Speaking in Tongues: Its Origins [Ancient and Modern], Purpose, and Power

[Wansvic]

Who said mark 16 is Gods word. I have given you proofs as to why it is NOT gods word.

You saying it IS gods word just makes Gods word weak. Because God lied, and jesus himself said a non truth. As I have proven. (People HAVE died, and NOT all have those gifts)

And as I also showed. Baptism of the HS has NOTHING to do with tongues, nor is tongues the evidence it has happened. BECAUSE IT WAS NOT GIVEN TO ALL.

it can only be evidence if EVERYONE who has experienced this baptism SPEAKS in tongues, and as shown again, that is NOT the case, and never will be.

God is not a liar.

"ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." 2 Tim 3:16-4:4

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Just because some church goers are not operating in this way does not mean they should not be.
Mark 16:17-18
And these signs shall follow them that believe

Notice here

It does not say MAY follow
It does not say Will follow SOME
It does not say Some will do this, some will do that.

It is all inclusive, these signs WILL follow. Who? THOSE who believe (ALL)

What will these signs be that ALL who believe will have?

; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Do ALL cast out devils
Do ALL speak with new tonguesDo AlL take up serpants nd not be hurt?
Do ALL drink poison and not be hurt?
Do ALL Heal the sick so that they recover.

If so. Then this is scripture

If not. Either this is NOT scripture. Or Jesus lied.

I am reminded of the words of Jesus:
"And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith."

Thats great, but that is NOT what we are talking about. We are discussing if ALL PEOPLE who BELIEVE have ALL THE THINGS Jesus said in MARk 16 that ALL who believe WILL HAVE

If so. We can determin it is gods word

If not. We can determine it is not Gods word.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

God is not a liar.

"ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." 2 Tim 3:16-4:4

If he is not a liar

Then mark 16: 16 and after is NOT part of scripture, It is something that was added after the original text was completed.

Plain and simple.

 

[Wansvic]

Notice here

It does not say MAY follow
It does not say Will follow SOME
It does not say Some will do this, some will do that.

It is all inclusive, these signs WILL follow. Who? THOSE who believe (ALL)

What will these signs be that ALL who believe will have?


Do ALL cast out devils
Do ALL speak with new tonguesDo AlL take up serpants nd not be hurt?
Do ALL drink poison and not be hurt?
Do ALL Heal the sick so that they recover.

If so. Then this is scripture

If not. Either this is NOT scripture. Or Jesus lied.



Thats great, but that is NOT what we are talking about. We are discussing if ALL PEOPLE who BELIEVE have ALL THE THINGS Jesus said in MARk 16 that ALL who believe WILL HAVE

If so. We can determin it is gods word

If not. We can determine it is not Gods word.

Bottom line it is the inspired Word of God. He said believers will do the things He mentioned. You cannot white out verses that don't suit you or that you do not personally understand.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Bottom line it is the inspired Word of God. He said believers will do the things He mentioned. You cannot white out verses that don't suit you or that you do not personally understand.

Bottom line is

As I showed. Those things are not true

If they are not true, Then somethign is wrong

This is NOT the ony proof that this is not scripture by the way, Just one of a few proofs.

 

[obedienttogod]

Completely unrelated to the discussion. Replace "language" where you find the word "tongue(s)" and even by that one exercise you will see this doctrine fall apart.

Add God to what Paul is saying, and even a new believer will know He is not speaking about anything you continue to carry on about!!

 

[UnderGrace]

Add God to what Paul is saying, and even a new believer will know He is not speaking about anything you continue to carry on about!!

Well use the scripture then, I will be waiting.

 

[posthuman]

Bottom line it is the inspired Word of God. He said believers will do the things He mentioned. You cannot white out verses that don't suit you or that you do not personally understand.

i thought i understood that we have known for a thousand years Mark ends at ch. 16 v. 8 .. ?

or maybe there are actually no true believers anymore; haven't been for a thousand years: if all believers are snake-proof, poison-immune, miraculous-healing, new-language-speaking exorcists, then where are they? where have they been?

you can't white out all the other signs here and just pick tongue-speaking. EG has a point, and his point is by no means at all the only evidence that the long ending of Mark is a forged insertion.

 

[obedienttogod]

control

the devil's playground

What I find hilarious, everyone who is not Catholic on this site, has at one time or another slammed the RCC over understanding their role in distorting the True WORD of God. We clearly see it in the Didache when you compare it to the Apostles. And we see it in the Council who tossed valuable Books away choosing our current Canon.

What I don't get, unless they are just being bull-headed. But if the real Apostles did write the Didache, how is it they forgot what they wrote about in the New Testament? Paul and Peter were very keen in their preaching, teaching, following the exact plan of God, and definitely in their writings. So why would Peter and Paul completely say the opposite of what they wrote in the New Testament, later on in the Didache?

