Sabbath

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Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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we would do well not to leave out where He says through Jeremiah,

It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt
(Jeremiah 31:32)

Good point, now we know Scriptures dont cancel eachother out, and those ones I posted had a meaning and showed something.. So how is it the same COvenant yet has changes? Its different because there is no Levitical priesthood, Yahshua is Hgih Priestm, huge difference.

again PS 105 makes it clear that the covenant with Abraham was the same as with Israel..

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Abraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.”

yet it has differences in our end of the deal. I present the idea that Messiah was the only true blood that ever sealed the covenant ever. That it was Yah's purpose since the beginning.
and not to forget, to Abraham, then to Isaac, and then to Jacob ((Israel)) He made a covenant to give them the land:
He had a dream, and behold, a ladder was set on the earth with its top reaching to heaven; and behold, the angels of God were ascending and descending on it. And behold, the LORD stood above it and said, “I am the LORD, the God of your father Abraham and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie, I will give it to you and to your descendants."
(Genesis 28:12-13)
to the children of Israel in the wildreness He said, 'if' they keep the Law. the blessings and the curses.
to Abraham, to Isaac, to Jacob, He simply promised.
and the deal to inherit the land stands and is to all who inherit the Kingdom:

Psalm 37:29, “The righteous shall inherit the earth, and dwell in it forever.”

Genesis 12:1-3, “And יהוה said to Aḇram, “Go yourself out of your land, from your relatives and from your father’s house, to a land which I show you. And I shall make you a great nation, and bless you and make your name great, and you shall be a blessing! And I shall bless those who bless you, and curse him who curses you. And in you all the clans of the earth shall be blessed.”

Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Aḇraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.”
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
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Each verse of scripture that God has given us can be read on many levels, not just one. It is history and can be read as a physical history. The same verse has a spiritual meaning, and can be read as spiritual instruction. There is also a hidden, much deeper meaning that comes to us with prayer.
 

Grandpa

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Jun 24, 2011
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But Hebrews 4 says there remains a rest that we must enter. The rest is when the Kingdom of God is manifested in our lives [ie: in the Kingdom]. Until then there also remains work.

Php. 2:12 "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

So I will take a third option and keep working out my salvation, not by keeping a law but by obeying God.

Luke 6:46 "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"

View attachment 187122
Exactly my same question.

Why do you call yourself Christian and yet continue your work at the law and DO NOT do the things the Lord said to do?

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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Yes I beleive it is the same because if we look at PS 105 there is no doubt that the Covenant made with Abraham was continued with Israel:

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Abraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.

Jeremiah 31:33, “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people.”

and about Galatians Paul also says it is the same covenant as Abraham as with Messiah:

Romans 9:6-8, “However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed.”

Galatians 3:27-29, “For as many of you as were immersed into Messiah have put on Messiah. There is not Yehuḏi nor Greek, there is not slave nor free, there is not male and female, for you are all one in Messiah יהושע. And if you are of Messiah, then you are seed of Aḇraham, and heirs according to promise.”

and PS 105 and Jer 31 show the COvenant with Abraham is the same as with Israel... I think and this is me summing it up, YHWH basically made a Covenant for all mankind that would partake in it, and at different times different people did, malak-zadiq was the high priest at one point than men were, yet same covenant, men died and new priests came, same covenant, it seems like i said before that the difference between a physical priesthood and living under that would have been such a ridical chage to have Yahshua as High Priest, and some of the allegory is spot on, because the levitical priesthood's "atonement" was much harder "work" on the average person than what the aversage person has under the HighPriest Yahshua... A lot there but that is basic view. but again those first 2 passages I posted are clear IMO.
the Covenant listed in Psalm 105 is the same as which Covenant? the same Covenant talked about in Jeremiah 31? Can a person or people have more than one Covenant with God at the same time?

in Galatians chapter 4 Paul talks about 2 Covenants. which one do you feel is the same talked about in Romans 9? Or is there a covenant mentioned in Romans 9? I believe there is a covenant mentioned in Romans 11. but I was asking about Galatians chapter 4, not chapter 3.

I disagree that the passages you posted support your position. the big question I want to ask, is

is there more than one Covenant or just one Covenant throughout history for all time?
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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Each verse of scripture that God has given us can be read on many levels, not just one. It is history and can be read as a physical history. The same verse has a spiritual meaning, and can be read as spiritual instruction. There is also a hidden, much deeper meaning that comes to us with prayer.
See, now, I agree with that! But I can't figure out then why sometimes people go on to say that we must therefore keep the Sabbath physically.
 
