Question about after death

[enochson]

Don't make me laugh, eknockson, God did NOT set the unsaved free, but other part, wow! , you got it right , you got something right and you .FINALLY gave people a teachable moment.

Haleolujah, there is still hope for you !!!

I'm sorry you can't read. One needs to learn to read to understand the book I didn't write the book or the ver. God did by the holy spirit so you are laughting at god and the holy spirit and that is a dumb line to cross.

 

[GreenNnice]

I'm sorry you can't read. One needs to learn to read to understand the book I didn't write the book or the ver. God did by the holy spirit so you are laughting at god and the holy spirit and that is a dumb line to cross.

No, no, NOOOOOOOooooo !

Lol.

Eknockson, you got it all wrong, as most usual with your heresies of teaching and belief and adamant MISunderstandings of the bible taught others, but, no, THIS TIME, with 'captivity captive' being freed , you GOT this right, and, it's a big RIGHT !

SO, God bless you for showing others this Truth.

Shining light said that people were in ground until Jesus rose . True ! Except elijah, Moses have appeared with God on mountain, so they were obviously raiSED !

BUT, YEAH, ,your nonsensical trivialities ranked even higher than tribers, jimdig, others of their CHOSEN belief that no one can come to God He just forces you, ahhhhhhh (shining light aura) to be His. Ahhh, límites atonenent I LOVE to haTE that irrationalism that is herey that directly refutes God saying so many FREE CHOICE decisions in scripture.

But, you got this righto, INDEED, the VEIL was TORN IN TWO and the spirits of dead SAVED arose to be in 'paradise,' (Luke 19 is not simple story or 'parable,' where is word 'parable' mentioned? It's not!) where abraham, Moses, elijah, enoch, many others who rose when veil split and Jesus arose, are now in cerebral form, in paradise, they are with Jesus too. It's not mysterious, it's deep, justifiable, scripture chrono Truth

Can this all really be true, green? What about thessalonians, that says '...God will bringvwith Him those who SLEEP IN JESUS.
This IS present tense, saying those 'who sleep in Jesus' will 'bring with Him. 1 Thes. 4:14

Those who 'sleep in Jesus' will rise first. OK, so you're saying what, green?

I'm saying that, YES!, some sleep, NOT all, some ARE in 'good' side paradise, some 'torment'side. And, those who do sleep will NOT SLEEP ALONE, for they will sleep in Jesus

 

[enochson]

No, no, NOOOOOOOooooo !

Lol.

Eknockson, you got it all wrong, as most usual with your heresies of teaching and belief and adamant MISunderstandings of the bible taught others, but, no, THIS TIME, with 'captivity captive' being freed , you GOT this right, and, it's a big RIGHT !

SO, God bless you for showing others this Truth.

Shining light said that people were in ground until Jesus rose . True ! Except elijah, Moses have appeared with God on mountain, so they were obviously raiSED !

BUT, YEAH, ,your nonsensical trivialities ranked even higher than tribers, jimdig, others of their CHOSEN belief that no one can come to God He just forces you, ahhhhhhh (shining light aura) to be His. Ahhh, límites atonenent I LOVE to haTE that irrationalism that is herey that directly refutes God saying so many FREE CHOICE decisions in scripture.

But, you got this righto, INDEED, the VEIL was TORN IN TWO and the spirits of dead SAVED arose to be in 'paradise,' (Luke 19 is not simple story or 'parable,' where is word 'parable' mentioned? It's not!) where abraham, Moses, elijah, enoch, many others who rose when veil split and Jesus arose, are now in cerebral form, in paradise, they are with Jesus too. It's not mysterious, it's deep, justifiable, scripture chrono Truth

Can this all really be true, green? What about thessalonians, that says '...God will bringvwith Him those who SLEEP IN JESUS.
This IS present tense, saying those 'who sleep in Jesus' will 'bring with Him. 1 Thes. 4:14

Those who 'sleep in Jesus' will rise first. OK, so you're saying what, green?

I'm saying that, YES!, some sleep, NOT all, some ARE in 'good' side paradise, some 'torment'side. And, those who do sleep will NOT SLEEP ALONE, for they will sleep in Jesus

The fullfillment of thes event is in Eph. 4;8 spoken by paul. Just because someone is born agian doesn't mean they are not asleep because of man's self doctrine.

