The Church in Acts did not meet on the first day of the week...
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T
If you are another one who believes that in order to be a Christian one must become a Jew, all power to you.
That is NOT the thrust of Acts, or Romans, or Galatians, or Hebrews.
I bet you must have all the pages of Hebrews glued together!
All the issues of how to deal with Gentile believers were hammered out 2000 years ago.
The Judaizers were put in their place.
The Council of Jerusalem emphatically affirmed that Gentile believers were not bound to the dictates of Levitical law.
The book of Hebrews is an amazing treatise that deals with Jewish believers who were under pressure to abandon the New covenant and return to the Law.
The writer of Hebrews brilliantly outlines how the New Covenant is better in every way compared where they had come from.
I will only say this: if you place yourself under the Law you are bound on EVERY point of it. Fall on one point and you fail on every point. Be sure of this - the Law has not passed away. Every jot and tittle of it as laid out in the Mosaic books has to be obeyed if you are under the Law. There is no abbreviated version of it in operation now if you are under the Law. Remember - every jot and tittle!
The Law cannot save.
One can only be saved by grace through faith in the sacrifice of Christ Jesus on the cross. There is no other combination or permutation by which man can be saved.
The blood sacrifice of Christ Jesus on the cross fulfilled every righteous requirement that the Law makes on us.
If we accept this sacrifice by grace through faith, then, as believers, we are not subject to the demands of the Law.
There are no longer dietary restrictions, days and feasts, blood sacrifices to be made. These are done away with.
In its place is a higher calling based on the love we have for Christ Jesus.
The genesis of that love is very simple.
We love Him because He first loved us.
That higher calling cannot be subject to the Law because the Law is all about minimum requirements and penalties for transgression.
What we are called to as children of God cannot be legislated; instead it can only unfold as a consequence of us loving and following God.
To the casual onlooker we would appear to be 'law-abiding' citizens, but, in fact, we are not doing the minimum required to 'stay out of trouble', but rather the maximum of what God has called us to at that time.
So often, the response to this is some kind of accusation that we can then do exactly as we please without check or bound. However, Christians are not lawless reprobates. We wish to please God instead. The law can be summed up as two important principles: Love the Lord your God, and, love your neighbour as yourself. In this sense the Holy Spirit will guide us.
Furthermore, if we do sin, our salvation is not compromised. Our position as children of God is secure. The sin does however impede our love relationship with God. In such situations the approach is to confess our sin before God, repent, and move on, back to what God has called us to.
That is NOT the thrust of Acts, or Romans, or Galatians, or Hebrews.
I bet you must have all the pages of Hebrews glued together!
All the issues of how to deal with Gentile believers were hammered out 2000 years ago.
The Judaizers were put in their place.
The Council of Jerusalem emphatically affirmed that Gentile believers were not bound to the dictates of Levitical law.
The book of Hebrews is an amazing treatise that deals with Jewish believers who were under pressure to abandon the New covenant and return to the Law.
The writer of Hebrews brilliantly outlines how the New Covenant is better in every way compared where they had come from.
I will only say this: if you place yourself under the Law you are bound on EVERY point of it. Fall on one point and you fail on every point. Be sure of this - the Law has not passed away. Every jot and tittle of it as laid out in the Mosaic books has to be obeyed if you are under the Law. There is no abbreviated version of it in operation now if you are under the Law. Remember - every jot and tittle!
The Law cannot save.
One can only be saved by grace through faith in the sacrifice of Christ Jesus on the cross. There is no other combination or permutation by which man can be saved.
The blood sacrifice of Christ Jesus on the cross fulfilled every righteous requirement that the Law makes on us.
If we accept this sacrifice by grace through faith, then, as believers, we are not subject to the demands of the Law.
There are no longer dietary restrictions, days and feasts, blood sacrifices to be made. These are done away with.
In its place is a higher calling based on the love we have for Christ Jesus.
The genesis of that love is very simple.
We love Him because He first loved us.