Aug 8, 2018
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If someone goes to church on Sunday they've refuted that argument.
We meet on a Sunday because that is still the most convenient day for most (but not all) people to do so. If we had to meet on, say, a Wednesday evening, it would not bother me at all.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
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See, now, I agree with that! But I can't figure out then why sometimes people go on to say that we must therefore keep the Sabbath physically.
If we love the Lord we will do as the Lord tells us. That does not mean that we don't rest in what the Lord has done for us so our sins are forgiven. We are to have absolute confidence in what Christ has done for us. But if we question ourselves about working for the Lord in love, in never rebelling against Him, like Paul says: heaven forbid.
 

Yahshua

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Sep 22, 2013
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I can understand the argument of Christ being our rest, as we rest in him and have his peace. But that still doesn't take away from what we're commanded to do. In fact, it's supported by it.

-----

We all know that the children of Israel failed to enter into the promised land. Everything that happened to them was for our example. Notice what Hebrews says...

Hebrews 3:7-11 [Brackets mine]
7 Wherefore (as the Holy [Spirit] saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,

8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:

9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do always err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.

11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)


So here Hebrews equates entering the promised land with entering into Yah's rest.

-Promised land = Yah's rest


Hebrews 3:12-19 [Brackets mine]
12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast unto the end;

15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.

16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.

17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?

18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?

19 So we see that they could not enter in [Yah's Rest] because of unbelief.


And here Hebrews equates unbelief and the act of sinning, telling the reader to exhort each other daily to avoid sinning.

-The Act of Sinning = Unbelief

So the generation of Israel couldn't enter into Yah's rest (i.e. their promised kingdom) because of their act of sin, caused by unbelieving hearts...and it's the basics of the faith that sinning = breaking Yah's commandments. In the case of Israel, they were commanded to enter the land and take it from the giants, but they refused.

-The Act of sinning = Breaking Yah's commandments = Unbelief

So if we refuse to do something Yah commands us to do, that is sin and shows we don't trust & believe in Him.


Hebrews 4:1-3 [Brackets mine]
Let us therefore [i.e. based on what was just said in chapter 3] fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.


Here Hebrews builds on what was previously said using the word "therefore", so we must add to what was established:

-(Chapter 3) The Act of sinning = Unbelief = Breaking Yah's commandments

-THEREFORE the opposite is true...

-Belief = Not Sinning = Obedience to Yah's commandments

Thus we are told to fear coming short of Yah's rest, because those who already believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest. The overarching point is supported: "to remain steadfast until the end and to exhort each other daily to avoid sin".


Hebrews 4:4-9 [brackets mine]
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief [i.e. sinning]:

7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

8 For if [Joshua] had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.


Here Hebrews builds on what was said again using the word "therefore", so we must add to what was established:

-Those who believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest.

-THEREFORE some still must enter Yah's rest because of their unbelief (i.e. their sinning), saying today is the day to hear His voice and not harden our hearts...because if Israel had received rest in the promised land Joshua wouldn't have spoken of another day of rest still remaining; their Sabbath day.


Hebrews 4:9-11
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief [i.e. sinning].


Here we're given a double dose of "therefore", concluding the point. So let's build on the previous points:

-Yah's rest = Promised Land (Promised Kingdom)

-The Act of sinning = Breaking Yah's commandments = Unbelief

-Belief = Not Sinning = Obedience to Yah's commandments

-Those who believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest.

-Some still must enter Yah's rest because of their unbelief (i.e. their sinning)

-The Sabbath day = Day of Rest

THEREFORE there remains a Sabbath Day for Yah's people.

THEREFORE let's WORK HARD to enter into that Sabbath day lest anyone falls short of it through sin.


Hebrews 4:12-15 [Brackets mine]
12 For the word of God [i.e. The Living Torah = Yah's Law made Flesh] is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession [i.e. the steadfastness til the end to resist the temptation of sin].

15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace [i.e. divine strength], that we may obtain mercy [i.e. unmerited forgiveness for our sins], and find grace [i.e. divine strength] to help [i.e. obey Yah's commandments] in time of need [i.e. when we are tempted to sin].


A final "therefore" concluding the matter. Let's put everything together:

We must work hard to enter into the Sabbath kingdom of Yah by first going to his throne to receive (a) forgiveness of our sins and (b) His divine strength to obey his commandments and resist sin's temptation to prove our belief in him, holding fast to who we profess we are: follow-ers of Christ.

