Summer is Nigh
- Thread starter KJV1611
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
YOUR premise is ridiculous.
The Son of Man Will Judge the Nations
31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’
37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of THESE MY BRETHREN, you did it to Me.’ (WHO IS JESUS POINTING TO?)
Jesus is again differentiating between the GENTILE nations and people THAT ARE HIS SHEEP, with His Brethren the Jews.
If you are in Christ YOU are a Jew. Jesus was, is, and will always be Jewish. WE are grafted into Him.
The Son of Man Will Judge the Nations
31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’
37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of THESE MY BRETHREN, you did it to Me.’ (WHO IS JESUS POINTING TO?)
Jesus is again differentiating between the GENTILE nations and people THAT ARE HIS SHEEP, with His Brethren the Jews.
If you are in Christ YOU are a Jew. Jesus was, is, and will always be Jewish. WE are grafted into Him.
-
1
- Show all
Okay, let's just backup a little here. The Abrahamic Covenant (Gen. 17) is two-fold with spiritual and physical promises. That is where the confusion sets in. When it is all over after Christ comes back the spiritual and physical will be merged to where they are both spiritual.
The physical promise included blessing Abraham with offspring so numerous as the sand on the seashore and the stars of heaven. Also in that promise is the occupation of the Promised Land. If we keep reading in Hosea, we see God is not completely done with physical Israel:
Hosea 14:4-9 "I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him. I will be as the dew unto Israel: he shall grow as the lily, and cast forth his roots as Lebanon. His branches shall spread, and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon. They that dwell under his shadow shall return; they shall revive as the corn, and grow as the vine: the scent thereof shall be as the wine of Lebanon. Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found. Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of the LORD are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall fall therein."
After all the chastisement, God will eventually restore Israel. Now let's address the people that started calling themselves Israel in 1948. That is not Israel. The name of Israel belonged to the sons of Joseph (Gen. 48:16). So Ephraim and Manasseh hold title to that name. They were part of the Northern 10 lost tribes. God knows where they are yet today even if they don't. The spiritual promise to Abraham was fulfilled in Christ. Those today starting the Southern Kingdom should call it Judah, even though I suspect there is little Jew blood among them.
The physical promise included blessing Abraham with offspring so numerous as the sand on the seashore and the stars of heaven. Also in that promise is the occupation of the Promised Land. If we keep reading in Hosea, we see God is not completely done with physical Israel:
Hosea 14:4-9 "I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him. I will be as the dew unto Israel: he shall grow as the lily, and cast forth his roots as Lebanon. His branches shall spread, and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon. They that dwell under his shadow shall return; they shall revive as the corn, and grow as the vine: the scent thereof shall be as the wine of Lebanon. Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found. Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of the LORD are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall fall therein."
After all the chastisement, God will eventually restore Israel. Now let's address the people that started calling themselves Israel in 1948. That is not Israel. The name of Israel belonged to the sons of Joseph (Gen. 48:16). So Ephraim and Manasseh hold title to that name. They were part of the Northern 10 lost tribes. God knows where they are yet today even if they don't. The spiritual promise to Abraham was fulfilled in Christ. Those today starting the Southern Kingdom should call it Judah, even though I suspect there is little Jew blood among them.
In your own post you are saying that there are two types of Jews, one is the spiritual Jew and the other is a natural Jew.
Now go through the Old Testament and apply what you've already stated to be true. Find all the places that Jews or children of Israel are mention and tag each of them - spiritual Jew and natural and then come back and answer this question:
Is God going to take the kingdom from the spiritual Jew and give it back to the God hating unrepentant natural Jew?
Now go through the Old Testament and apply what you've already stated to be true. Find all the places that Jews or children of Israel are mention and tag each of them - spiritual Jew and natural and then come back and answer this question:
Is God going to take the kingdom from the spiritual Jew and give it back to the God hating unrepentant natural Jew?
Your premise is wrong right from the start - the elect ARE NOT flesh descendants of Israel period. I don't know how to make that any clearer.
Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
NOPE! Didn't say that at all.
The "Nations" at the Sheep and goat judgement are Gentile. And they will be judged on how they treated the Jews who made it THROUGH the Great Tribulation, during which, they accepted their Messiah. Incidentally, it NEVER works out well for those Nations throughout history that God used to punish or sanctify the Jewish people.
I believe there is a special punishment for those that hate and abuse the Jews.