That higher calling cannot be subject to the Law because the Law is all about minimum requirements and penalties for transgression.
What we are called to as children of God cannot be legislated; instead it can only unfold as a consequence of us loving and following God.
To the casual onlooker we would appear to be 'law-abiding' citizens, but, in fact, we are not doing the minimum required to 'stay out of trouble', but rather the maximum of what God has called us to at that time.
So often, the response to this is some kind of accusation that we can then do exactly as we please without check or bound. However, Christians are not lawless reprobates. We wish to please God instead. The law can be summed up as two important principles: Love the Lord your God, and, love your neighbour as yourself. In this sense the Holy Spirit will guide us.
Furthermore, if we do sin, our salvation is not compromised. Our position as children of God is secure. The sin does however impede our love relationship with God. In such situations the approach is to confess our sin before God, repent, and move on, back to what God has called us to.
I quoted what I needed to quote. If you want to talk about "blood sacrifices", we can do that. The Messiah was the final sacrifice for sin, we know this. However, there are other sacrifices that were not for sin. If you read Issaiah, there will be more sacrifices yet to come, or at least that is what the text says. Either way, this is a side-step. Do you think I like opposing a dozen people who are believers? I would not be doing this, If I did not believe what I am saying is the truth.
was Jesus raised a new man?
no.
Jesus is the same, yesterday, today, and forever. He was raised by the power of an indestructible life.
therefore, you make Him an adulterer.
unless Israel dies.
but i - i have died, and i have been raised a new creation. able to be presented to Him a pure and spotless virgin; His bride.
if the natural branch would be grafted back in, it too must die in the same way.
you, exactly like mike, have this upside down.
so i would like to know -- is it you who teaches him? or he who teaches you? did he call you to help? or did you come to defend him?
or is there a third?
please send us your rabbi, if it is not you. enough run-around and diversion.
mike refuses to answer plain questions -- either because he is ignorant, or because the questions ((and their answers)) are dangerous to your dogma. will you?
J
Absolutely no, I am not a Christian that believes I must become a Jew! I am a Christian who has been grafted in to Israel.
In the beginning was the Word (NOT PAUL), and the Word (NOT PAUL) was with God, and the Word was God (NOT PAUL).
The same (NOT PAUL) was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him (NOT PAUL); and without him (NOT PAUL)was not any thing made that was made.
In him (NOT PAUL) was life; and the life (NOT PAUL) was the light of men.
And the light (NOT PAUL) shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
That is not what the scriptures say. They were emphatic that they would learn the Levitical law (to use your term) every Sabbath in the synagogues because Torah is read from Moses' seat every Sabbath in the synagogues. (By the way, synagogues were not for Jews only, as they are only a part of Israel.)
The New Covenant is only for Israelites. The House of Judah and the House of Israel and anyone who wants to join up with the House of Judah or the House of Israel and be grafted in or adopted into the commonweatlh of Israel. Remember, in Revelations there are only 12 gates to enter the Kingdom, each gate has the name of the Israelite tribes (sons of Jacob). Rev_21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
No disagreement there. The law cannot save, neither can the laws save, neither can the commandments save, neither can the statues, or anything other than the perfect sin sacrifice of God's only son, Jesus Christ. Only through belief in Jesus can anyone come into the commonwealth of Israel. Remember Jesus said, "I have only come to save the lost sheep of the House of Israel." I don't know what my bloodline is, and I really don't care. All are invited, yes, the whole world is invited to believe on Jesus Christ and His redemptive work. When the New Jerusalem is here, Jesus will direct us which tribe gate we are to come through. Amen?