(Hebrews 5 Then goes into how sins are truly washed by Christ, the true High Priest)


Revelation 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus

We must walk how Christ walked to find rest in him.
 

Shamah

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Jan 6, 2018
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1 John/Yahanan 2:6, "He who says he abides in Him, is himself also obligated to walk as He walked."

1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”
 

Shamah

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Jan 6, 2018
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the Covenant listed in Psalm 105 is the same as which Covenant? the same Covenant talked about in Jeremiah 31? Can a person or people have more than one Covenant with God at the same time?

in Galatians chapter 4 Paul talks about 2 Covenants. which one do you feel is the same talked about in Romans 9? Or is there a covenant mentioned in Romans 9? I believe there is a covenant mentioned in Romans 11. but I was asking about Galatians chapter 4, not chapter 3.

I disagree that the passages you posted support your position. the big question I want to ask, is

is there more than one Covenant or just one Covenant throughout history for all time?
Yes I believe it is thsame covenant spoken of in PS 1-5 as Jer 31:

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Abraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.”

Jeremiah 31:33, “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people.”

I beleive also that YHWH can make as many COvenants as He wants, however concerning the covenant made to Abraham, PS 105 and PS 89 are clear it is the same one. COncerning Galatians and ROmans you would have to cite what passages you are speaking of.

As I said before it's the same covenant made with Abraham under the high priest Malakzadiq as the covenant ratified in the blood of Messiah:

Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Aḇraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.”

Jeremiah 31:33, “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people.”

Galatians 3:27-29, “For as many of you as were immersed into Messiah have put on Messiah. There is not Yehuḏi nor Greek, there is not slave nor free, there is not male and female, for you are all one in Messiah יהושע. And if you are of Messiah, then you are seed of Aḇraham, and heirs according to promise.”

Psalm 89:26-37, “He will call out to Me; ‘You are My Father, O YHWH! You are the Rock of My salvation!’ And I will make Him My firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth. My mercy I will keep for Him forever and My covenant will stand fast with Him. And I will establish His Seed forever, and His throne will be as the days of heaven. Should His children forsake My Law, and refuse to walk in My judgments; Should they profane My statutes, and fail to keep My commandments; Then I will punish their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with lashes from the whip. Nevertheless, My lovingkindness I will not utterly withdraw from Him, nor will I ever betray My faithfulness. My covenant I will not break, nor will I change what has gone out of My lips. Once for all, I have vowed by My holiness, I cannot lie, and I say to David; His Seed will endure forever, and His throne will endure before Me like the sun. His throne will be established forever like the moon: the faithful witness in the sky.”

Genesis 14:18-20, “And Malkitsyḏeq sovereign of Shalym brought out bread and wine. Now he was the priest of the Most High Strength. And he blessed him and said, “Blessed be Aḇram of the Most High Strength, Possessor of the heavens and earth. And blessed be the Most High Strength who has delivered your enemies into your hand.” And he gave him a tenth of all.”

Matthew 26:26-29, “And as they were eating, יהושע took bread, and having blessed, broke and gave it to the taught ones and said, “Take, eat, this is My body. And taking the cup, and giving thanks, He gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood, that of the (new/renewed*) covenant, which is shed for many for the forgiveness of sins. But I say to you, I shall certainly not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on till that day when I drink it anew with you in the reign of My Father.”

Yet while there are varying manuscripts the most reliable and oldest simply says "the Covenant" not new or renewed:

Matthew 26:28
Strong'sTransliterationGreekEnglishMorphology
3778 [e]toutoτοῦτοthisDPro-NNS
1063 [e]garγάρindeedConj
1510 [e]estinἐστινisV-PIA-3S
3588 [e]toτὸtheArt-NNS
129 [e]haimaαἷμάbloodN-NNS
1473 [e]mouμουof me,PPro-G1S
3588 [e]tēsτῆςof theArt-GFS
1242 [e]diathēkēsδιαθήκηςcovenant,N-GFS
3588 [e]toτὸ - Art-NNS
4012 [e]periπερὶforPrep
4183 [e]pollōnπολλῶνmanyAdj-GMP
1632 [e]ekchynnomenonἐκχυννόμενονbeing poured out,V-PPM/P-NNS
1519 [e]eisεἰςforPrep
859 [e]aphesinἄφεσινforgivenessN-AFS
266 [e]hamartiōnἁμαρτιῶν.of sins.N-GFP

it is called "perpetual Covenant" in the much ignored "OT"
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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HBG. Pa. USA
The clause "There remaineth therefore" is in the indicative mood. Which means it is a simple statement of fact; therefore a command.

