Robert Morris says Jonathan had a "Jezebel spirit"

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ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

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#1
Apr 21, 2021
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#1
In the following video Robert Morris teaches on the "Jezebel spirit." Don't recall hearing about that one in the New Testament.

At 34:27, he gives as an example Jonathan and David. In his mind, Jonathan was possessed by a Jezebel spirit. He was insecure and wasn't a true friend to David. He says, in essence, Jonathan was controlling and manipulated David so he (Jonathan) would be well-positioned whether David lived or died.

Morris is the guy who told his congregation if they didn't tithe they were opening the door for demon possession. The lies just keep on comin'.

 
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SophieT

Guest
#3
#3
Godsgirl83 said:
please reference this. Thanks.
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looked it up. found the following:

"Listen to me carefully, I'm going to say something very strong: Any person that doesn't tithe is arrogant, because you believe you can make it your way and not doing it God's way. And you HAVE to be arrogant to steal from God. You have to be extremely arrogant to steal from God. And please understand if you don't tithe, that's an open door to demons...and I don't say that to make you feel condemned or to argue about tithing. And no matter how many doors you close in your life, if you're not a tither, you've got an open door to the 'enemy'." Robert Morris 9/30/13"
 
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Buckle

Junior Member
#4
Jun 3, 2016
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SophieT said:
looked it up. found the following:

"Listen to me carefully, I'm going to say something very strong: Any person that doesn't tithe is arrogant, because you believe you can make it your way and not doing it God's way. And you HAVE to be arrogant to steal from God. You have to be extremely arrogant to steal from God. And please understand if you don't tithe, that's an open door to demons...and I don't say that to make you feel condemned or to argue about tithing. And no matter how many doors you close in your life, if you're not a tither, you've got an open door to the 'enemy'." Robert Morris 9/30/13"
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That quote seems to be more a, God calls you to be part of his ministry and tithing is a straight forward way to do that, so not doing it is giving a good on your life to temptation. Holding on to wealth is a temptation that can end badly, see Annanias and Saphira, wealth is not the problem it is when wealth usurps God in you live that you commit idolatry. In regards to the Jezebel spirit I would say he is pulling stuff out his backside, the real concern here is filing up a potential fostering of a distrust of those closest to you for no reason.
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

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#5
Jul 2, 2011
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#5
It would be very refreshing to see numerous possts by people who actually know what the tithing system was in the first Israel.
Here is part of the info, the tithe was a tenth of a persons PROFITS at the end of the year.
Because Issrael was a theocracy headed by the priests, this was their form of income tax.
Sure make a voluntary pass of the plate to support your assembly, but do not call it tithing, this cast a dim light on un e understanding of just what tithing WAS and what it was inteded for.............mainly health, education and welfare.

Welfare has taken on an ugly meaning, it literally should be uncdfstood as the care for the well-being of the populace. It is not a communist teaching, it is caring for others. Do you care for others? Jesus Yeshua says you should.
 
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SophieT

Guest
#6
#6
Buckle said:
That quote seems to be more a, God calls you to be part of his ministry and tithing is a straight forward way to do that, so not doing it is giving a good on your life to temptation. Holding on to wealth is a temptation that can end badly, see Annanias and Saphira, wealth is not the problem it is when wealth usurps God in you live that you commit idolatry. In regards to the Jezebel spirit I would say he is pulling stuff out his backside, the real concern here is filing up a potential fostering of a distrust of those closest to you for no reason.
Click to expand...
is tithing a NT ordinance then?

actually Ananias and Sapphira are a good example. as told Ananias by Peter, the money was his to do with as he pleased...no mention of a portion needing to be given anywhere

any Pastor that speaks as did Morris, is abusive

IMO, he can stuff it all back in his backside...to quote you :)

actually, as one of the main characteristics of the so called 'Jezebel' is manipulation, perhaps the good pastor doth suffer from that malady himself :unsure:
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
#8
Apr 21, 2021
7,622
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#8
JaumeJ said:
It would be very refreshing to see numerous possts by people who actually know what the tithing system was in the first Israel.
Here is part of the info, the tithe was a tenth of a persons PROFITS at the end of the year.
Because Issrael was a theocracy headed by the priests, this was their form of income tax.
Sure make a voluntary pass of the plate to support your assembly, but do not call it tithing, this cast a dim light on un e understanding of just what tithing WAS and what it was inteded for.............mainly health, education and welfare.