Correct. We are not subject to the demands of the Law for salvation or justification. However, once you realize why Jesus had to die for you, it should have the effect of wanting to show love back to God for His awesome GRACE He has given us. Do we continue as the House of Israel did, committing adultery by not obeying the commandments? No, we uphold the law, and we know God is an awesome God who would not put on His people of old or on His people today something that is too hard or burdensome. No, the law is light when your heart's desire is to keep what you are able to. I stick with the "FOREVER" commands. Sabbath rest, no normal work or buying or selling, Holy Feast Days, eating only what God calls food in the OT, attending fellowship with other believers every Sabbath and reading His Word together. I've been crossed over to this lifestyle for over 4 years. The scriptures say that by His stripes we are healed. I have not had one single episode of mental deterioration in the past 4 years. This is a gift from God.
IMO, I believe that our differences is from where we view our position. I am an Israelite, only by the saving grace and redemptive work of Jesus Christ and when I read the scriptures, it is talking about everything that relates to us Israelites and non-Israelites. There are only these two types in the Word.
I believe I am pretty much in agreement with you here.
In the beginning was the Word (NOT PAUL), and the Word (NOT PAUL) was with God, and the Word was God (NOT PAUL).
The same (NOT PAUL) was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him (NOT PAUL); and without him (NOT PAUL)was not any thing made that was made.
In him (NOT PAUL) was life; and the life (NOT PAUL) was the light of men.
And the light (NOT PAUL) shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
That is not what the scriptures say. They were emphatic that they would learn the Levitical law (to use your term) every Sabbath in the synagogues because Torah is read from Moses' seat every Sabbath in the synagogues. (By the way, synagogues were not for Jews only, as they are only a part of Israel.)
The New Covenant is only for Israelites. The House of Judah and the House of Israel and anyone who wants to join up with the House of Judah or the House of Israel and be grafted in or adopted into the commonweatlh of Israel. Remember, in Revelations there are only 12 gates to enter the Kingdom, each gate has the name of the Israelite tribes (sons of Jacob). Rev_21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
No disagreement there. The law cannot save, neither can the laws save, neither can the commandments save, neither can the statues, or anything other than the perfect sin sacrifice of God's only son, Jesus Christ. Only through belief in Jesus can anyone come into the commonwealth of Israel. Remember Jesus said, "I have only come to save the lost sheep of the House of Israel." I don't know what my bloodline is, and I really don't care. All are invited, yes, the whole world is invited to believe on Jesus Christ and His redemptive work. When the New Jerusalem is here, Jesus will direct us which tribe gate we are to come through. Amen?
Correct. We are not subject to the demands of the Law for salvation or justification. However, once you realize why Jesus had to die for you, it should have the effect of wanting to show love back to God for His awesome GRACE He has given us. Do we continue as the House of Israel did, committing adultery by not obeying the commandments? No, we uphold the law, and we know God is an awesome God who would not put on His people of old or on His people today something that is too hard or burdensome. No, the law is light when your heart's desire is to keep what you are able to. I stick with the "FOREVER" commands. Sabbath rest, no normal work or buying or selling, Holy Feast Days, eating only what God calls food in the OT, attending fellowship with other believers every Sabbath and reading His Word together. I've been crossed over to this lifestyle for over 4 years. The scriptures say that by His stripes we are healed. I have not had one single episode of mental deterioration in the past 4 years. This is a gift from God.
IMO, I believe that our differences is from where we view our position. I am an Israelite, only by the saving grace and redemptive work of Jesus Christ and when I read the scriptures, it is talking about everything that relates to us Israelites and non-Israelites. There are only these two types in the Word.
I believe I am pretty much in agreement with you here.
T
The law emphasizes the futility of trying to live under the law - yes, absolutely.
In this sense the law and grace are not in opposition.
However, you are claiming the blood of Jesus on one hand who completely and utterly fulfilled the righteous demands of the law while proclaiming the necessity of living under the law on the other.
I say again: you cannot live under the law and under grace at the same time.
Choose!
In this sense the law and grace are not in opposition.
However, you are claiming the blood of Jesus on one hand who completely and utterly fulfilled the righteous demands of the law while proclaiming the necessity of living under the law on the other.
I say again: you cannot live under the law and under grace at the same time.
Choose!