And the simple statement of fact is, He that has entered into the Gospel Rest ceases from there own work AS GOD DID FROM HIS. GOD did not cease from trying to work out HIS own righteousness outside of Christ like we are called to do. GOD rested the Seventh Day from all HIS work which HE had made. Physical labor not Spiritual! So we rest from our physical labor also because there remaineth a Sabbath keeping to the people of GOD. For he that has entered into the Gospel cease from there own work as GOD did from HIS on the Seventh Day.
imperative is command form of language. the statement that a rest remains comes after it is explained that rest didn't come through Joshua, as demonstrated by God speaking through David appointing 'another day' called 'today'

His rest is revealed through this as having a substance beyond the shadow which is the physical sign of ritual observation given at Sinai.

the intent is not physical but spiritual.
Let's take a look.

Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel), any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , as HE said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel): although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For HE spake in a certain place (Mt. Sinai in the giving of the Commandments) of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this again (HE speaks), IF they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel).

A few things being mention in these last verses. The giving (speaking) of The Seventh Day and GOD resting on it. And the Seventh Day being brought up again (HE speaks) IF they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel)

Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , and they to whom it was first preached entered not in (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) because of unbelief (Stiff necked hard hearted disobedience): Again, he limiteth a certain day (period), saying in David, To day, (a call to repentance right now; to accept the rest, Katapausis; the ceasing down, the Gospel) after so long a time; as it is said, To day (right now) if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. For if Jesus had given them rest (Settling down; the Gospel), then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. There remaineth therefore a rest (Sabbatismos; A Sabbath keeping) to the people of God. (is being said in relation to verses 3-5 not 7 and 8. Verses 7 and 8 are a scriptural reference being used for a call to repentance. Verses 9 and 10 pick up from verses 3-5 to hold the context of the Seventh Day being spoken of)) For he that is entered into his rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Two separate rests being spoken of in Hebrews 4. The Gospel rest and the the Seventh Day Sabbath. A distinction is being made between the two in verses 9 and 10. A rest (Sabbath keeping) that remains and a rest (the Gospel) that has been entered. The ceasing from their own works as GOD did from HIS (a Sabbath keeping) is something that is being done in addition to entering into the Rest (Gospel). Not the Same thing or a result of.

There remaineth therefore a rest (a Sabbath Keeping) to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest (the Gospel), he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour (be diligent) therefore to enter into that rest (the Gospel), lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief (hard heart; stiff necked disobedience). For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
(Heb 4:9-12 KJV)

As GOD did from HIS is a DIRECT COMPARISON. He that has entered into his rest; the Gospel. Ceases from his own work like GOD did from HIS. GOD IS RIGHTEOUSNESS HE DID NOT CEASE FROM TRYING TO WORK OUT HIS OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS AND REST IN CHRIST AS WE DO. GOD rested the Seventh Day from all HIS work which HE had made. Physical labor not Spiritual! So we rest from our physical labor also as GOD did because of our entering into our rest in Christ.
 

lightbearer

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Jun 17, 2017
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Yes I believe it is thsame covenant spoken of in PS 1-5 as Jer 31:

Psalms 105:6-10, “O seed of Aḇraham His servant, Children of Ya‛aqoḇ, His chosen ones! He is יהוה our Strength; His right-rulings are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, The Word He commanded, for a thousand generations, The covenant He made with Abraham, And His oath to Yitsḥaq, And established it to Ya‛aqoḇ for a law, To Yisra’yl – an everlasting covenant.”

Jeremiah 31:33, “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Yisra’yl: After those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people.”

I beleive also that YHWH can make as many COvenants as He wants, however concerning the covenant made to Abraham, PS 105 and PS 89 are clear it is the same one. COncerning Galatians and ROmans you would have to cite what passages you are speaking of.

