Robert Morris says Jonathan had a "Jezebel spirit"

[Gideon300]

In the following video Robert Morris teaches on the "Jezebel spirit." Don't recall hearing about that one in the New Testament.

At 34:27, he gives as an example Jonathan and David. In his mind, Jonathan was possessed by a Jezebel spirit. He was insecure and wasn't a true friend to David. He says, in essence, Jonathan was controlling and manipulated David so he (Jonathan) would be well-positioned whether David lived or died.

Morris is the guy who told his congregation if they didn't tithe they were opening the door for demon possession. The lies just keep on comin'.

Robert Morris had a point with Jonathon. David had been anointed King by Samuel. It seems to me that Jonathon had divided loyalties. He was loyal to Saul to the point of dying with him, yet protected David from Saul's wrath.

It is noteworthy that Jonathon lost his life. I believe that Jonathon could easily have been a snare. Saul's descendants did not hand over the crown to David peacefully. We don't know which side Jonathon would have chosen. Jonathon may have tried to take the crown for himself.

Before criticising Robert Morris, it would help you to listen to his "Living Free" seminar series. He goes into great depth and backs up his statements with scripture. Jezebel was a manipulator who caused King Ahab to sin against God. There is certainly such a thing as a Jezebel spirit. In the early days of our small fellowship, one of the women began phoning people in the group. She was planting seeds of dissent, especially against the pastor. She started with me, as we were sort of dating. It was subtle and crafty.

At the same time, one of the other women had a word of knowledge about the situation and phoned me to warn me. She had the word "Jezebel" from the Lord. I ended the friendship immediately and the woman left the fellowship. Some time later, she called to apologise to the pastor. She had moved on by then, so we did not see her again.

 

[SophieT]

It's my response to the video in the original post.

thanks

 

[Dino246]

Yes this can be an issue, but without tithing the ministry might be challenging to do, and I don't just mean monetary tithing. In fact I wish more people would tithe of their time instead of their money, we would have a better chance of being a church family if we stopped being consumers.

According to Scripture, tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing.

There is no requirement in Scripture for Christians to "tithe"... period. There is no encouragement in Scripture for Christians to "tithe"... period. Tithing is giving the tenth (fractional or ordinal) portion of your increase to the Levites at the temple. Nine percent is not a tithe, neither is 20%. Even those who claim to "tithe" 10% probably don't, because they fail to account for vacation, retirement, medical, and other benefits that have specific dollar values but aren't normally paid in cash.

Scripture teaches Christians to be generous with their money. Under the Old Covenant, tithing had nothing to do with generosity; it was required, as taxes are today.

There is absolutely nothing in Scripture about "tithing time". In fact, if there were, and it were required of Christians, each and every Christian would have to spend two hours and twenty-four minutes EVERY DAY on behalf of the local assembly, not counting Sunday morning assembly. There certainly is no scriptural support for tithing time instead of money.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Morris is the guy who told his congregation if they didn't tithe they were opening the door for demon possession.

So why are you wasting your time posting on Morris? Obviously his preaching is nonsense.

 

[ResidentAlien]

There is certainly such a thing as a Jezebel spirit.

If there's a Jezebel spirit why aren't we warned about it in the New Testament? You'll never find any of these newfangled "spirits" anywhere in the New Testament? Why is that?

It's simple: because if it's in the New Testament the answer for how to deal with them would be there too. As it is, people unfortunate enough to think they're possessed by one of these spirits must purchase books or other materials to learn how to get rid of them. You're being conned and you can't even see it. Open your eyes.

 

[ResidentAlien]

So why are you wasting your time posting on Morris? Obviously his preaching is nonsense.

You think I shouldn't post about him?

 

[Nehemiah6]

You think I shouldn't post about him?

Correct. Ignore him and all others like him. What did Christ say?
Matthew 15:14 (KJV) Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

 

[ResidentAlien]

I know you're not that ignorant of scripture and of our responsibility to warn others of the wolves in our midst. The coward is the one who flees to save his own skin when he sees the wolves coming.

 

[Nehemiah6]

In the following video Robert Morris teaches on the "Jezebel spirit."

Since Jezebel came long after Jonathan, that makes no sense. Furthermore she was a wicked witch -- worshipping false gods and idols, committing murder, etc. Jonathan was a righteous man. How in the world could he have a "Jezebel spirit"? Looks like Morris just makes things up. Why is anyone listening to him?

