salvation

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jody50

Guest
#101
#101
I was taught that according to the Bible you Hear the word, believe it, repent of your sins and be baptized. Acts 2:38 says Repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins. I know we are saved by grace but in James 2;14 If someone says he has faith but does not have works can that faith save him? I think we have to do what God tells us to do in order to be saved through His grace.
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#102
#102
mark54 said:
I had been to trinitarian churches for over 25 years when I first ventured onto these kinds of websites. When I heard people talking of the ontological/economic trinity, I hadn't got a clue what they were on about. No minister of any church I went to ever preached on it. In fact no ministrer that I can recall preached on the subject of trinity at all, as it is discussed on here. We were taught the son of God died for your sin, if you repent of your sin and ask him into your life as Lord and Saviour you are saved, that's it.
The crazy demands you get on these websites are because some people have made a god out of 'doctrine' and studying. The ministers know what is most important(on the whole) and it isn't striving to have a perfect theological understanding of Father, Son and Holy Spirit,(Trinity) They seem more concerned as to their flock walking ever closer to ther teaching of Christ and the Apostles
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My only issue about the Trinity is it's never explicitly stated and there are verses it doesn't make any sense when you try to apply that thinking unless you ignore them and focus on other ones.

Mark 13:32

"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father."

Don't matter if you go to the Greek on that one or not...it reads exactly the same. I'm not of the opinion that anybody is going to hell just because they believe it or anything of that nature.....I do not think it wise to teach that believing the Trinity doctrine is necessary for Salvation though....because the bible doesn't list that as something you have to do to be saved.

I wasn't really referring to the Trinity by itself when I posted that though....there's plenty of other teachings added to what you have to do to be saved that aren't listed in the Bible in certain churches/denominations...etc.
 
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jody50

Guest
#103
#103
I know what you mean about it being so complicated. But if you take ALL the Bible says to do to be saved there's more to it than just believing. You have to hear the word, believe it, repent, confess Jesus, and be baptized. Acts 2:38 Says "Repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins." So it is simple if you just take all of the scriptures and not just the ones that say believe. Of course you have to believe but you can't leave out the other things that are taught in the Bible. What do you think?
 
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stek

Guest
#104
#104
justamazed said:
I'll try to explain as best I can to you. In the beginning it was only the Father.
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Nope not even close. My Bible and other version I have read use the same word "God" Genesis 1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. [SUP]2 [/SUP]Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. note not the Father. Second not alone [SUP]26 [/SUP]Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[SUP][a][/SUP] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
Nothing singular there that would imply he was alone.
 
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mark54

Banned
#105
Jan 11, 2013
2,256
17
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#105
Donkeyfish07 said:
My only issue about the Trinity is it's never explicitly stated and there are verses it doesn't make any sense when you try to apply that thinking unless you ignore them and focus on other ones.

I would agree that official trinitarian doctrine must contradict much plain scripture, but although I have always been to trinitarian churches, I grew up believing in an unequal Tribnity if you like, where the Father was supreme/the one true God, for what I continually hear emphasised on these websites I never once heard preached from the pulpit


Mark 13:32

"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father."

Don't matter if you go to the Greek on that one or not...it reads exactly the same. I'm not of the opinion that anybody is going to hell just because they believe it or anything of that nature.....I do not think it wise to teach that believing the Trinity doctrine is necessary for Salvation though....because the bible doesn't list that as something you have to do to be saved.

I completely agree witrh you, it is not wise insisting people believe in trinity as demanded on these websites, for that contradicts the requirement of belief unto salvation Christ himself laid down. Such belief as is demanded on websites like these is not demanded anywhere inj the bible, which maybe one reason hardly any trinitarian ministers will preach such demands from the pulpit. If a person believes in Father, Son and Holy Spirit, they believe in a trinity of sorts to me(but I do see things simply, when allowed to lol)

I wasn't really referring to the Trinity by itself when I posted that though....there's plenty of other teachings added to what you have to do to be saved that aren't listed in the Bible in certain churches/denominations...etc.
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I have found through 30 yerars of going to church, and now coming onto websites like these, there is a difference between what maybe offical denominational doctrine unto salvation, and how much of that doctrine is actually preached from the pulpit.

Actually, my main concern is not 'Trinity' as such but a yearning to see the Gosepl of Grace plainly and fully preached from all pulpits, as written by Paul. I would say if that were to happen far more churches would be packed, for that is the meat that matters, that is the meat that changes lives, not a 'perfect' understanding of the workling out of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, somethnig I believe is beyond the human mind to fathom, or fully iunderstand
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#106
#106
jody50 said:
I know what you mean about it being so complicated. But if you take ALL the Bible says to do to be saved there's more to it than just believing. You have to hear the word, believe it, repent, confess Jesus, and be baptized. Acts 2:38 Says "Repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins." So it is simple if you just take all of the scriptures and not just the ones that say believe. Of course you have to believe but you can't leave out the other things that are taught in the Bible. What do you think?
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I see what your saying but the simplicity remains. The verse I used earlier included confessing with your mouth. Acts 2:38 is another good verse and only helps highlight how simple it is. Anybody that believes is going to be doing repenting IMO, I don't see how you could possibly believe and NOT repent as a result.