As I said before it's the same covenant made with Abraham under the high priest Malakzadiq as the covenant ratified in the blood of Messiah:

Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though YHWH's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Yisra’yl who belongs to Yisra’yl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are YHWH's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."
"
Nice post!
The following text emphasize the point even more. The Covenant to which most call new has always been available!

or this command which I am commanding you day is not too wonderful for you, nor is it too far off. It is not in the heavens that you should say, Who shall go up into the heavens for us, and bring it to us, and cause us to hear it, that we may do it? And it is not beyond the sea that you should say, Who shall cross over for us to the region beyond the sea and take it for us, and cause us to hear it, that we may do it? For the word is very near to you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may do it.
(Deu 30:11-14 LITV-TSP)
But the righteousness of faith says this: "Do not say in your heart, Who will go up into Heaven?" (that is, to bring down Christ); or, "Who will go down into the abyss?" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith which we proclaim) Deut. 9:4; 30:12-14 .
(Rom 10:6-8 LITV-TSP)

The Word; the Law through Christ in the heart and mouth is the same as....

But this shall be the covenant that I will cut with the house of Israel: After those days, declares Jehovah, I will put My law in their inward parts, and I will write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. And they shall no longer each man teach his neighbor, and each man his brother, saying, Know Jehovah. For they shall all know Me, from the least of them even to the greatest of them, declares Jehovah. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sins no more.
(Jer 31:33-34 LITV-TSP)

"This is the covenant which I will covenant to them after those days, says the Lord: Giving My laws on their hearts, and I will write them on their minds;" also He adds , "I will not at all still remember their sins" and their lawless deeds. LXX-Jer. 38:33, 34 MT-Jer. 31:33, 34
(Heb 10:16-17 LITV-TSP)
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
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Let's take a look.

Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel), any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , as HE said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel): although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For HE spake in a certain place (Mt. Sinai in the giving of the Commandments) of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this again (HE speaks), IF they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel).

A few things being mention in these last verses. The giving (speaking) of The Seventh Day and GOD resting on it. And the Seventh Day being brought up again (HE speaks) IF they shall enter into my rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel)

Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , and they to whom it was first preached entered not in (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) because of unbelief (Stiff necked hard hearted disobedience): Again, he limiteth a certain day (period), saying in David, To day, (a call to repentance right now; to accept the rest, Katapausis; the ceasing down, the Gospel) after so long a time; as it is said, To day (right now) if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts. For if Jesus had given them rest (Settling down; the Gospel), then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. There remaineth therefore a rest (Sabbatismos; A Sabbath keeping) to the people of God. (is being said in relation to verses 3-5 not 7 and 8. Verses 7 and 8 are a scriptural reference being used for a call to repentance. Verses 9 and 10 pick up from verses 3-5 to hold the context of the Seventh Day being spoken of)) For he that is entered into his rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest (Katapausis; ceasing down, the Gospel) , lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Two separate rests being spoken of in Hebrews 4. The Gospel rest and the the Seventh Day Sabbath. A distinction is being made between the two in verses 9 and 10. A rest (Sabbath keeping) that remains and a rest (the Gospel) that has been entered. The ceasing from their own works as GOD did from HIS (a Sabbath keeping) is something that is being done in addition to entering into the Rest (Gospel). Not the Same thing or a result of.

There remaineth therefore a rest (a Sabbath Keeping) to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest (the Gospel), he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour (be diligent) therefore to enter into that rest (the Gospel), lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief (hard heart; stiff necked disobedience). For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
(Heb 4:9-12 KJV)

As GOD did from HIS is a DIRECT COMPARISON. He that has entered into his rest; the Gospel. Ceases from his own work like GOD did from HIS. GOD IS RIGHTEOUSNESS HE DID NOT CEASE FROM TRYING TO WORK OUT HIS OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS AND REST IN CHRIST AS WE DO. GOD rested the Seventh Day from all HIS work which HE had made. Physical labor not Spiritual! So we rest from our physical labor also as GOD did because of our entering into our rest in Christ.
just to correct this disimformation- the word Katapausis means- the day of rest, which could point to the Sabbath- it can also mean - where I can rest, basically Heaven ( the place where God dwells , the literal translation ). and can also mean the rest of death ( the rest after the toils and trails of life on earth are over).

it can also be rendered dwelling, habitation . another rendering has it meaning the calming of the winds.

so, while it can mean Sabbath, there seems to be a point to Heaven much more than Sabbath . and nothing about the Gospel, you just made that up.
 

Grandpa

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Jun 24, 2011
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I can understand the argument of Christ being our rest, as we rest in him and have his peace. But that still doesn't take away from what we're commanded to do. In fact, it's supported by it.

-----

We all know that the children of Israel failed to enter into the promised land. Everything that happened to them was for our example. Notice what Hebrews says...
Hebrews 4:1-3 [Brackets mine]
Let us therefore [i.e. based on what was just said in chapter 3] fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.


