and the revival of the dead Tsadikim.

Eschatology is the area of theology and philosophy concerned with the final events in the history of the world, the ultimate destiny of humanity, and related concepts.

In Judaism, end times are usually called the "end of days" (aḥarit ha-yamim, אחרית הימים), a phrase that appears several times in the Tanakh. The idea of a messianic age has a prominent place in Jewish thought, and is incorporated as part of the end of days.

Jewish eschatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Hebrews 1:2
The Supremacy of the Son

1God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.



Daniel 9
24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Seventy weeks
are determined
upon thy people (Israel)
and upon thy holy city (Jerusalem)

TO:

finish the transgression
and to make an end of sins
and to make reconciliation for iniquity
and to bring in everlasting righteousness
and to seal up the vision and prophecy
and to anoint the most Holy.

FULFILLED.

and the people (Romans)
of the prince that shall come (Titus)
shall destroy the city and the sanctuary (the Temple and Jerusalem)
and the end thereof shall be with a flood
and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

FULFILLED.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
gotta love the forums huh?
Yeah. I love this topic. What I hate about it is I do not think there is any other topic which causes hate and condemnation of people who do not believe the same as much. It is quite sad actually!

to think I would condemn a brother or sister who believes in the one true Gospel because they believe in a future millennium, or they do not believe in it is just crazy!
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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reminds me of the argument peter made;

2 Peter 3: [SUP]3 [/SUP]knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, [SUP]4 [/SUP]and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”
i already posted it is NOT Amillennialists who believe that since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

we say the GREATEST EVENT IN THE HISTORY OF THIS WORLD THAT CHANGED EVERYTHING happened 2000 years ago!
hardly the scoffers talked about here.

Peter is talking about apostate jews.

nor do we say "Where is the promise of His coming?"

the promise of His coming is certain.
it's when He gets here.

where is the promise of His Coming?

IN SCRIPTURE.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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reminds me of the argument peter made;

2 Peter 3: [SUP]3 [/SUP]knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, [SUP]4 [/SUP]and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”
Yeah. I love this topic. What I hate about it is I do not think there is any other topic which causes hate and condemnation of people who do not believe the same as much. It is quite sad actually!

to think I would condemn a brother or sister who believes in the one true Gospel because they believe in a future millennium, or they do not believe in it is just crazy!
hi EG - you and i resolved our troubles (i hope it still holds true...it does for me).
are you sure you want to say Amillennialists are the mockers walking after their own lusts who say where is the Promise of His Coming?

that passage does not say "where is the Promise of His Coming to establish a literal 1,000 years on earth?"

if it did, i'd certainly reconsider my position - i would have no choice.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
i already posted it is NOT Amillennialists who believe that since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

we say the GREATEST EVENT IN THE HISTORY OF THIS WORLD THAT CHANGED EVERYTHING happened 2000 years ago!
hardly the scoffers talked about here.

Peter is talking about apostate jews.
No he is talking about people in the last days. Nothing there says he is talking about Jews.

nor do we say "Where is the promise of His coming?"

the promise of His coming is certain.
it's when He gets here.

where is the promise of His Coming?

IN SCRIPTURE.
You missed the whole point of the post. The point is nothing has changed here on earth, it is the same today as it was 4000 years ago. If satan was bound, Something would have changed, His influence on world leaders would have ceased. Peter is showing this to be true even in the last days..
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
hi EG - you and i resolved our troubles (i hope it still holds true...it does for me).
are you sure you want to say Amillennialists are the mockers walking after their own lusts who say where is the Promise of His Coming?

that passage does not say "where is the Promise of His Coming to establish a literal 1,000 years on earth?"

if it did, i'd certainly reconsider my position - i would have no choice.
Again sis you missed the point.

Peter is admitting people in the last days are saying things (on earth) continue as they have since the beginning. Showing Satan could not have been bound. If he was. Things would not have continued to be the same.. It is not what ammils believe concerning the comming of Christ. that was not my point.

 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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No he is talking about people in the last days. Nothing there says he is talking about Jews. [/COLOR]
okay....ever since the fathers fell asleep?

i'll go with your interpretation...it doesn't make a Millennium.

Ezekiel 12:22
"Son of man, what is this proverb you have in the land of Israel: 'The days go by and every vision comes to nothing'?

Ezekiel 12:27
"Son of man, the Israelites are saying, 'The vision he sees is for many years from now, and he prophesies about the distant future.'

Jeremiah 17:15
They keep saying to me, "Where is the word of the LORD? Let it now be fulfilled!"

Malachi 2:17
You have wearied the LORD with your words. "How have we wearied him?" you ask. By saying, "All who do evil are good in the eyes of the LORD, and he is pleased with them" or "Where is the God of justice?"

2 Peter 3:4
They will say, "Where is this 'coming' he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation."

You missed the whole point of the post. The point is nothing has changed here on earth, it is the same today as it was 4000 years ago.
why does something have to change 'on this earth'?
where does it say it will?