Romans 10:13

"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."

So easy.
 
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jody50

Guest
#107
#107
Donkeyfish07 said:
I see what your saying but the simplicity remains. The verse I used earlier included confessing with your mouth. Acts 2:38 is another good verse and only helps highlight how simple it is. Anybody that believes is going to be doing repenting IMO, I don't see how you could possibly believe and NOT repent as a result.

Romans 10:13

"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."

So easy.
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Are you a member of any church?
 
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justamazed

Banned
#108
Jan 24, 2013
944
2
0
#108
stek said:
Nope not even close. My Bible and other version I have read use the same word "God" Genesis 1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. [SUP]2 [/SUP]Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. note not the Father. Second not alone [SUP]26 [/SUP]Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[SUP][a][/SUP] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
Nothing singular there that would imply he was alone.
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Genesis 1:27

27*So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Again in nature two males cannot make a child. If we have a Father then surely we have a mother.
 
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stek

Guest
#109
#109
justamazed said:
Genesis 1:27

27*So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Again in nature two males cannot make a child. If we have a Father then surely we have a mother.
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And how does that say God was alone??????????????
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#110
#110
jody50 said:
Are you a member of any church?
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I'm friends with a few really good pastors but I don't align myself with any denomination or have any membership anywhere.
 
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stek

Guest
#111
#111
you could say that God has a different image but do not see how God was alone
 
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stek

Guest
#112
#112
Donkeyfish07 said:
I'm friends with a few really good pastors but I don't align myself with any denomination or have any membership anywhere.
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Do you attend church regularly? If so which church?
 
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stek

Guest
#113
#113
I might add to Salvation this
Matthew 12[SUP]30 [/SUP]“Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. [SUP]31 [/SUP]And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. [SUP]32 [/SUP]Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.
 
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jody50

Guest
#114
#114
Donkeyfish07 said:
I'm friends with a few really good pastors but I don't align myself with any denomination or have any membership anywhere.
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Don't you believe we need to worship God the way He tells us to? He says we are supposed to take the Lord's Supper on the first day of the week, sing, pray and be taught His word. These are acts of worship He tells us to do. Just wonder what you think about this.
 
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justamazed

Banned
#115
Jan 24, 2013
944
2
0
#115
stek said:
And how does that say God was alone??????????????
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The "us" are your parents. Again if you have a Father you also have a mother. Her name is wisdom and she acts as a woman should.
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#116
#116
stek said:
Do you attend church regularly? If so which church?
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No, I rarely attend church at all. When I do it could be any denomination. Never set foot in a Catholic Church though.
 
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Donkeyfish07

Guest
#117
#117
jody50 said:
Don't you believe we need to worship God the way He tells us to? He says we are supposed to take the Lord's Supper on the first day of the week, sing, pray and be taught His word. These are acts of worship He tells us to do. Just wonder what you think about this.
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"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.". That's how I worship him personally. Every Church has their own opinion of what you have to/should do to worship.........That's why I don't attend often. I'm not interested in getting into the legalistic/political side of Christianity at all.
 
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stek

Guest
#118
#118
justamazed said:
Yes I do. Do you know what "alone" means? The Lord said He was alone, not with the "Word".

The "us" are your parents. Again if you have a Father you also have a mother. Her name is wisdom and she acts as a woman should.
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First He's alone nows then He has some mythilogical women who is the mother of man kind. Your a lost cause.
 
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jody50

Guest
#119
#119
Donkeyfish07 said:
"God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.". That's how I worship him personally. Every Church has their own opinion of what you have to/should do to worship.........That's why I don't attend often. I'm not interested in getting into the legalistic/political side of Christianity at all.
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I don't understand how you can believe part of what the Bible says and not all of it. How do you pick and choose what you want? God says "if you love me you will keep my commandments". When Christ died on the cross the church was established and we are told how to live a faithful life by worshipping Him. Acts 20:7 says the disciples came together to "break bread" (partake of the Lord's Supper) and preaching.

There is a pattern the church is to follow to worship God. We have to obey all of God's commands not just believe in Him. At least that's what I understand
 
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stek

Guest
#120
#120
Donkeyfish07 said:
No, I rarely attend church at all. When I do it could be any denomination. Never set foot in a Catholic Church though.
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Brother I encourage you go to church. Denomination wise, all truth is God's truth no matter where it is found, but need to attend a church,
 
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