Here Hebrews builds on what was previously said using the word "therefore", so we must add to what was established:

-(Chapter 3) The Act of sinning = Unbelief = Breaking Yah's commandments

-THEREFORE the opposite is true...

-Belief = Not Sinning = Obedience to Yah's commandments

Thus we are told to fear coming short of Yah's rest, because those who already believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest. The overarching point is supported: "to remain steadfast until the end and to exhort each other daily to avoid sin".


Hebrews 4:4-9 [brackets mine]
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief [i.e. sinning]:

7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.

8 For if [Joshua] had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.


Here Hebrews builds on what was said again using the word "therefore", so we must add to what was established:

-Those who believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest.

-THEREFORE some still must enter Yah's rest because of their unbelief (i.e. their sinning), saying today is the day to hear His voice and not harden our hearts...because if Israel had received rest in the promised land Joshua wouldn't have spoken of another day of rest still remaining; their Sabbath day.


Hebrews 4:9-11
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief [i.e. sinning].


Here we're given a double dose of "therefore", concluding the point. So let's build on the previous points:

-Yah's rest = Promised Land (Promised Kingdom)

-The Act of sinning = Breaking Yah's commandments = Unbelief

-Belief = Not Sinning = Obedience to Yah's commandments

-Those who believe [i.e. obey Yah's commandments = don't sin] do enter into His rest.

-Some still must enter Yah's rest because of their unbelief (i.e. their sinning)

-The Sabbath day = Day of Rest

THEREFORE there remains a Sabbath Day for Yah's people.

THEREFORE let's WORK HARD to enter into that Sabbath day lest anyone falls short of it through sin.


Hebrews 4:12-15 [Brackets mine]
12 For the word of God [i.e. The Living Torah = Yah's Law made Flesh] is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession [i.e. the steadfastness til the end to resist the temptation of sin].

15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace [i.e. divine strength], that we may obtain mercy [i.e. unmerited forgiveness for our sins], and find grace [i.e. divine strength] to help [i.e. obey Yah's commandments] in time of need [i.e. when we are tempted to sin].


A final "therefore" concluding the matter. Let's put everything together:

We must work hard to enter into the Sabbath kingdom of Yah by first going to his throne to receive (a) forgiveness of our sins and (b) His divine strength to obey his commandments and resist sin's temptation to prove our belief in him, holding fast to who we profess we are: follow-ers of Christ.

(Hebrews 5 Then goes into how sins are truly washed by Christ, the true High Priest)


Revelation 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus

We must walk how Christ walked to find rest in him.
Galatians 2:19 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

If you could look to the law and obey it and not sin then you could be righteous because of your own obedience and your own understanding and strength.

But you can't. Because your carnal understanding and your "strength" fall woefully short of EVER fulfilling the Spiritual Law.

Galatians 3:10-12
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


See? Working at the law is not of faith. So people who are looking to the law to try and obey it CANNOT enter into Rest because they don't have faith. Same as the ancient people before who didn't enter in because of UNBELIEF.

Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

The law is not of faith. So if you go back to your understanding of the law, ie following a Saturday or 7th day sabbath, then you are not justified in the sight of God. You are in un-belief and cannot enter rest.

You would have to repent from your sinful ways and come to Christ to receive rest. Which includes Righteousness, Justification, Salvation, Obedience, Faith and every good thing that is needful for Life and Godliness.


It seems kind of weird, doesn't it, that those who insist on following their understanding of the law are the ones that are disobedient and un-righteous before God?

Thank God for the NT scriptures. It would be alot easier for the judaizers and legalists to twist scripture without it.
 

Grandpa

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Jun 24, 2011
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Romans 9:31-33
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.

32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
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Galatians 2:19 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

If you could look to the law and obey it and not sin then you could be righteous because of your own obedience and your own understanding and strength.

But you can't. Because your carnal understanding and your "strength" fall woefully short of EVER fulfilling the Spiritual Law.

Galatians 3:10-12
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


See? Working at the law is not of faith. So people who are looking to the law to try and obey it CANNOT enter into Rest because they don't have faith. Same as the ancient people before who didn't enter in because of UNBELIEF.

Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

The law is not of faith. So if you go back to your understanding of the law, ie following a Saturday or 7th day sabbath, then you are not justified in the sight of God. You are in un-belief and cannot enter rest.

