Speaking in tongues
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So, Paul was talking about a church made of grapes when he talked about edification of the church?!
Self edification is not of the Holy spirit, the manifestation of the gifts of the holy spirit are for the common good.
Prophesy is for the common good and so is evangelism/teaching/healing- non is for self edification. Never heard of a healer healing themselves.
Speaking in tongues is no different, but the modern phenomenon of speaking unknown words is very different, maybe there's self edification with the modern tongues but i highly doubt based on what you say.
Self edification is not of the Holy spirit, the manifestation of the gifts of the holy spirit are for the common good.
Prophesy is for the common good and so is evangelism/teaching/healing- non is for self edification. Never heard of a healer healing themselves.
Speaking in tongues is no different, but the modern phenomenon of speaking unknown words is very different, maybe there's self edification with the modern tongues but i highly doubt based on what you say.
Nope.
There's no such thing as longer ending and shorter ending of Mark. It is where believers were promised all those things which manifested in Acts, if it is fake, then Acts is also fake.
I don't disbelieve the modern tongues, they are fake. Any thing that is works of signs and wonders today are fake because i know who has authority over the nations today and i know how he works.
The group in Matt 7 are Christians that are duped by the antichrist.
There's no such thing as longer ending and shorter ending of Mark. It is where believers were promised all those things which manifested in Acts, if it is fake, then Acts is also fake.
I don't disbelieve the modern tongues, they are fake. Any thing that is works of signs and wonders today are fake because i know who has authority over the nations today and i know how he works.
The group in Matt 7 are Christians that are duped by the antichrist.
The measure by which you condemn others is the measure by which you shall be condemned.
1 Cor 14:5 Paul is writing that he would that all new believers spoke in tongues like those in the book of Acts. This would be evidence that they actually got saved. Paul is not supporting the modern contention that believers spoke in tongues on subsequent occasions. We do not have evidence that anyone ever spoke in tongues more than at the time they were saved or in the case in Acts when they initially were filled of the Holy Spirit to testify of Christ.
My tactic as you put it is to demonstrate from scripture that you have a completely faulty concept of tongues in the NT church especially post apostolic period.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
1 Cor 14:5 Paul is writing that he would that all new believers spoke in tongues like those in the book of Acts. This would be evidence that they actually got saved. Paul is not supporting the modern contention that believers spoke in tongues on subsequent occasions. We do not have evidence that anyone ever spoke in tongues more than at the time they were saved or in the case in Acts when they initially were filled of the Holy Spirit to testify of Christ.
My tactic as you put it is to demonstrate from scripture that you have a completely faulty concept of tongues in the NT church especially post apostolic period.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
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We all should heed those words, Roger...
The word "new" is not there. You added it.
It still is.
Of course he is.
1 Cor 14:
5) I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
Eph 6:
18) Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
Does Paul himself count?
1 Cor 14:
18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
Your tactic has failed because it's based on a faulty premise.
The word "new" is not there. You added it.
It still is.
Of course he is.
1 Cor 14:
5) I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
Eph 6:
18) Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
Does Paul himself count?
1 Cor 14:
18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
Your tactic has failed because it's based on a faulty premise.
Paul never states that he spoke in unknown tongues. Paul spoke in more than one known tongue. Paul was educated as a Pharisee not as a fisherman.
Confuse praying in the Holy Spirit as praaying in tongues. That is a misconception finding it's roots in new age mysticism not in Christ.
The word of God is the final arbitor in matters Spiritual.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Confuse praying in the Holy Spirit as praaying in tongues. That is a misconception finding it's roots in new age mysticism not in Christ.
The word of God is the final arbitor in matters Spiritual.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
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1
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1 Cor 14:
18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
Yes. He also spoke in tongues.
1 Cor 14:
14) For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.
15) What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.
16) Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?
Praying in the spirit IS speaking in tongues.
Agreed. You should pay attention to what it says.
18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
Yes. He also spoke in tongues.
1 Cor 14:
14) For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.
15) What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.
16) Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?
Praying in the spirit IS speaking in tongues.
Agreed. You should pay attention to what it says.
Shrume, my journey has been long with many 'one days' along it:
-I used to believe and even spoke in tongues; 'one day' came and i stopped
-I used to believe in future trib; one day came and i stopped because i now know better
-I used to believe all those positions there are about antichrist; one day came and i stopped because what i know now you can't even imagine
All i'm saying is that i have grown and i'm still growing never to look back. I'm hoping for more 'one days' but with regards to bigger things.
-I used to believe and even spoke in tongues; 'one day' came and i stopped
-I used to believe in future trib; one day came and i stopped because i now know better
-I used to believe all those positions there are about antichrist; one day came and i stopped because what i know now you can't even imagine
All i'm saying is that i have grown and i'm still growing never to look back. I'm hoping for more 'one days' but with regards to bigger things.
Offered without support. Paul does not say he spoke in unknown tongues. Tongues are languages and human languages in the context of human interactions.
You have the meaning of this passage completely confused. Praying in the Holy Spirit is not praying in tongues. Paul offers that praying in his spirit his human spirit with unknown tongues, a tongue he does not know is unfruitful.
Seriously? You change the definitions of words and you say pay attention? Try to find a passage that actually means what you want it to say.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
You have the meaning of this passage completely confused. Praying in the Holy Spirit is not praying in tongues. Paul offers that praying in his spirit his human spirit with unknown tongues, a tongue he does not know is unfruitful.
Seriously? You change the definitions of words and you say pay attention? Try to find a passage that actually means what you want it to say.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
The context of 1 Cor 14 is the manifestation of speaking in tongues, and speaking in tongues is speaking a language you do not know (1 Cor 14:2, 14). Therefore when Paul said he spoke in tongues more than the whole Corinthian church, he was talking about the manifestation of speaking in tongues, speaking a language he did not know.
When a person speaks in tongues, it can be either a language of men or angels (1 Cor 13:1).
Also, the primary use of speaking in tongues is not for "human interactions", it is speaking to God.
1 Cor 14:
2) For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
That is precisely what it is, Roger.
A person cannot pray in tongues with his "human spirit".
Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that? You should have been...
When a person speaks in tongues, it can be either a language of men or angels (1 Cor 13:1).
Also, the primary use of speaking in tongues is not for "human interactions", it is speaking to God.
1 Cor 14:
2) For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
That is precisely what it is, Roger.
A person cannot pray in tongues with his "human spirit".
Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that? You should have been...
There is nothing in the passage to support that conclusion. You are going way outside of any reasonable biblical exegesis. Paul never said he spoke in a language he did not understand. Paul did repeatedly say that speaking in a language you do not understand is unfruitful.
More speculative fantasy. There is nothing to support angel tongues. It is hyperbole or over exaggeration to make an illustration. Read the verse in context and forsake the pretext.
Context. Paul is not praising this supposed activity. Speaking without knowledge and understanding makes one appear well less than wise.
Pr 17:28 Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise: and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding.
Wow you are way out there in the woods.
Try looking into the mirror of the word of God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
More speculative fantasy. There is nothing to support angel tongues. It is hyperbole or over exaggeration to make an illustration. Read the verse in context and forsake the pretext.
Context. Paul is not praising this supposed activity. Speaking without knowledge and understanding makes one appear well less than wise.
Pr 17:28 Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise: and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding.
Wow you are way out there in the woods.
Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that? You should have been...
For the cause of Christ
Roger