Sabbath

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KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
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Then what is this discussion for? Each of does what we feel is right, and honoring God.... and we don't need to try to lay a burden of following our example upon anyone else. Why do others even have to know we are doing whatever we feel is something we need to do?
The discussion of weather we help someone out or keep the Feasts hasn't been the issue.

It's a slippery slope to say,"Each of us does what we feel is right, and honoring God....."
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
We've been over this before, but show what God said the purpose of the Law was when He gave it, not just Paul's response to those who were doing it wrong.

And I don't ignore Paul's words. I hold them in the same esteem you do.

You do not hold them in esteem when you are going against what he said, and trying to place us back under the ritualism of the law. When paul specifically said, the law is a tutor to lead us to christ, and thats all.
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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Through the translations that finally gave us the English translation of scriptures, Easter originated with Ashtaroth, the goddess of fertility along with Baal the sun god. If we acknowledge Pesach, we acknowledge God's origin of the celebration which we all should endeavor to understand, and comply with a joyful heart to its spiritual relevance. If we acknowledge "Easter Sunday" we acknowledge Ashtaroth Baal even if we have no idea the form of worship that went into the worshiping of these false gods. Colored eggs and bunnies with hot-cross buns are part of the Ashtaroth Baal celebration. I know that I'm stirring the pot, but I think God wanted me to make this relation.
Pesach Passover is the reason for the season.
LOL this is all pure invention. you have been listening to the fools of this world. Easter has nothing to do with Ashtaroth, a goddess (or being in the plural, representations of a goddess) and therefore not Baal. Provide your basic evidence (not a citation from some stupid googled site. Original documents please).

No doubt you will also provide EVIDENCE for your claim that colored eggs, bunnies and hot cross buns are directly associated with the worship of Ashtaroth? If not you are guilty of misrepresentation.

Easter celebrates the day of resurrection, and as we do not know when that was we can select any Sunday. Pesach has nothing to do with us. It was a celebration during which Israelites united with their forebears in the deliverance from Egypt. When Jesus said, 'Do this as often as you drink it' He did not mean every Passover. He meant whenever we drink red wine. If you want to keep Passover you are welcome. We will celebrate the death and resurrection of our LORD Jesus Christ.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
LOL this is all pure invention. you have been listening to the fools of this world. Easter has nothing to do with Ashtaroth, a goddess (or being in the plural, representations of a goddess) and therefore not Baal. Provide basic your evidence (not some stupid googled site).

No doubt you will also provide EVIDENCE for your claim that colored eggs, bunnies and hot cross buns are directly associated with the worship of Ashtaroth? If not you are guilty of misrepresentation.

Easter celebrates the day of resurrection, and as we do not know when that was we can select any Sunday. Pesach has nothing to do with us. It was a celebration during which Israelites united with their forebears in the deliverance from Egypt. When Jesus said, 'Do this as often as you drink it' He did not mean every Passover. He meant whenever we drink red wine. If you want to keep Passover you are welcome. We will celebrate the death and resurrection of our LORD Jesus Christ.
Actually I must agree with her. Easter has it roots in pagan cults. as does Christmas. (they were started by a pagan church)

Does that mean I will not follow easter? I know many who have come to God during easter. if God can use it, who am I to deny him an opportunity.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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You know what I do that God says to do that I feel is necessary, but most of you probably do not do?

No, you don't know.

And, so what? That is how it should be, between me and God.
 
Feb 5, 2015
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You need to teach the Law to know what it says..
Can I ask, what was the point under the new covenant in writing the law on believers minds and placing it on their hearts?
If they do not know what that law is when it is put inside of them, why was it put there?
 
Feb 5, 2015
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We've been over this before, but show what God said the purpose of the Law was when He gave it, not just Paul's response to those who were doing it wrong.

.
Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come Gal3:19

Do you disagree with Paul?
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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Actually I must agree with her. Easter has it roots in pagan cults. as does Christmas. (they were started by a pagan church)

Does that mean I will not follow easter? I know many who have come to God during easter. if God can use it, who am I to deny him an opportunity.
She said it was connected with the worship of Ashtaroth. That is untrue. Easter was not originally started by a pagan church. Nor are its roots in pagan cults. It was established in parts of the original 'Catholic (universal) church' as a celebration of the resurrection before the time of Constantine. Had it been tied to Passover it could not have always been celebrated on the Lord's Day. . The fact that worldly people have introduced 'pagan' elements into it (as worldly people will always do) does not counter that fact.

Nor was Christmas commenced as a pagan festival as its very name reveals. No one knew the correct date for the birth of Christ (except a few fanatics lol) so they wisely selected a time when Christians could celebrate Christ while others were celebrating the sun. It was one of the only times when the majority of Christians could claim 'a day off'. And it enabled them to AVOID pagan celebrations.

These myths are invented by people who want to think themselves clever.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
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NO, IT IS NOT THE PURPOSE OF THE LAW

The purpose of the law is exactly what Paul said it was. to prove, if we have coveted, we have failed to live up to Gods righteous standard. and need Christ. It is a schoolmaster TO LEAD IS TO CHRIST. But after we have faith, WE NO LONGER NEED THE SCHOOLMASTER.