You would have to repent from your sinful ways and come to Christ to receive rest. Which includes Righteousness, Justification, Salvation, Obedience, Faith and every good thing that is needful for Life and Godliness.


It seems kind of weird, doesn't it, that those who insist on following their understanding of the law are the ones that are disobedient and un-righteous before God?

Thank God for the NT scriptures. It would be alot easier for the judaizers and legalists to twist scripture without it.
But Grandpa I have to take issue with several points in your post:

1) I only used NT scriptures in my last post.

I simply reposted what Hebrews 3:7 to Hebrews 4:16 alone says in outline form, in order, and came to the same conclusion as with scripture from the OT.


2) I'm curious; why did you removed all of Hebrews 3 from my post when you quoted me, but kept the beginning of my post and all the rest? It's completely gone, like it was never written.

Hebrews 3 is what establishes the main context and point of all that's said in Hebrews 4. It's literally the heart of the message. Without it anyone can make the words "belief" and "unbelief" in Hebrews 4 mean anything they want them to mean.

What do you think about what Hebrews 3:12-19 is saying?

Adapting what an old teacher of mine would always say, "Wherefore is the 'therefore' in Hebrews 4 there for?"


3) For the passages in Galatians 2 and 3, I'd like to refer you to a post I made in July to share the context of Paul's letter that will help show that Paul was talking about "cleansing oneself", and any law intended for that effect (whether Yah's or man"s). Let me know what you think.

https://christianchat.com/threads/christian-holidays-vs-biblical-holidays.177529/post-3648007

Paul - or any NT writer for that matter - NEVER says "a person can't obey Yah's law". Never. That doctrine is not found anywhere in all of scripture from Genesis to Revelation. What IS said is "a person can't obey Yah's law to make themselves CLEAN once they're dirty with sin; that only Christ's blood can clean sin."

This is a universal truth of any law in the history of laws on this planet. Once found guilty of a crime, there is no law a person can obey to make themselves "unguilty". None. A law can only show what's right and wrong. So a criminal must either pay the price or receive forgiveness for their crime. BUT THEN...after they've either paid the price or received forgiveness, they are expected to obey the law to not be found guilty anymore.

It's a universal truth of any law in the history of laws in any society, including Yah's kingdom.

----

In the case of Christ and our sin, we can't SEE him ministering in the Heavenly temple like people could see high priests ministering in the physical temple year by year. So we need to have FAITH He's performing the task.

[This was hard for people to grasp because there was still a physical temple standing at the time Paul wrote his letters. After Christ, believers were still heading to the temple to follow the same Yah ordained sacrificial laws Christ was currently following in heaven; working at this particular law instead of having faith in Christ. They were also reverting back to man-made cleansing rites not found in Yah's law at all.]


4) Frustrating the grace of Yah is what's meant by "having a form of godliness but denying the power (of grace)". When we say we are incapable of obey Yah's law - as "believers", who've received the Holy Spirit within us and Yah's divine strength within us - we are actually denying the very reason the Holy Spirit and Yah's grace was given to us.

----

So yes it's very weird to say following Yah's law is being disobedient and unrighteous to Yah.

Obedience to Yah's law = disobedience ??o_O??

It's confusion...and Yah isn't the author of such.


Isaiah 5:20 [brackets mine]
20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:

23 Who justify the wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous from him!

24 Therefore as the fire devoures the stubble, and the flame consumes the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have cast away the law of the Lord of hosts [The Father], and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel [the Son].


Revelation 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
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But Grandpa I have to take issue with several points in your post:

1) I only used NT scriptures in my last post.

I simply reposted what Hebrews 3:7 to Hebrews 4:16 alone says in outline form, in order, and came to the same conclusion as with scripture from the OT.


2) I'm curious; why did you removed all of Hebrews 3 from my post when you quoted me, but kept the beginning of my post and all the rest? It's completely gone, like it was never written.

Hebrews 3 is what establishes the main context and point of all that's said in Hebrews 4. It's literally the heart of the message. Without it anyone can make the words "belief" and "unbelief" in Hebrews 4 mean anything they want them to mean.

What do you think about what Hebrews 3:12-19 is saying?

Adapting what an old teacher of mine would always say, "Wherefore is the 'therefore' in Hebrews 4 there for?"