Welfare has taken on an ugly meaning, it literally should be uncdfstood as the care for the well-being of the populace. It is not a communist teaching, it is caring for others. Do you care for others? Jesus Yeshua says you should.
Click to expand...
People know what tithing was, or should know by now.

But church leaders keep pushing it because they want megachurches. People keep paying it because they want large churches with lots of entertainment. It's not much more complicated than that.
 
Lanolin

Lanolin

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#11
Dec 15, 2018
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#11
Thought it was Ahab that was married to Jezebel not Jonathan.

Im like really...some people read their Bible like its gone through the mulcher.
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

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#12
Apr 21, 2021
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#12
The funny thing about the "Jezebel spirit" is if you look at lists of what the signs are they all disagree. By looking at these lists you'll see that virtually anything that anyone might consider evil is a symptom of a Jezebel spirit. If you think you have it, there's an abundance of material you can purchase that will help you get rid of it.

I've started noticing more and more that certain "spirits" are supposedly to blame for people's bad behavior: Jezebel spirit; Leviathan spirit; religious spirit; Pharisee spirit; delay spirit. Anything you think is bad about someone or a situation can be explained by a "spirit" that must be at work.

But these spirits aren't mentioned anywhere in the Bible; it's entirely made up. Yet one more gimmick to sell stuff.
 
B

Buckle

Junior Member
#13
Jun 3, 2016
47
24
8
#13
SophieT said:
is tithing a NT ordinance then?

actually Ananias and Sapphira are a good example. as told Ananias by Peter, the money was his to do with as he pleased...no mention of a portion needing to be given anywhere

any Pastor that speaks as did Morris, is abusive

IMO, he can stuff it all back in his backside...to quote you :)

actually, as one of the main characteristics of the so called 'Jezebel' is manipulation, perhaps the good pastor doth suffer from that malady himself :unsure:
Click to expand...
Tithing is not a ordinance, to use your word, just something that is beneficial to both the ministry and the individual. Jesus didn't say that the woman need not or should not have given her two mites. Though the OT law of tithing may not apply to us does not mean there is not benefit, many things in the law are beneficial if not required anymore.
 
B

Buckle

Junior Member
#14
Jun 3, 2016
47
24
8
#14
ResidentAlien said:
People know what tithing was, or should know by now.

But church leaders keep pushing it because they want megachurches. People keep paying it because they want large churches with lots of entertainment. It's not much more complicated than that.
Click to expand...
Yes this can be an issue, but without tithing the ministry might be challenging to do, and I don't just mean monetary tithing. In fact I wish more people would tithe of their time instead of their money, we would have a better chance of being a church family if we stopped being consumers.
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

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#15
Apr 21, 2021
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#15
Buckle said:
Tithing is not a ordinance, to use your word, just something that is beneficial to both the ministry and the individual. Jesus didn't say that the woman need not or should not have given her two mites. Though the OT law of tithing may not apply to us does not mean there is not benefit, many things in the law are beneficial if not required anymore.
Click to expand...
"For I do not mean that others should be eased and you burdened, but that as a matter of fairness your abundance at the present time should supply their need, so that their abundance may supply your need, that there may be fairness."—2 Corinthians 8:13-14

Tithing is based on greed, both on the part of preachers who preach it and on the part of those who hope to get a big payout in return. It has nothing to do with fairness or equality.
 