 

[Blu_Bug]

I think the original text does not have commas at all, so if you read it straight it really could be interpreted whichever way people want to interpret it.

It cant be interpeted in 2 ways, assuming your correct and no commas are used (and thy werent) Jesus told the Thief that day He would see him in Paradise.
(1) Heaven is never called Paradise, its always a Kingdom
(2) If for what ever reason you think he asended to Heaven, The Thief beat Jesus there, for Jesus didnt asend for 40 more days - The Thief would be the only person in the bible to have been declaired Judgment free.
(3) It looks a little more as tho Jesus was telling the Thief he would see Him again for His faith in Christ.
94) We knw the scroll of the names of the people to be judged hasnt been given Christ yet as told in REV.
(4) The Holy Scriptures are not up to your own interpation or mine, the word sez one verse will support another
(5) Adam lived in Paradise "Thy Kingdom Come They will be Done On ___________as it was in Heaven"

Reason out the scriptures...........

 

[enochson]

It cant be interpeted in 2 ways, assuming your correct and no commas are used (and thy werent) Jesus told the Thief that day He would see him in Paradise.
(1) Heaven is never called Paradise, its always a Kingdom
(2) If for what ever reason you think he asended to Heaven, The Thief beat Jesus there, for Jesus didnt asend for 40 more days - The Thief would be the only person in the bible to have been declaired Judgment free.
(3) It looks a little more as tho Jesus was telling the Thief he would see Him again for His faith in Christ.
94) We knw the scroll of the names of the people to be judged hasnt been given Christ yet as told in REV.
(4) The Holy Scriptures are not up to your own interpation or mine, the word sez one verse will support another
(5) Adam lived in Paradise "Thy Kingdom Come They will be Done On ___________as it was in Heaven"

Reason out the scriptures...........

sorry he didn't beat christ to heaven because the spirit goes back to god who gave it there no wait timeis in that event. as for the soul of the thief it had to go to sheol till christ came and set it free Psalm 68;18 and the body became worm food.

 

[Deadtosin]

John 8:51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.

 

[enochson]

John 8:51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.

I agree the spirit and soul don't the body is already dead because of sin.

 

[Graybeard]

"Thy Kingdom Come They will be Done On ___________as it was in Heaven"

just a correction.........."...........as it IS in Heaven"

 

[feedm3]

It cant be interpeted in 2 ways, assuming your correct and no commas are used (and thy werent) Jesus told the Thief that day He would see him in Paradise.
(1) Heaven is never called Paradise, its always a Kingdom

Heaven is refeered to as "paradise" here:

II Cor 11: 1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth 4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter

Jew's referred to 3 heavens:
1. The sky (where the birds fly)
2. Space (where the stars, sun and moon are)
3. Beyond space (where God's throne is)

Number 3, is the Third heaven Paul was speaking, and used "third heaven" and "paradise of God" to be one in the same.

(2) If for what ever reason you think he ascended to Heaven, The Thief beat Jesus there, for Jesus didn't asend for 40 more days - The Thief would be the only person in the bible to have been declared Judgment free.

The Theif was said to go to paradise, which at that time would have been in Hades, the same place Jesus went when he died, and the same place in Hades known as "Abraham's bosom" - Luke 16.

(3) It looks a little more as tho Jesus was telling the Thief he would see Him again for His faith in Christ.

Or it means what it says, today he would be with him in Paradise. Again no reason to assume the comma argument, because it agrees with the remote context concerning Hades.

94) We knew the scroll of the names of the people to be judged hasnt been given Christ yet as told in REV.

Is the judgment to see if a person is going to heaven or not? If so why are their angels in chains of darkness AWAITING JUDGEMENT, wouldn't you think if the Judgment was to determine a person's heart, the angels have already been judged? So why are they waiting for the day of Judgment? Because the judgement is NOT to determine if you are a child of God or not, God knows those who are his already. The judgment is for you to know WHY you did or did not make it.

II Pet 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment

Jude 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day

II Tim 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity

We have no reason to assume the place the angles are held awaiting judgment is not the same place the wicked go when the die to await judgment.

The rich man in Luke 16 was said to open his Eyes in Hades, (Tartarus???same as the angels?)