3) For the passages in Galatians 2 and 3, I'd like to refer you to a post I made in July to share the context of Paul's letter that will help show that Paul was talking about "cleansing oneself", and any law intended for that effect (whether Yah's or man"s). Let me know what you think.

https://christianchat.com/threads/christian-holidays-vs-biblical-holidays.177529/post-3648007

Paul - or any NT writer for that matter - NEVER says "a person can't obey Yah's law". Never. That doctrine is not found anywhere in all of scripture from Genesis to Revelation. What IS said is "a person can't obey Yah's law to make themselves CLEAN once they're dirty with sin; that only Christ's blood can clean sin."

This is a universal truth of any law in the history of laws on this planet. Once found guilty of a crime, there is no law a person can obey to make themselves "unguilty". None. A law can only show what's right and wrong. So a criminal must either pay the price or receive forgiveness for their crime. BUT THEN...after they've either paid the price or received forgiveness, they are expected to obey the law to not be found guilty anymore.

It's a universal truth of any law in the history of laws in any society, including Yah's kingdom.

----

In the case of Christ and our sin, we can't SEE him ministering in the Heavenly temple like people could see high priests ministering in the physical temple year by year. So we need to have FAITH He's performing the task.

[This was hard for people to grasp because there was still a physical temple standing at the time Paul wrote his letters. After Christ, believers were still heading to the temple to follow the same Yah ordained sacrificial laws Christ was currently following in heaven; working at this particular law instead of having faith in Christ. They were also reverting back to man-made cleansing rites not found in Yah's law at all.]


4) Frustrating the grace of Yah is what's meant by "having a form of godliness but denying the power (of grace)". When we say we are incapable of obey Yah's law - as "believers", who've received the Holy Spirit within us and Yah's divine strength within us - we are actually denying the very reason the Holy Spirit and Yah's grace was given to us.

----

So yes it's very weird to say following Yah's law is being disobedient and unrighteous to Yah.

Obedience to Yah's law = disobedience ??o_O??

It's confusion...and Yah isn't the author of such.


Isaiah 5:20 [brackets mine]
20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:

23 Who justify the wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous from him!

24 Therefore as the fire devoures the stubble, and the flame consumes the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have cast away the law of the Lord of hosts [The Father], and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel [the Son].


Revelation 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus
The Pharisees thought they were obedient to Gods Law.

They were not.

Those who attempt to follow the law in their own understanding and strength are in un-belief and disobedience.

Why? Because working at the law does not result in anyones righteousness.

Romans 9:31-33
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.

32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Galatians 3:10-12
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


You have really long posts. So when I replied to the last one it said there was an error and couldn't be posted because it was over 10,000 characters long. So I deleted some of it so it would all fit.

I figured a person could still click on your post to go to the original one you posted.
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
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The Pharisees thought they were obedient to Gods Law.

They were not.

Those who attempt to follow the law in their own understanding and strength are in un-belief and disobedience.

Why? Because working at the law does not result in anyones righteousness.

Romans 9:31-33
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.

32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Galatians 3:10-12
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


You have really long posts. So when I replied to the last one it said there was an error and couldn't be posted because it was over 10,000 characters long. So I deleted some of it so it would all fit.

I figured a person could still click on your post to go to the original one you posted.
they wouldnet accept it as written but changed it...

Jesus does not think the Pharosees kept the Law or even try to:

Mark 7:

8You leave the commandment of God and hold to the tradition of men.”

9And he said to them, “You have a fine way of rejecting the commandment of God in order to establish your tradition!

10For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’

11But you say, ‘If a man tells his father or his mother, “Whatever you would have gained from me is Corban”’ (that is, given to God)d—

12then you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or mother,

13thus making void the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And many such things you do.”
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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As a protestant Christian i believe in righteousness by faith alone. Not by works of the law or by keeping the Sabbath holy.
That is plan isn't it.
Should we keep the law or not? A simple question, (the 10 commandments). Should we obey this law today or not? I haven't been given any biblical answer to say we shouldn't keep it.
If we do not make void the law by faith in Gods grace, and we establish the law that would include the Sabbath law wouldn't it.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Because you have been made free from sin (the transgression of the law), do you disobey the law and sin on purpose? God forbid.
I keep the Sabbath day holy because it is My loving Gods wish and i want to obey my Gods Command because i love Him.

1Jn 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
1Jn 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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Sure we have been freed from the penalty of the law, by the grace of Christ, through faith. Do i steal and kill, do i take the name of God in vain and have other god's before my creator God???
Do i make the Sabbath void ????
Do live in sin knowing that it cost the life of my Saviour Jesus to free me from every sin that i commit.


Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.