 

[ResidentAlien]

Since Jezebel came long after Jonathan, that makes no sense. Furthermore she was a wicked witch -- worshipping false gods and idols, committing murder, etc. Jonathan was a righteous man. How in the world could he have a "Jezebel spirit"? Looks like Morris just makes things up. Why is anyone listening to him?

I'll tell you what they'd say: The Jezebel spirit existed before Jezebel and she just happened to be possessed by it. But since nowhere in the New Testament does it warn us about any "Jezebel spirit," it's obviously nonsense.

 

[JaumeJ]

If there's a Jezebel spirit why aren't we warned about it in the New Testament? You'll never find any of these newfangled "spirits" anywhere in the New Testament? Why is that?

It's simple: because if it's in the New Testament the answer for how to deal with them would be there too. As it is, people unfortunate enough to think they're possessed by one of these spirits must purchase books or other materials to learn how to get rid of them. You're being conned and you can't even see it. Open your eyes.

Let me know, I believe that Jezebel and her ways are mentioned in Revelation. I know she was wicked but as per a J-spirit, you will have to teach me.

 

[Buckle]

According to Scripture, tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing.

There is no requirement in Scripture for Christians to "tithe"... period. There is no encouragement in Scripture for Christians to "tithe"... period. Tithing is giving the tenth (fractional or ordinal) portion of your increase to the Levites at the temple. Nine percent is not a tithe, neither is 20%. Even those who claim to "tithe" 10% probably don't, because they fail to account for vacation, retirement, medical, and other benefits that have specific dollar values but aren't normally paid in cash.

Scripture teaches Christians to be generous with their money. Under the Old Covenant, tithing had nothing to do with generosity; it was required, as taxes are today.

There is absolutely nothing in Scripture about "tithing time". In fact, if there were, and it were required of Christians, each and every Christian would have to spend two hours and twenty-four minutes EVERY DAY on behalf of the local assembly, not counting Sunday morning assembly. There certainly is no scriptural support for tithing time instead of money.

why are people so pedantic, picking what every little term as if they are bettering the conversation. Most of ttime they just run themselves in circles, for example, "tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing", followed moments later by, "tithing is giving".

We are not commanded to tithe but there is nothing to say that we cannot use the principle of the tithe as a guide to help defray the cost of maintaining a church building and paying salaries. The tithe was meant to be given out of love for God. The purpose of tithing was to be given a chance to show generosity to care for the needy and for those whose service to the temple prevented them from cultivating land of their own to feed themselves and their families. So not really different from what we are called to do. If you have a problem with my use of the word tithe, fine (I would say to stop picking at nothing and sorry about more important things, but fine). But...call it tithing, call it being generous in our giving, we should give of, to not is going against scripture.

 

[JaumeJ]

why are people so pedantic, picking what every little term as if they are bettering the conversation. Most of ttime they just run themselves in circles, for example, "tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing", followed moments later by, "tithing is giving".

We are not commanded to tithe but there is nothing to say that we cannot use the principle of the tithe as a guide to help defray the cost of maintaining a church building and paying salaries. The tithe was meant to be given out of love for God. The purpose of tithing was to be given a chance to show generosity to care for the needy and for those whose service to the temple prevented them from cultivating land of their own to feed themselves and their families. So not really different from what we are called to do. If you have a problem with my use of the word tithe, fine (I would say to stop picking at nothing and sorry about more important things, but fine). But...call it tithing, call it being generous in our giving, we should give of, to not is going against scripture.

Back in my poor days, not rich by any means now, I did endure times of hunger and malnutrition. I would go to the mom and pop grocery store near my houwe and liberta a package of chees, in block, and go behind the store and eatt it.
When my family went to church for Christmas services, they gave me an apple. I was better off at the mom and pop sstore.

Yes people do fall through the net, I know well by my bruises, but this does not make me unaware as so many are who preach how curches "take care" of thwe flock. I would laugh but it is too painful.

Give without looking to who m it may be. Even is it is a con do not worry, you have it to give. Do not allow the left hand to know what the right hand is doing, and you will be giving according to Yeshua Jesus.