(4) The Holy Scriptures are not up to your own interpretation or mine, the word sez one verse will support another

Right, so Luke 16 being rejected as a parable, yet does not fit a parable, is due only to an interpretation that says the dead cease to exist, or sleep. Yet with the many passages shown, Hades houses the dead, and Jesus went to Hades, promised the thief to be there as well, and Lazarus also was escorted to "paradise in Hades" by the angles upon his death.

The rich man and Lazarus defiantly do fit parables, it's details about life after death, and the state of individuals would be pointless if not true. NO one is ever named in a parable. This is an account, so to reject it as a parable ONLY from the grounds of your interpretation, is error when compared to the remote context dealing with Hades.

 

[Blu_Bug]

sorry he didn't beat christ to heaven because the spirit goes back to god who gave it there no wait timeis in that event. as for the soul of the thief it had to go to sheol till christ came and set it free Psalm 68;18 and the body became worm food.

The soul dies Ezek 18:4 The soul is ot set free..... The spirit always belongs to GOD. You look for a reason not to be judged, all are judged........

If you had read the earlier, the comment had to do with the Thief being with Christ THAT day, NOT POSSIBLE per scripture....Jesus didnt asend for 40 days, He was raised by God in spirit form, that is why only those who were picked by God could even see Him.......If yo

 

[Blu_Bug]

Sorry for the poorly written response.... The soul dies, it means LIFE.

Jesus was raised by God in spirit form Acts 10:40-41 the reason only those chosen by GOD could see HIM, not even the deciples reconised HIM...He told them not to touch HIM for He HAD NOT asended fully yet....Jesus was NOT IN HEAVEN

 

[enochson]

The soul dies Ezek 18:4 The soul is ot set free..... The spirit always belongs to GOD. You look for a reason not to be judged, all are judged........

If you had read the earlier, the comment had to do with the Thief being with Christ THAT day, NOT POSSIBLE per scripture....Jesus didnt asend for 40 days, He was raised by God in spirit form, that is why only those who were picked by God could even see Him.......If yo

spirit back to god who gave it ecclesiastes 12;7 the soul went down and then went up with the captive ones psalm 68;18 his body full of all sin was judge and went back to dust heb.9;27-28 the spirit of the thief back to god the soul to sheol till christ set it free the body back to dust.

 

[enochson]

Sorry for the poorly written response.... The soul dies, it means LIFE.

Jesus was raised by God in spirit form Acts 10:40-41 the reason only those chosen by GOD could see HIM, not even the deciples reconised HIM...He told them not to touch HIM for He HAD NOT asended fully yet....Jesus was NOT IN HEAVEN

the bible states we are sow earthy and raise heavenly.

 

[feedm3]

The soul dies Ezek 18:4 The soul is ot set free..... The spirit always belongs to GOD. You look for a reason not to be judged, all are judged........

Our souls do not die, they live on after the death of the body. Ezekiel 18:4 is using the word "soul" in describing a person alive with a body. This word is used that way in many places. It can be used speaking of the person's spriit, soul, or while a person is alive in the body, as it does in EZekiel.

4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die

We know this: because the soul is speaking of sinning. Sin is something we are able to do here while alive on earth

Here are other places we see "soul" used to describe those still living in the body:
Gen 46: 15 These be the sons of Leah, which she bare unto Jacob in Padanaram, with his daughter Dinah: all the souls of his sons and his daughters were thirty and three

Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls

This is only 2 examples of hundreds, if you do a search on "souls", you will see this word is used more to describe those living still in the flesh, than it does those who are dead.

If you had read the earlier, the comment had to do with the Thief being with Christ THAT day, NOT POSSIBLE per scripture....Jesus didn't ascend for 40 days, He was raised by God in spirit form, that is why only those who were picked by God could even see Him.......

Then that would beg the question of where did his body go? Why would the spirit body have holes from nails, and open would from a spear? Some may not have recognized him, yet this was for a purpose, does not mean He was not in his body.

Notice:
Luke 24:13 And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs. 14 And they talked together of all these things which had happened. 15 And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. 16 But their eyes were holden that they should not know him

Notice their "eyes were Holden", if he was in another body, their would be no reason for their eyes being "Holden"

But because he could be recognized as Jesus, their eyes had to be "restrained" in some sense so they would not recognize him.

When they did recognize him, the Bible says their "eyes were opened", so the change was in their perception, not Jesus' appearance.