1 Corinthians 15:54
When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory."

2 Corinthians 5:4
For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life.



You missed the whole point of the post. The point is nothing has changed here on earth, it is the same today as it was 4000 years ago. If satan was bound, Something would have changed, His influence on world leaders would have ceased. Peter is showing this to be true even in the last days..
where in the world does it say that - anywhere in the Bible?:)

Millennialists have a giant rebellion and war at the end of the 1,000 years.

Jude
Greeting
1Jude, a servanta of Jesus Christ and brother of James,

To those who are called, beloved in God the Father and kept forb Jesus Christ:

2May mercy, peace, and love be multiplied to you.

Judgment on False Teachers
3Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints. 4For certain people have crept in unnoticed who long ago were designated for this condemnation, ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into sensuality and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

5Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who savedc a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe. 6And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day— 7just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire,d serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.

8Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones. 9But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, was disputing about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a blasphemous judgment, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.” 10But these people blaspheme all that they do not understand, and they are destroyed by all that they, like unreasoning animals, understand instinctively. 11Woe to them! For they walked in the way of Cain and abandoned themselves for the sake of gain to Balaam’s error and perished in Korah’s rebellion. 12These are hidden reefse at your love feasts, as they feast with you without fear, shepherds feeding themselves; waterless clouds, swept along by winds; fruitless trees in late autumn, twice dead, uprooted; 13wild waves of the sea, casting up the foam of their own shame; wandering stars, for whom the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved forever.

14It was also about these that Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of his holy ones, 15to execute judgment on all and to convict all the ungodly of all their deeds of ungodliness that they have committed in such an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things that ungodly sinners have spoken against him.” 16These are grumblers, malcontents, following their own sinful desires; they are loud-mouthed boasters, showing favoritism to gain advantage.

A Call to Persevere
17But you must remember, beloved, the predictions of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ. 18Theyf said to you, “In the last time there will be scoffers, following their own ungodly passions.” 19It is these who cause divisions, worldly people, devoid of the Spirit. 20But you, beloved, building yourselves up in your most holy faith and praying in the Holy Spirit, 21keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ that leads to eternal life. 22And have mercy on those who doubt; 23save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garmentg stained by the flesh.

Doxology
24Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy, 25to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.


anything there about a Millennium?
nope:)
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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Again sis you missed the point.

Peter is admitting people in the last days are saying things (on earth) continue as they have since the beginning. Showing Satan could not have been bound. If he was. Things would not have continued to be the same.. It is not what ammils believe concerning the comming of Christ. that was not my point.

unbelievers say that.
right?
they haven't been transferred to eternal life.
they don't believe Jesus came, they don't believe He took away sin, and God reconciled the world to Himself.
they don't believe The King came and rules now.

so, all things remain the same.
they don't believe.

make it jews and/or gentiles.
anyways.....:)
 
Sep 4, 2012
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lol.. Ok
then explain this. And remember, This is spoken of LONG after pentecost. And speaking in future tense!

Rom 11
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And they also, (Israel) if they do not continue in unbelief,(Which was the status of the nation in the time of this writing even up until today) will be grafted in, (restored due to repentance) for God is able to graft them in again. [SUP]24 [/SUP]For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? [SUP]25 [/SUP]For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel (the remnant you spoke of. They were not toally blind. but in part. a remnant remained. And again, THIS IS LONG AFTER PENTECOST) until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. [SUP]26 [/SUP]And so all Israel will be saved, (Again, this is a FUTURE PROPHESY! WHEN DID THIS HAPPEN?? AND you CANT SAY THIS IS GENTILE AND JEW BEING SAVED, BECAUSE THEY CONTEXT IS JEW VS GENTILE) as it is written:

“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob; (he will not save them from their sin, he will TURN THEM FROM THEIR SIN. As Ezekial said, [SUP]23[/SUP]They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions;)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”[SUP][h][/SUP]


[SUP]28 [/SUP]Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.

Why is it that these unbelieving jews are enemies because of the gospel and their unbelief and fighting against it, But yet the election still stands if it was all fulfilled at pentecost?? Sorry. But your belief has major flaws..
I guess by saying OK you agree that there are no scriptural examples that all of natural Israel will be saved.

I will give you the best scriptural example I can find. All of natural Israel was saved out of Egypt. Yet afterwards those who didn't believe were destroyed. That's as good as it gets, and it doesn't sound like much of a salvation for the unbelievers.

On the other hand, the bible is full of examples proclaiming that only a remnant is saved. From cover to cover; and from Romans chapter 9 through chapter 11. Paul would not contradict himself in one sentence by saying that all of natural Israel would be saved, after having spent two entire chapters taking pains to establish the truth scripturally that only a remnant is saved.

The election still stands, but only if they repent. And not all will.