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SophieT

Guest
#16
#16
Buckle said:
Tithing is not a ordinance, to use your word, just something that is beneficial to both the ministry and the individual. Jesus didn't say that the woman need not or should not have given her two mites. Though the OT law of tithing may not apply to us does not mean there is not benefit, many things in the law are beneficial if not required anymore.
Click to expand...
we agree then that tithing is not an ordinance in the NT...tithing being the 10% people will refer to from the OT system of tithing when they insist we all should give 10%

of course we should give as we are able! absolutely...but not be cowed into it by a rogue pastor :) or guilt tripped into it if it is only 8%

if it's 50%, is that then wrong? I am sure you don't think that, but just to exaggerate the way some go on about that 10%
 
S

SophieT

Guest
#17
#17
ResidentAlien said:
The funny thing about the "Jezebel spirit" is if you look at lists of what the signs are they all disagree. By looking at these lists you'll see that virtually anything that anyone might consider evil is a symptom of a Jezebel spirit. If you think you have it, there's an abundance of material you can purchase that will help you get rid of it.

I've started noticing more and more that certain "spirits" are supposedly to blame for people's bad behavior: Jezebel spirit; Leviathan spirit; religious spirit; Pharisee spirit; delay spirit. Anything you think is bad about someone or a situation can be explained by a "spirit" that must be at work.

But these spirits aren't mentioned anywhere in the Bible; it's entirely made up. Yet one more gimmick to sell stuff.
Click to expand...
I don't subscribe to a demon under every rock, but there are plenty attending church in the guise of people who mean well, gossipers and those who correct everyone but themselves and similar

there are plenty of Jezebels running around and sadly Ahabs as well

I do believe you have me on ignore because I had the nerve to question you on one of your anti-spiritual gifts thread. there is plenty of abuse, but portraying all with the same broad brush does no justice to a serious topic

so I post the above just to give a different view as scripture is plain that demons do in fact have hierarchies and assignments and while I would not ask them for a thing as they are all liars, the quality of a jezebel or ahab is plain to see. dismissing everything does no more good then calling everything a demon or blaming everything on a demon
 
SomeDisciple

SomeDisciple

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Jul 4, 2021
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#18
The "tradition" was that when a new family came in to rule, the new king would kill all the biological descendants of the old king???
Must've been a "new tradition" considering Saul was the first king of Israel. You'd have to be totally blind to think that David was ever gonna kill Saul, let alone Jonathan. What is wrong with this guy? Saul was chasing David around trying to kill him, and David FELT BAD ABOUT TRIMMING THE SKIRT OF HIS GARMENT. I probably would have cut his throat and then maybe felt bad about it afterward.

You have got to be kidding me right now... even if Johnathan had "forced" David to make a vow not to kill him... CAN YOU REALLY BLAME HIM!!!??? Seriously? Johnathan is in the most awkward and difficult situation humanly possible. His father is a king, dethroned by an invisible God. If Johnathan didn't have faith in God, he would have just tried to kill David himself... but if he does believe, then OF COURSE HE IS GOING TO TRY TO GAIN FAVOR WITH GOD'S NEW ANNOINTED KING. He would be stupid not to!! He did what SAUL SHOULD HAVE DONE!! This has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard, and I have no idea why anyone would gather in a conference to listen to THAT. I don't know how he has even one follower, let alone that whole room full of people.
 
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SophieT

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#19
#19
SomeDisciple said:
The "tradition" was that when a new family came in to rule, the new king would kill all the biological descendants of the old king???
Must've been a "new tradition" considering Saul was the first king of Israel. You'd have to be totally blind to think that David was ever gonna kill Saul, let alone Jonathan. What is wrong with this guy? Saul was chasing David around trying to kill him, and David FELT BAD ABOUT TRIMMING THE SKIRT OF HIS GARMENT. I probably would have cut his throat and then maybe felt bad about it afterward.

You have got to be kidding me right now... even if Johnathan had "forced" David to make a vow not to kill him... CAN YOU REALLY BLAME HIM!!!??? Seriously? Johnathan is in the most awkward and difficult situation humanly possible. His father is a king, dethroned by an invisible God. If Johnathan didn't have faith in God, he would have just tried to kill David himself... but if he does believe, then OF COURSE HE IS GOING TO TRY TO GAIN FAVOR WITH GOD'S NEW ANNOINTED KING. He would be stupid not to!! He did what SAUL SHOULD HAVE DONE!! This has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard, and I have no idea why anyone would gather in a conference to listen to THAT. I don't know how he has even one follower, let alone that whole room full of people.
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umm...who are you talking to here?
 
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