SUBMISSION...earn it? force it? give it?

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E

ember

Guest
#1
#1
OK kiddies

let's be nice and opinions are great...scripture is better but both are acceptable

remember, your wife/husband might read this



one request...please...no one get on their hobby horse and try to tell people who do not agree with you that they do not know their Bible, (sometimes that is true) or they are stupid or vapid, or God will judge them

We will all be judged by our own words, so let us use the space between our ears to try and make some sense out of this always hotly debated subject

as comedian in chief, I reserve the right to inject humor when someone tries to plant their flag on someone's elses mountain

I'm serious though
 
Willie-T

Willie-T

Banned
#2
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
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#2
Accept it, and try to welcome it. (Admittedly, both can be difficult to do.)
 
E

ember

Guest
#3
#3
I should add this is about husbands and wives...but any examples for illustration is great too
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#4
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
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#4
True Submission is a voluntary act of love for each other. If it isn't freely given it's called servitude.
 
W

wwjd_kilden

Guest
#5
#5
from my view of those terms:
Submission is forced
Respect is earned
Love is given
 
ArtsieSteph

ArtsieSteph

Senior Member
#6
Apr 1, 2014
6,194
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Arizona
#6
I say people earn it when the other person sees their fruits. Or you know if they're over you as an elder, husband, ect. And accepting it is hard indeed
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#7
#7
Submission is putting aside the desire to have power or control over something or someone. Am I wrong?
 
E

ember

Guest
#8
#8
LOL!...there will be a test...multiple choice...I'll let you know then


back to being serious
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#9
#9
The opposite of submission would be to have a possessive attitude about things. It's mine and I want it now!
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#10
#10
Going along with the possesive attitude thing...this person thinks others opinions are worthless and they view people places things as theirs alone to possess.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#11
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
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#11
crossnote said:
True Submission is a voluntary act of love for each other. If it isn't freely given it's called servitude.
Click to expand...
Ephesians 5:21 (KJV) Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#12
#12
People who are not submitted also tend to have a superior self image and they focus only on personal good deeds, they refuse to acknowledge harm to others and they fail to see or admit their own destructive behaviors.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#13
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
113
#13
Standing at the other end of forced submission is a tyrant.
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#14
#14
Attributes of someone who is submitted are:

they demand and more of self than others and they acknowledge God as their authority..... they have a realistic view of self in relation to others. (They are no better and no worse)

i could give scripture for these but it's hard on my phone.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#15
Nov 24, 2012
30,712
3,651
113
#15
Without the attitude the act is meaningless...

Philippians 2:5-8 (KJV)
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
 
JFSurvivor

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
#16
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#16
ember said:
OK kiddies

let's be nice and opinions are great...scripture is better but both are acceptable

remember, your wife/husband might read this



one request...please...no one get on their hobby horse and try to tell people who do not agree with you that they do not know their Bible, (sometimes that is true) or they are stupid or vapid, or God will judge them

We will all be judged by our own words, so let us use the space between our ears to try and make some sense out of this always hotly debated subject

as comedian in chief, I reserve the right to inject humor when someone tries to plant their flag on someone's elses mountain

I'm serious though
Click to expand...
Submission should be earned. Forced submission is called abuse. Submission is not a bad thing when it is mutual and done out of love and respect. Submission to God is ALWAYS a good thing and it may not be easy but it's good. When we submit to God, it works to our benefit...it's not WHY we should submit it's just what happens when we do.

So those are my thoughts.
 
E

ember

Guest
#17
#17
Sirk said:
People who are not submitted also tend to have a superior self image and they focus only on personal good deeds, they refuse to acknowledge harm to others and they fail to see or admit their own destructive behaviors.
Click to expand...

ok...but now it seems you are going into the pathology of personalities that are outside the societal norm,

mind you I agree....and I guess we've all run across those types...they twist your words, insist they did not say something they actually say or put words in your mouth that you did not say, or feign ignorance of the whole thing with a 'what are you talking about' and when that does not work they turn into the avenging spirit of Ghenghis Khan
 
E

ember

Guest
#18
#18
tell you what (everybody)...my answer would be a hearty "They have to earn it and they can loose it too" but even though it is a legit answer from our perspective...especially if you have ever been abused (not referring to sexually here) by someone in authority, you are prob quick to say that

so then I am referencing personal experience, while admitting to following the teaching of the Bible, and which am I putting first? Or, do I see submission through the lens of my own morality and if so, how can that help someone who does not have my experience?

Thinking about all this, I start to ask questions...why would God ask this of women knowing how some men just love to lord it over anyone that is weaker or perceived as weaker?

Better yet, why would God create a woman with a good mind, the ability to make good decisions, and the ability to see the consequences down the road and place THAT woman under a dolt who is a control freak and excuses his sin with the Bible?

I guess we might also ask why would God tell a man to love his wife as Christ the loved church and then he marries a woman who is all about herself and undermines everything the man does while she professes Christianity and puts on a different face to the world?

There is big time resentment in either direction...so I begin to think there is a bigger consideration in all of this that would satisfy even the most jaded husband or wife
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#19
#19
ember said:
ok...but now it seems you are going into the pathology of personalities that are outside the societal norm,

mind you I agree....and I guess we've all run across those types...they twist your words, insist they did not say something they actually say or put words in your mouth that you did not say, or feign ignorance of the whole thing with a 'what are you talking about' and when that does not work they turn into the avenging spirit of Ghenghis Khan
Click to expand...
Ya I think there are extremes of it too. We all have a superior image of ourselves to one degree or another....and I think it takes to many shapes and forms to list.
 
E

ember

Guest
#20
#20
ok ...we have earn, force and give

I found a site this am, that I think really addresses the submission question

Following quote is from that site

Christian submission is defined by the relationship between God the Father and Son. It cannot be properly understood apart from that mooring. Hence, I believe it is unwise for us to uphold the instruction for wives to submit themselves to their husbands as an achievable standard for those outside the faith community. People without the indwelling power of the Holy Spirit have neither the discernment nor the power to live out submission and authority in a godly manner.

So if anyone is still responding here, what do you think of this? Especially the underlined part?

Is this an aspect that gets left out?

And this as well:

Men have a responsibility to submit too—it’s not just something that’s required of women. EVERY Christian, female or male, has the responsibility to submit to the Lord, and also to the authorities the Lord has placed in his or her life. What’s more, the biblical concepts of submission and authority cannot be disassociated. The two are indivisibly connected. A biblical definition of submission cannot be understood apart from a biblical definition of authority.

I'll post more for consideration depending on how this goes...cause I think it is giving me a different perspective
 
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