I believe if the Apostles actually wrote the Didache, it would be word for word as they wrote it in their own letters, we know as the New testament. This is why it is so obvious that the Apostles had nothing to do with the Didache. And since everything mentioned in the Didache is only found in one sect of belief, when you compare all Denominations. It's clear the Didache is a Catholic creation, and it matches their doctrine even today, 100%

So yes, the Catholics wanted power. Have had power for Centuries. And sadly, that doctrine is as close to Satanism as it can get, without being an actual satan Worshiper!!

 

[obedienttogod]

Well use the scripture then, I will be waiting.

hahahaha I did, and you did not like that either

 

[obedienttogod]

So you believe tut RCc

The RCC is an interesting work of man's inventions. I am not going to say, they knew that God would tarry this long before returning. Because no man knows that. But, a lot of their history reflects they were calculating and it's obvious they viewed the Christians as the enemy.

They wrote all of these materials that we now understand were complete LIES. They have skewed historical factual events for their own version. Their own Bible is nothing like ours, but they claim to be believers. The Didache matches their version of their Bible. They created this LIE that Peter was the first Pope, when we know it was them who killed Peter. What's ironic, they were the members of the Council who chose the 66 Books of the Canon, and yet, their own Bible is like reading about another Yeshua who worshiped His Mommy

But the thing that irks me most about the RCC, is since they did a lot of their damage within the first 2 Centuries, many churches today are following their lies. I only pray that God understands these people are being deceived and gives them a break!!

Just like Speaking in Tongues. They never liked it. So they LIED about it and today, good believers are still believing their LIES!!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

What I find hilarious, everyone who is not Catholic on this site, has at one time or another slammed the RCC over understanding their role in distorting the True WORD of God. We clearly see it in the Didache when you compare it to the Apostles. And we see it in the Council who tossed valuable Books away choosing our current Canon.

What I don't get, unless they are just being bull-headed. But if the real Apostles did write the Didache, how is it they forgot what they wrote about in the New Testament? Paul and Peter were very keen in their preaching, teaching, following the exact plan of God, and definitely in their writings. So why would Peter and Paul completely say the opposite of what they wrote in the New Testament, later on in the Didache?

I believe if the Apostles actually wrote the Didache, it would be word for word as they wrote it in their own letters, we know as the New testament. This is why it is so obvious that the Apostles had nothing to do with the Didache. And since everything mentioned in the Didache is only found in one sect of belief, when you compare all Denominations. It's clear the Didache is a Catholic creation, and it matches their doctrine even today, 100%

So yes, the Catholics wanted power. Have had power for Centuries. And sadly, that doctrine is as close to Satanism as it can get, without being an actual satan Worshiper!!

glorious how what was scorned has now become the pillar of truth here

you can't make this garbage up

 

[UnderGrace]

hahahaha I did, and you did not like that either

Well you could always try again.

 

[UnderGrace]

The RCC is an interesting work of man's inventions. I am not going to say, they knew that God would tarry this long before returning. Because no man knows that. But, a lot of their history reflects they were calculating and it's obvious they viewed the Christians as the enemy.

They wrote all of these materials that we now understand were complete LIES. They have skewed historical factual events for their own version. Their own Bible is nothing like ours, but they claim to be believers. The Didache matches their version of their Bible. They created this LIE that Peter was the first Pope, when we know it was them who killed Peter. What's ironic, they were the members of the Council who chose the 66 Books of the Canon, and yet, their own Bible is like reading about another Yeshua who worshiped His Mommy

But the thing that irks me most about the RCC, is since they did a lot of their damage within the first 2 Centuries, many churches today are following their lies. I only pray that God understands these people are being deceived and gives them a break!!

Just like Speaking in Tongues. They never liked it. So they LIED about it and today, good believers are still believing their LIES!!

What is this you speak of, "tongues" is it earthly or other worldly?

 

[fredoheaven]

“Barbarian” was a generic term (sort of as it is today) – it referred to someone who was neither Greek nor Latin speaking. Any group of people who were totally ignorant of Greek or Latin could (and likely, were) referred to as Barbarians.

The term itself is thought to be onomatopoeic in origin, coming from “ba(r)-ba(r)” – the sound of a sheep bleating. This was in reference to what the language of the “barbarians” sounded like to Greek ears – like the bleating of a sheep.

A Barbarian, since he didn’t know Greek or Latin was considered “uncivilized”. Any group of “uncivilized people could also be referred to as ‘barbarians”.

‘Scythian’ in this case, seems to have more the meaning of “savage” – a term also used for many Native American groups by the Europeans, i.e. Indian equated to “savage” – “savage” equated to Indian. Again, in this case, more of a generic term than referring to actual Scythians.

I would read that passage as “Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, uncivilized, savage, slave or free….”

Yes, the Goths were considered “barbarians” by many other European peoples – as mentioned, the word was also used to describe any seemingly “uncivilized people” regardless of where from.

Not sure I follow your last paragraph – ‘unknown’ was a latter addition, so the original was just “language”. If I’m understanding correctly….no, it would not refer to English (by way of barbarian referring to the Germanic Goths), as English (or actually Anglo-Saxon/Old English) did not come about until somewhere around the 400’s AD.