The law. "do not covet" does not tell us how to do that. it can;t it just plainly says, Do not covet.

all it can do is give us a false sense of security, I do not covet my neighbor so I must love him, yet in reality I can hate the person with everything I have. or he has nothing I want to begin with.

Just because I do not covet what he has, does not mean I love him.

Thats the problem with your style of legalism, it gives people a false hope. a false sense of security, and a false sense of what love really is.
I could be wrong, but it seems as if you have a hard time believing you can follow the Law out of Love. But I can guarantee that I love God while following the Law just as much as you love God not intentionally following the Law. If that is the case, and again I could be wrong, then we're not going to a common ground, and that's OK by me.
 
Dec 26, 2014
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Honoring Yahweh, Paul kept the commandments. He obeyed the Creator. and the Savior.

and he learned from the Savior by revelation.

and he still kept all the (ten) commandments (and more, but ten is good here).

all his life. as did all the apostles, as did they teach, as Yahshua King Messiah Savior taught them.

hasatan changed things. not Yahweh nor Yahshua, but hasatan changed things (in the heresy church).

today most follow the heresy church, in part or in full deception.

only a few escape the evil clutches of this world.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
She said it was connected with the worship of Ashtaroth. That is untrue. Easter was not originally started by a pagan church. Nor are its roots in pagan cults. It was established in parts of the original 'Catholic (universal) church' as a celebration of the resurrection before the time of Constantine. Had it been tied to Passover it could not have always been celebrated on the Lord's Day. . The fact that worldly people have introduced 'pagan' elements into it (as worldly people will always do) does not counter that fact.

Nor was Christmas commenced as a pagan festival as its very name reveals. No one knew the correct date for the birth of Christ (except a few fanatics lol) so they wisely selected a time when Christians could celebrate Christ while others were celebrating the sun. It was one of the only times when the majority of Christians could claim 'a day off'. And it enabled them to AVOID pagan celebrations.

These myths are invented by people who want to think themselves clever.
That origional catholic church is the pagan church I spoke of
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
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Yeah I do. I would expect them to take the love I have for them, and share it with others. for that is the only way I know they love me.

If they take my love for them, and do not share it with others, I know they do not respect me at all. They are using me.



If your trying to relate to God by ritualism, then your acting like a pagan. That is what Paul said in gal 4.
I am am relating to God in love. And that is often demonstrated through obeying God. Not just saying it. Obedience to Him sometime involves ritual and ceremony. But if that ritual and ceremony is done without love, it is worthless.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,054
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You do not hold them in esteem when you are going against what he said, and trying to place us back under the ritualism of the law. When paul specifically said, the law is a tutor to lead us to christ, and thats all.
Again, it's not just ritualism of the Law. It's love for God expressed in action, sometimes ritual.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
I could be wrong, but it seems as if you have a hard time believing you can follow the Law out of Love.

No. I love, and when I do. I follow the law. I do not need some law to tell me how to do it. It just happens.


But I can guarantee that I love God while following the Law just as much as you love God not intentionally following the Law. If that is the case, and again I could be wrong, then we're not going to a common ground, and that's OK by me.

You are free to love God how you wish.

I just fear what you teach gives people a false sense of security, and maybe even yourself. I say it out of experience, and what I have seen.

Again, Just because you do not covet, does not mean you love at all. if your sense of security of how well you love is based because you do not covet (follow law) your in danger of a false sense of humilty. and lack of love

that was the problem with the pharisees. and is the problem with every legalistic church I have ever attended.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,054
257
83
You know what I do that God says to do that I feel is necessary, but most of you probably do not do?

No, you don't know.

And, so what? That is how it should be, between me and God.
to an extent, you're right. I don't know what your relationship with God looks like. But as I said it is a slippery slope to say that it is ok to not do what God said to do and still say you love Him.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,054
257
83
Can I ask, what was the point under the new covenant in writing the law on believers minds and placing it on their hearts?
If they do not know what that law is when it is put inside of them, why was it put there?
to show us how to do it in spirit and truth.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,054
257
83

No. I love, and when I do. I follow the law. I do not need some law to tell me how to do it. It just happens.




You are free to love God how you wish.

I just fear what you teach gives people a false sense of security, and maybe even yourself. I say it out of experience, and what I have seen.

Again, Just because you do not covet, does not mean you love at all. if your sense of security of how well you love is based because you do not covet (follow law) your in danger of a false sense of humilty. and lack of love

that was the problem with the pharisees. and is the problem with every legalistic church I have ever attended.
There is no goal of security in following the Law. As has been said ad naseum obedience doesn't earn salvation, justification, righteousness, approval or security with God. It is all done as a response to the love, grace and mercy already given to us.
 
Feb 5, 2015
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to show us how to do it in spirit and truth.

When you became a Christian did you know it was wrong to commit adultery before you read that in the bible or had it explained to you by a minister? I did
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,054
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Some do, some do not. Personally, Adultery had never crossed my mind until God started showing me in His word.