So if you are not under the Law, does that mean you are in lawelessness?
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More ignorance on your part and again you deny the very words of John, Paul and others....and your statment about being sinless because past, present and future sins being forgiven is false....as a matter of fact the more time you spend with Jesus and in light of his righteousness the more vile and sinful you will see yourself.....you amaze me and your wilfull blindness and twist of the truth knows no bounds......Look...unless I specifically address you...dont even talk to me.....You claim to to be this big, mature sinless soldier for Christ and at the end of the day you do not follow the Jesus I know as your recent activity behind my back to the moderators proved....Your not that much of a Christian and you sin every day regardless of your supposed stance on this site......it is best you just ignore me and I you as you will remain in darkness until the day you pass on!
No, Daniel was not confessing sin he was currently commiting. That doesn't make any sense to confess sin you are currently committing. That would be like an axe murderer asking God for forgiveness as he chops off a person's head. Sorry. God is not going to forgive him because he was not really sorry for doing evil. That is what confess is all about. It is about having Godly sorrow. Confession of sin is not lip service. It is about being broken before God so as to lead to repentance unto salvation (See 2 Corinthians 7).
As for works: Well, a believer is not saved by works, but works will be evident in a believer's life if they have been saved. For a true faith will always prove itself to be true with fruitful works and holiness. For Jesus said you will know a tree by it's fruit. For a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit (and vise versa). A believer is not saved by works because Christ (God) does the work in the believer. Christ is the source of their salvation (See 1 John 5:12).
As for works: Well, a believer is not saved by works, but works will be evident in a believer's life if they have been saved. For a true faith will always prove itself to be true with fruitful works and holiness. For Jesus said you will know a tree by it's fruit. For a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit (and vise versa). A believer is not saved by works because Christ (God) does the work in the believer. Christ is the source of their salvation (See 1 John 5:12).
Well, I only contact the moderators on occasion when you are really out of line. Your recent incident with me was stepping over the line in not being respectful and it was wrong and I even told you I would contact them. But this thread is not about you and me. This thread is about whether or not a believer can make the claim that they are not under the law as being defined as one being lawless. I believe the OSAS proponent on some level is essentially saying that (Even though some here will not openly admit to that fact).
Also, the OSAS proponent's claim in saying they are sinless because past, present, and future sin is forgiven is true. Unless one believes they are not forgiven of past, present, and future sin.
Also, the OSAS proponent's claim in saying they are sinless because past, present, and future sin is forgiven is true. Unless one believes they are not forgiven of past, present, and future sin.
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Jesus said to forgive, forget and let love cover a multitude of sin...not go behind someones back and rat them out...a friend COVERS the matter...doesnt promote it...so if you are such a Christian who is sinless why is it that I just named 4 scriptural truths that you rejected to do what you did....?
The Scriptures say not to have fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness but rather, reprove them. I was reproving the wrong you did. In other words, it is not wrong to point out something bad you did towards me. Unless of course you do not see anything wrong in anything you did. But again, that is not what this thread is about. We are on the topic of answering the question of whether or not a believer can be lawless on some level because of their claim that they are not under the Law.
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You look at verbs instead of just thinking about it logically (according to God's goodness) and by looking at the context. Again, there is no Biblical example or real world example where someone confessing their sin is truly sorry if they are doing evil while confessing of it. What you propose doesn't make any sense.
God inspired every word, including the verbs and the verb tenses found within scripture....I suggest you start studying the Greek and Hebrew as faith comes by hearing and hearing by the INSPIRED WORD of GOD...not what makes sense and or your real world examples.....and i see by your response you still reject what I said about Daniel whaich was taken STRAIGHT from the BIBLE.....go argue your moot points with God....!
First of all you cannot use the word of God to argue against God and his word so you are twisting your usage of the word to fit what you think...go look up the unfruitful works of darkness which are listed in CONTEXT....second I never named you ONCE as ALL I did was ASK you a question.....so.....you went beyond scripture and sinned.....although you will never admit it or acknowledge it because you never sin!
Good reminder
Ephesians 5
Be Imitators of God
1Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children;2and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma.
3But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints;4and there must be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.5For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous man, who is an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.
6Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.7Therefore do not be partakers with them;8for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light9(for the fruit of the Light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth),10trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord.11Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them;12for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret.13But all things become visible when they are exposed by the light, for everything that becomes visible is light.
14For this reason it says,
“Awake, sleeper,
And arise from the dead,
And Christ will shine on you.”
15Therefore be careful how you walk, not as unwise men but as wise,16making the most of your time, because the days are evil.17So then do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is.18And do not get drunk with wine, for that is dissipation, but be filled with the Spirit,19speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody with your heart to the Lord;20always giving thanks for all things in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ to God, even the Father;21and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ
Shalom
Ephesians 5
Be Imitators of God
1Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children;2and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma.
3But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints;4and there must be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.5For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous man, who is an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.
6Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.7Therefore do not be partakers with them;8for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light9(for the fruit of the Light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth),10trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord.11Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them;12for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret.13But all things become visible when they are exposed by the light, for everything that becomes visible is light.
14For this reason it says,
“Awake, sleeper,
And arise from the dead,
And Christ will shine on you.”
15Therefore be careful how you walk, not as unwise men but as wise,16making the most of your time, because the days are evil.17So then do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is.18And do not get drunk with wine, for that is dissipation, but be filled with the Spirit,19speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody with your heart to the Lord;20always giving thanks for all things in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ to God, even the Father;21and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ
Shalom
Sure you do. You sin quite often. Every time you cut God's law to "I don't murder, therefore I'm not a sinner," you sin. Just because you don't yet see that, doesn't mean you don't sin as a way of life. This is about all you do, on here anyway.
Yes, and my brothers are never, ever fools in my mind.
Yes, and my brothers are never, ever fools in my mind.
How do you know the good guys from the bad guys when you turn on the news or watch a movie? Why do you think God will allow His people to be rewarded with the goodness of Heaven for evil and sin they have done here? How is that fair to the unbeleiver who sins and lives a good life? Did not Jesus have a problem with the Pharisees because they lived a hypocritical existence?
Christ does the good work in the believer after they are saved. It is the mark or testimony that they have been saved proving their salvation and faith is true. Jesus said cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness. The unprofitable servant is that believer who did not abide in Jesus Christ.
Well, God's elect do not abide in unrepentant sin. But there are those who profess that they know Him and yet they walk in darkness. 1 John 1:6 talks about this. As for the types of sin they do: Well, Paul warns the believer of various different types of sins that will not cause a person to inherit the Kingdom of God several times.
Well, God's elect do not abide in unrepentant sin. But there are those who profess that they know Him and yet they walk in darkness. 1 John 1:6 talks about this. As for the types of sin they do: Well, Paul warns the believer of various different types of sins that will not cause a person to inherit the Kingdom of God several times.
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Jason, if I break the law and become lawless or if I transgress the law and end up in sin, how does God look at me and what does he do to get me back in fellowship with him? In your understanding where does the chastening and scourging of the Lord figure in? Who are the ones he chastens and for what reason? We do have scripture on that and here is passage of it.
Heb 12:4-8
4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
I would say from this reference that being chastened of the Lord is a pretty good indication of sonship, that God loves us and has received us and that we are not bastards (illegitimate). The chastening is the result of striving against sin, both in being drawn away through persecution from the faith we have in Christ under the NT and in correcting those things in our life that would led us astray or keep us from the virtues we have in Christ as we grow in grace and knowledge of him. Either way their is an intense struggle that will go on against sin. At the first we may give place to sin and we are lovingly corrected and latter we may give place again and the chastening is grievous and their is a loss of joy.
11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
I presume that there will be those that are not immediately exercised thereby and suffer in the flesh because of it, but God will be faithful for he has called them, received them and made them to be sons.
Heb 12:4-8
4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
I would say from this reference that being chastened of the Lord is a pretty good indication of sonship, that God loves us and has received us and that we are not bastards (illegitimate). The chastening is the result of striving against sin, both in being drawn away through persecution from the faith we have in Christ under the NT and in correcting those things in our life that would led us astray or keep us from the virtues we have in Christ as we grow in grace and knowledge of him. Either way their is an intense struggle that will go on against sin. At the first we may give place to sin and we are lovingly corrected and latter we may give place again and the chastening is grievous and their is a loss of joy.
11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
I presume that there will be those that are not immediately exercised thereby and suffer in the flesh because of it, but God will be faithful for he has called them, received them and made them to be sons.
Genuine Chastisement, brings about the PEACEABLE FRUITS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS.. indeed, and what is that? the FOCUS back on the Cross and His Crucifixtion, Christ Crucified, Genuine Christians who are chastised, are chastised because they took their Focus off the One who Redeemed them, WHAT HE HAD DONE FOR THEM, they had turned God's miracle in their life to being all ABOUT THEM, and what great things they are doing and how fantastic they are doing, but Leaving God in the Dust, If your His, He will not tolerate that , but will chastise you and Bring you back to where you are standing at the Tree, Daily, Crucified with Him, with the focus on what God has DONE FOR YOU.. and not what you can for God, and this will show you in the Testimony He has given you, if the conversion was Genuine! satan who wants to play god, will whip up some kind of false chastisment, making it appear as though God is punishing you, but it will be in accordance with his man made theology and what he calls or says is your Identity in Christ. dealt with his false hand so many times, I know now he is left handed! lolz... incredible! God's Chastisement brings about the Peaceable fruit of Righteousness, God Righteousness is His Son, imputed, and this done thru Belief, not based on your puffed up works or spiritual pride... indeed! the Witness after Chastisement will FOCUS ON Christ Crucified as they are led to live in this world and witness and declare the Salvation He has granted them!