Thanks Kavik, however, the Bible described barbarians are as very kind, courteous and hospitable and are ready to help.

Acts 28:2 And the barbarous people shewed us no little kindness: for they kindled a fire, and received us every one, because of the present rain, and because of the cold.
Acts 28:3 And when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks, and laid them on the fire, there came a viper out of the heat, and fastened on his hand.
Acts 28:4 And when the barbarians saw the venomous beast hang on his hand, they said among themselves, No doubt this man is a murderer, whom, though he hath escaped the sea, yet vengeance suffereth not to live.
Acts 28:7 In the same quarters were possessions of the chief man of the island, whose name was Publius; who received us, and lodged us three days courteously

God bless

 

[fredoheaven]

You miss mark 16, 18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.
This all is fullfilled through the apostles.
If it is true for today, then why in the charismatic and pentcostal movements you still find sick people?
You cant take only a part of the scripture. Vers 18 belongs to vers 16 and 17.
And here you get another problem.
Because you say, all who do not speaking in tongues lack on believe.

Actually Mark 16 doesn't says it will continue to operate. This will be on its immediate cessation of sign gift once "All scripture" is completed.

 

[wolfwint]

People are still being healed in Jesus' name today. And still, as in the bible, there are those throughout the world that remain sick. (Matt 13:58)

A l

People are still being healed in Jesus' name today. And still, as in the bible, there are those throughout the world that remain sick. (Matt 13:58)

Is this not an very cheap answer? If you claimes through this verses that believer speakes in tongues?

 

[obedienttogod]

Well you could always try again.

I like how you don't give in. But if Paul had never made it clear he was basically under the influence of Yeshua 24/7/365, I would have no issue seeing your point of view as Gospel, concerning the Gift of Tongues. But everything I have ever studied about God, especially about Yeshua, let's me know there would be no joking around like you're indicating between Corinth and Paul. The fact Paul is correcting Corinth, makes it more conclusive that Yeshua does not play games when it comes to how we should do things in the church setting and as the Body of Christ. After all, Yeshua as I AM to Moses, was all business 100% of the time. And Yeshua in the Gospels as our Sacrificial Lamb, was all business 100% of the time. And since we know God does not change and is the same yesterday, today, and will be the same for every Tomorrow's. It's a safe bet that as He was guiding Paul with Corinth, He was also all business 100% of the time.

 

[oyster67]

Mark 16
16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Did I hear someone say that these verses don't belong in the Bible?

You say you don't see it today. You say you don't believe it. So you just snip it out?

We conform to the Bible. It doesn't work the other way around. We can like it, or we can lump it, but we may not snip it.

There are lots of things in the Bible that I do not yet understand, but I don't go off madly hacking it apart.

Once a man starts snipping, there is no end to it.

 

[obedienttogod]

What is this you speak of, "tongues" is it earthly or other worldly?

I am 50 years Old, and have only heard Spoken Tongues and Interpretation less than 10 times all total. At going to church 3 times per week for most of my life, less than 10 times is not very much on average. It took 20 years after I received the Holy Spirit, before I ever felt that Speaking in Tongues was proper and of God. During those 20 years, Speaking in Tongues sounded much like I would envision the Tower of Babel. Everywhere I listened, no one was uttering the same jargon and i had no idea what was being said. I was raised in it with my Grandfather and father being preachers and teachers. I just wanted to be absolutely positive and know that I knew that I knew without any doubts about Speaking in Tongues. Having a Grandfather like I was blessed to have, gave me access to a side by side view of the Apostles in action, from light of the New Covenant vs supposed other views of the Apostles like that of the Didache. I debunked everything I could. Finally, I asked God, if the Gift of Tongues is real like I see from many others, then Bless me with this Gift.

it finally happened. And I know it was not something I made up and created. I also learned that Speaking in Tongues can happen without you ever knowing that you have actually Spoken in Tongues. Just a beautiful moment between you worshiping and praising God. The first time I knew I was Speaking in Tongues, I immediately stopped myself by shutting my worship down. I was confused by wondering if you knew it was happening, does it mean, you are controlling it and not the Holy Spirit controlling it? Now I completely understand, that the Gift of Tongues is a vital spiritual warfare language. And I also understand, because the Holy Spirit lives within me, I have access to this Gift when I feel it's absolutely necessary to pray and when I am worshiping God even while alone. That is the beauty of the Holy Spirit living within me, it's Gifts are available to any true believer of Yahweh, 24/7/365!!

To be specific about your other question, I know I am not speaking in English (in the Gift of Tongues) when I feel the presence of God surrounding me. But to be able to actually specify between a language spoken by humans, or a language God only knows, i do not know. No one who has been near and heard me Speaking in Tongues, has ever said, wow, that was perfect Russian (< add any human language here) you were speaking there. Most just say, I could feel power and the anointing on you. This also helps me to know, that my patience and respect to understand the Gift of Tongues for 20 years, has resulted in a genuine and authentic example I am thankful for.