Stoning vs Beheading

[Dan58]

I had an interesting conversation with a lady today in relation to Christianity's form of punishment from the OT (stoning) and Muslim's form of punishment (beheading).

She had no understanding of Christianity and how either one of these punishments were justified enough to put someone to death.
She then continued to explain how both religions were just as bad as the other if they both teach to murder.

As a Christian how would you explain to someone who is non religious, who does not understand the difference between the two punishments and how they compare?

Many laws in the Old testament and in the Koran did require the death penalty as a punishment. Both Islam and Judaism required the death penalty for murder, stoning for adultery, etc. So they did in fact share some of the same type of punishments for certain offenses. The lady makes a valid point.

I'd just point out to her that Christianity is not a theocracy, the New Testament requires Christians to subject themselves to the laws of the land; "Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities" (Romans 13:1). So unlike the ancient Hebrews and Muslims, Christianity is based in adoration and grace. The punishment (curse of the law) was endured by our Savior. That's the big difference, Muslims are bound by their laws and demand submission because they have no Savior, and there is no grace in Islam.

 

[VCO]

Many laws in the Old testament and in the Koran did require the death penalty as a punishment. Both Islam and Judaism required the death penalty for murder, stoning for adultery, etc. So they did in fact share some of the same type of punishments for certain offenses. The lady makes a valid point.

I'd just point out to her that Christianity is not a theocracy, the New Testament requires Christians to subject themselves to the laws of the land; "Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities" (Romans 13:1). So unlike the ancient Hebrews and Muslims, Christianity is based in adoration and grace. The punishment (curse of the law) was endured by our Savior. That's the big difference, Muslims are bound by their laws and demand submission because they have no Savior, and there is no grace in Islam.

And NOT ONLY the governing authorities:

1 Peter 2:13-16 (NKJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, whether to the king as supreme,
[SUP]14 [/SUP] or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men--
[SUP]16 [/SUP] as free, yet not using liberty as a cloak for vice, but as bondservants of God.



By the way "every ordinance of man certainly includes "posted speed limits", "STOP signs", "Keep your dogs on a leash", "Pick up after you pets in a Public Park", etc., etc.

 

[VCO]

Here is watered down what gives you the impression I water Gods word? You have gaul but no tact. You cant show me watered word from me but you have shown an inability to focus.Jesus was the perfect teacher I better stay with his methods yours lack control. Hows that for watered down?
pastac

I appeared to me that you were telling us to NOT tell unbelievers about the Wrath of GOD. If that is not what you meant, I apologize. I absolutely believe in telling unbelievers about BOTH the LOVE of GOD and the WRATH of GOD, but here is how it is to be DONE.

1 Peter 3:15-16 (ISV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Instead, exalt Christ as Lord in your hearts. Always be prepared to give a defense to everyone who asks you to explain the hope you have.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak evil of your good conduct in Christ will be ashamed of slandering you.

 

[dcontroversal]

They compare like this; they're both barbaric and unnecessary.

It is obvious that you reject the bible and misunderstand the difference between the bible and the Koran.......

 

[pastac]

I appeared to me that you were telling us to NOT tell unbelievers about the Wrath of GOD. If that is not what you meant, I apologize. I absolutely believe in telling unbelievers about BOTH the LOVE of GOD and the WRATH of GOD, but here is how it is to be DONE.

1 Peter 3:15-16 (ISV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Instead, exalt Christ as Lord in your hearts. Always be prepared to give a defense to everyone who asks you to explain the hope you have.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak evil of your good conduct in Christ will be ashamed of slandering you.

your own advice KISS
I never said that I FELT THAT WAY AND ALWAYS TEACH AND PREACH SOUND WHOLE BIBLICAL STANDARDS AND TRUTH always!!!!!you assumed. My position is biblical all the way yet wisdom is always at the forefront of my approach as LEAd BY THE HOLY sPIRIT. I JUST DONT ENGAGE WITHOUT CLEAR DIRECTION IT MAY BE A TRAP FROM THE ENEMY. I GET MARCHING ORDERS AND ALWAYS DEFER TO THE hOLY sPIRITS URGING! sorry computr froze uo

pastac

 

[Atwood]

nah.... not even close ! the modern use of terms like 'abuse' and arrogant and assault and so on are carnal.......