 

[TabinRivCA]

My experience is that I use to tithe part of my income and now I am able to tithe ten%, to my two Pastors who preach great messages. I can speak for myself when I say that it makes me feel like part of the ministry by helping support them. Also, it's a Spiritual thing and I have certainly had the Malachi 'windows of Heaven' being opened and blessings poured out many times and to this day.

 

[Dino246]

why are people so pedantic, picking what every little term as if they are bettering the conversation. Most of ttime they just run themselves in circles, for example, "tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing", followed moments later by, "tithing is giving".

We are not commanded to tithe but there is nothing to say that we cannot use the principle of the tithe as a guide to help defray the cost of maintaining a church building and paying salaries. The tithe was meant to be given out of love for God. The purpose of tithing was to be given a chance to show generosity to care for the needy and for those whose service to the temple prevented them from cultivating land of their own to feed themselves and their families. So not really different from what we are called to do. If you have a problem with my use of the word tithe, fine (I would say to stop picking at nothing and sorry about more important things, but fine). But...call it tithing, call it being generous in our giving, we should give of, to not is going against scripture.

Mandatory submission of resources is not generosity. Using the term "tithing" only confuses people who don't read the text for themselves.

 

[A-Sword-Cometh]

How are the mighty fallen in the midst of battle! Oh, Jonathon you were slain in high places. I am distressed for you Jonathon my brother! Very pleasant you have been to me. Your love was wonderful. The love of a true brother surpasses the love of women. Oh Jonathon, Jonathon how the mighty are fallen and the weapons of war perished!

Lament for Jonathon! Understand the heart of David! Those who do not understand the lament of David over Jonathon understand nothing about the spirit of true brotherhood. Fall upon the spirit of the Amalekite whom with his mouth testified against Saul and Jonathon with lies to the face of the King David thinking in error it be to his glory, fall upon him with the Sword commanded David!

 

[Dino246]

why are people so pedantic, picking what every little term as if they are bettering the conversation. Most of ttime they just run themselves in circles, for example, "tithing is NOT giving, and giving is NOT tithing", followed moments later by, "tithing is giving".

By the way, any thinking person who reads my post would not think for a moment that I contradicted myself. As for "pedantic", a large number of people read posts on this site and learn about Christianity. I will happily correct "every little term" when it comes to teaching correct Christian doctrine and practice, which "tithing" in any sense is not.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Morris says the Hebrew, more correctly translated, says Jonathan "forced" David to reaffirm his covenant with him. But as far as I can tell the Hebrew doesn't bear this out. In this image, the Hebrew text is from the Hebrew Bible. The translations that seem to translate it most accurately are the Christian Standard and Holman Christian Standard; as well as the English translation of the Septuagint.

I think Morris is making it up as he goes along.

 

[FaithMan]

please reference this. Thanks.

I have not heard or read that quote from him directly but he specializes in demonic possession of believers which is a false doctrine. I would not be surprised if he did say that.

 

[FaithMan]

Robert Morris had a point with Jonathon. David had been anointed King by Samuel. It seems to me that Jonathon had divided loyalties. He was loyal to Saul to the point of dying with him, yet protected David from Saul's wrath.

It is noteworthy that Jonathon lost his life. I believe that Jonathon could easily have been a snare. Saul's descendants did not hand over the crown to David peacefully. We don't know which side Jonathon would have chosen. Jonathon may have tried to take the crown for himself.

Before criticising Robert Morris, it would help you to listen to his "Living Free" seminar series. He goes into great depth and backs up his statements with scripture. Jezebel was a manipulator who caused King Ahab to sin against God. There is certainly such a thing as a Jezebel spirit. In the early days of our small fellowship, one of the women began phoning people in the group. She was planting seeds of dissent, especially against the pastor. She started with me, as we were sort of dating. It was subtle and crafty.

At the same time, one of the other women had a word of knowledge about the situation and phoned me to warn me. She had the word "Jezebel" from the Lord. I ended the friendship immediately and the woman left the fellowship. Some time later, she called to apologise to the pastor. She had moved on by then, so we did not see her again.

I have watched that series several times and he does NOT back it up with scripture. He quotes a lot of scripture out-of-context, and makes a lot of crazy assertions but does not present a sound biblically case. Presenting a scripture word salad is not that same thing as biblical proof.