The "Nations" at the Sheep and goat judgement are Gentile. And they will be judged on how they treated the Jews who made it THROUGH the Great Tribulation, during which, they accepted their Messiah. Incidentally, it NEVER works out well for those Nations throughout history that God used to punish or sanctify the Jewish people.
I believe there is a special punishment for those that hate and abuse the Jews.
-
1
- Show all
Okay, let's just backup a little here. The Abrahamic Covenant (Gen. 17) is two-fold with spiritual and physical promises. That is where the confusion sets in. When it is all over after Christ comes back the spiritual and physical will be merged to where they are both spiritual.
The physical promise included blessing Abraham with offspring so numerous as the sand on the seashore and the stars of heaven. Also in that promise is the occupation of the Promised Land. If we keep reading in Hosea, we see God is not completely done with physical Israel:
Hosea 14:4-9 "I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him. I will be as the dew unto Israel: he shall grow as the lily, and cast forth his roots as Lebanon. His branches shall spread, and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon. They that dwell under his shadow shall return; they shall revive as the corn, and grow as the vine: the scent thereof shall be as the wine of Lebanon. Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found. Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of the LORD are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall fall therein."
After all the chastisement, God will eventually restore Israel. Now let's address the people that started calling themselves Israel in 1948. That is not Israel. The name of Israel belonged to the sons of Joseph (Gen. 48:16). So Ephraim and Manasseh hold title to that name. They were part of the Northern 10 lost tribes. God knows where they are yet today even if they don't. The spiritual promise to Abraham was fulfilled in Christ. Those today starting the Southern Kingdom should call it Judah, even though I suspect there is little Jew blood among them.
The physical promise included blessing Abraham with offspring so numerous as the sand on the seashore and the stars of heaven. Also in that promise is the occupation of the Promised Land. If we keep reading in Hosea, we see God is not completely done with physical Israel:
Hosea 14:4-9 "I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him. I will be as the dew unto Israel: he shall grow as the lily, and cast forth his roots as Lebanon. His branches shall spread, and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon. They that dwell under his shadow shall return; they shall revive as the corn, and grow as the vine: the scent thereof shall be as the wine of Lebanon. Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found. Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of the LORD are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall fall therein."
After all the chastisement, God will eventually restore Israel. Now let's address the people that started calling themselves Israel in 1948. That is not Israel. The name of Israel belonged to the sons of Joseph (Gen. 48:16). So Ephraim and Manasseh hold title to that name. They were part of the Northern 10 lost tribes. God knows where they are yet today even if they don't. The spiritual promise to Abraham was fulfilled in Christ. Those today starting the Southern Kingdom should call it Judah, even though I suspect there is little Jew blood among them.
Rom 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
When God was done with the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, he completely destroyed those cities. Israel as a nation is still here and will continue to exist. What do you mean when you say God is done with Israel? If God is still saving Jewish people, he is not done with them because he is still working in their hearts to bring them to Christ. Do you mean that you believe prophesy about Israel is already fulfilled or completed? I don't believe that the kingdom of God ever belonged to those who were wicked and refused to turn back to God. In the Old Testament as well if the wicked would not turn away from their evil and back to God then eventually, they would perish even though God would rather have them turn and live because he does not delight in the death of the wicked.
That does not nullify the physical promise to Abraham. Do you not think God is not dealing with all mankind when He comes back to earth?
Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
-
1
- Show all
Believe what you will - special punishment - you need to quit making stuff up. There is nothing to tie the "treatment" of Jews to the "sheep and goats" Judgement.
What he did say is the "least of these my brethren" which were his believing followers not some unbelieving Jew.
Yer theology is a mess man.
-
1
- Show all
Real quickly then I have to go get ready for football banquet.
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
^ Spiritual Jews.
Rom 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Rom 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
^ Is this a spiritual Jew or a natural Jew? Natural Jew.
Who were the oracles of God committed to spiritual Jew of natural Jew?
This is what I mean by God is done with Israel, God does not work through Israel any more. The kingdom was taken from them and given to the elect which is spiritual Israel.
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
^ Spiritual Jews.
Rom 3:1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Rom 3:2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
^ Is this a spiritual Jew or a natural Jew? Natural Jew.
Who were the oracles of God committed to spiritual Jew of natural Jew?
This is what I mean by God is done with Israel, God does not work through Israel any more. The kingdom was taken from them and given to the elect which is spiritual Israel.