Luke 24:31: And their eyes were opened, and they knew him; and he vanished out of their sight.

 

[darryl2]

Death - no immortal soul
Bible does not teach that man has an immortal soul. Rather, it teaches that “man is a living soul”. (Genesis 2:7) What is the condition of the dead? “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.” (Ecclesiastes 9:5) Death is a state of non-existence with no consciousness.


Resurrection
It is man’s real hope. Only minority awaits heavenly life, while most of dead will be resurrected by God for life on the Earth (Psalms 37:29). God will restore our beloved ones back to life on earth turned to Paradise as it was originally in the days of Adam before he sinned. There is an opportunity to those who have died without finding God. Thus, “there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous”. (Acts 24:15) The unworthy whom God judges will not be resurrected.

 

[GreenNnice]

Death - no immortal soul
Bible does not teach that man has an immortal soul. Rather, it teaches that “man is a living soul”. (Genesis 2:7) What is the condition of the dead? “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.” (Ecclesiastes 9:5) Death is a state of non-existence with no consciousness.


Resurrection
It is man’s real hope. Only minority awaits heavenly life, while most of dead will be resurrected by God for life on the Earth (Psalms 37:29). God will restore our beloved ones back to life on earth turned to Paradise as it was originally in the days of Adam before he sinned. There is an opportunity to those who have died without finding God. Thus, “there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous”. (Acts 24:15) The unworthy whom God judges will not be resurrected.

It is funny to me, all this, bother, bother, I being so little of bear brain, ahhhh, awww, can we not here God say, 'I and My Fahther are oNE,' AND, therefore, can you not hear that God is with mystery describing our life after death. STOP! Shhhhhhh, listen........ listen to deadtosin, listen to feedm, you will hear DEATH screaming immediately to LIFE immortal. You will hear, listen, verily, verily, IF you keep My sayings, you will never see death, deadtosin said, from John 8:51, what PARt of that din't ya git

What part of I and My Father are ONE, don't you get, just because you see what you think you see does not mean you saw what you think you saw, the mysteries of God, in parables, but not in real meaning situations, like, OH NO! , green is going to mention Luke 16 again !!

Luke 16

C'mon, Christ peeps, read Revelation 20, can't you correlate that those who are Satan's followers and false prophets go to Hell forever, does verse 10 lie, and, what connection does it have to verses 14,15? Plain as day to me, and, night, a pitch black hot night that never ends, and, burns, burns, burns, the word 'torment' does not mean 'comfort,' you know

 

[enochson]

Death - no immortal soul
Bible does not teach that man has an immortal soul. Rather, it teaches that “man is a living soul”. (Genesis 2:7) What is the condition of the dead? “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.” (Ecclesiastes 9:5) Death is a state of non-existence with no consciousness.


Resurrection
It is man’s real hope. Only minority awaits heavenly life, while most of dead will be resurrected by God for life on the Earth (Psalms 37:29). God will restore our beloved ones back to life on earth turned to Paradise as it was originally in the days of Adam before he sinned. There is an opportunity to those who have died without finding God. Thus, “there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous”. (Acts 24:15) The unworthy whom God judges will not be resurrected.

seed births after it's owen kind it is written. So why do you think the seed of god his breath would give birth to anything other then His nature which is forever?

 

[Katy-follower]

Jaume - hope you are well What are your thoughts on my earlier post? Link --> http://christianchat.com/726326-post55.html

 

[JaumeJ]

Now I'm puzzled. When Jesus was on the cross He said to the thief "today you will be with me in paradise" (Luke 23:43) which to me says those saved who are physically dead are now in Heaven but without their complete bodies. But on that day of the rapture they will be transformed first and then the rest of us. Same goes for those who aren't saved that go straight to hell (the first death) prior to lake of fire on judgement day (2nd death).

Yes, I did think or Yeshua's words to the "good thief", and frankly I never understood why this is so in the Word. What I do know is what is consistently initimated throughout the Word elsewhere. I chalk this up as to be just one more mystery to be revealed in God's time for me, and perhaps for many more. When you know, I would appreciate your sharing it with me. Although I have always kept the words of our Savior to the thief on the cross, my belief has always been we sleep until Yeshua' return. Honestly, I cannot say why the words or what the words meant on the cross..........