Most of the terms used in English are modern, as English is a modern language. Are you saying that abuse, arrogant, and assault are concepts absent from the Bible? Do you have proof for that one? For arrogance, see Dan 4. For assault, see the arrest of the Lord Jesus, for carnal see Greek NT sarkikos and sarkinos. Rom 7 "I am carnal, sold under sin." etc.

I went to you site on Jewish crucifixion (hanging on a tree while alive) apparently witnessed by DSS. Thanks for the link -- it was interesting. I am guessing that one links the Maccabeans with the Sadducees, Sadducee probably being derived from Zadok, the key ancestor required for high priest since the time of Solomon. Yet I recall hearing the claim that the Maccabeans were actually not descended from Zadok.

 

[Atwood]

but DO speak out loud against abortion - the murder of unborn life ..... which is more prevalent now than death by anything else..... and so the world is condemned, along with those who go along with it......

Jeff, IMHO it is not wise to use the term "abortion" much. Abortion covers the untimely removal of a baby from a womb, which is not necessarily a moral issue. Women have spontaneous abortions all the time, though they don't want them and nobody did anything to cause them (so far as they know).

The term to use is murder. The issue is murder, killing babies.

What is amazing to me is that it appears that Israel is part of the world wide baby-murder holocaust. You would think they would stand against it. The untold millions of baby's murdered since Rowe v Wade makes the Nazis look like pikers. History says that the Nazis killed 6 million Jews. It is understandable that some German somewhere was sometime mistreated by some Jewish person. It is understandable that people hate persons of distinct / conflicting cultures. Such things as occasional mistreatment of Germans and natural cultural prejudices do not excuse the murder of Jews in the Nazi holocaust. But they make it a bit understandable (not to dismiss the satanic element as well). But the baby in the womb hasn't done anything to anyone! There is the baby, happy in the mother's womb. Suddenly a monster takes a knife and cuts it up into pieces -- then down the garbage disposal.

Yet Israel allows baby-murder, so I understand. Has no one in Israel ever connected the Nazi holocaust and how the modern baby-murder holocaust so greatly exceeds what the Nazis did in vileness?

 

[VCO]

your own advice KISS
I never said that I FELT THAT WAY AND ALWAYS TEACH AND PREACH SOUND WHOLE BIBLICAL STANDARDS AND TRUTH always!!!!!you assumed. My position is biblical all the way yet wisdom is always at the forefront of my approach as LEAd BY THE HOLY sPIRIT. I JUST DONT ENGAGE WITHOUT CLEAR DIRECTION IT MAY BE A TRAP FROM THE ENEMY. I GET MARCHING ORDERS AND ALWAYS DEFER TO THE hOLY sPIRITS URGING! sorry computr froze uo

pastac

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Sorry again for my misunderstanding.

 

[GaryA]

The best thing for minimizing all kinds of computer problems is an Operating System called LINUX.

 

[Human]

It is obvious that you reject the bible and misunderstand the difference between the bible and the Koran.......

Yep, stone your enemies. That's what Jesus said, didn't he?

*sarcasm*

 

[Ella85]

Yep, stone your enemies. That's what Jesus said, didn't he?

*sarcasm*

What about the OT??

I think that is what he is referring to. God used the people to carry out His law so....that's what we are discussing here as it is written in the bible.

 

[dcontroversal]

Yep, stone your enemies. That's what Jesus said, didn't he?

*sarcasm*

DUDE, the comparison is between the O.T. laws that commanded to stone and the Koran which calls for the killing of infidels....

I suggest a cup of tea and a biscuit........and maybe a valium!

 

[dcontroversal]

What about the OT??

I think that is what he is referring to. God used the people to carry out His law so....that's what we are discussing here as it is written in the bible.

No doubt........and I agree Jo.......!

 

[VCO]

The best thing for minimizing all kinds of computer problems is an Operating System called LINUX.

EXCEPT, very little of the Software that I own will run on Linux.