The Drinking of Blood

[7seven7]

2 Tim 3:14-17: "But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them, and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work"

I asked if there was a verse anywhere in the Bible that says that the Bible is the SOLE RULE of faith. clearly this DOES NOT state that. There are no words like "alone" or "only" used with respect to scripture. No one who claims to be Christian, least of all the Catholic Church, denies that Scripture is "inspired" and "profitable" to perfect a "man of God". But it is certainly different to assert that scripture is "sufficient." However, "sufficient" is not the word used by St. Paul in the verse you quoted , Mark. He uses the greek word ophelimos, which translates to "useful" or "profitable".

 

[7seven7]

SORRY MARK! THAT WAS MEANT FOR KATY! lol oops. I thought it was still just me and Mark. Hi again Katy!

 

[mark54]

The bible does warn us about some though:

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]20[/SUP]Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? [SUP]21 [/SUP]For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, [SUP]23 [/SUP]but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, [SUP]24 [/SUP]but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. [SUP]25 [/SUP]For the foolishness of God is wiser than man’s wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man’s strength.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. [SUP]27 [/SUP]But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. [SUP]28 [/SUP]He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, [SUP]29 [/SUP]so that no one may boast before him. [SUP]30 [/SUP]It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. [SUP]31 [/SUP]Therefore, as it is written: “Let him who boasts boast in the Lord.”[SUP][

Just a general point[/SUP]

 

[7seven7]

The bible does warn us about some though:

I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[SUP][c][/SUP] [SUP]20[/SUP]Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? [SUP]21 [/SUP]For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, [SUP]23 [/SUP]but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, [SUP]24 [/SUP]but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. [SUP]25 [/SUP]For the foolishness of God is wiser than man’s wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man’s strength.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. [SUP]27 [/SUP]But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. [SUP]28 [/SUP]He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, [SUP]29 [/SUP]so that no one may boast before him. [SUP]30 [/SUP]It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. [SUP]31 [/SUP]Therefore, as it is written: “Let him who boasts boast in the Lord.”[SUP][

Just a general point[/SUP]

Amen. And to think that prior to a year ago, i had never read a book in my life, was full of drugs and alcohol and sleeping around like a rabbit. And in the space of 11 months, i have read the Holy Bible cover to cover twice, and going through it again for study purposes, and read other books that I think the Holy Spirit has guided me to. I thought i was a useless human until the Lord showed me , that whats impossible for man is possible with Him!!! I asked Him for understanding, and i have never understood life so much in my entire existance. God bless you, Mark! I love you brother!!

 

[mark54]

Amen. And to think that prior to a year ago, i had never read a book in my life, was full of drugs and alcohol and sleeping around like a rabbit. And in the space of 11 months, i have read the Holy Bible cover to cover twice, and going through it again for study purposes, and read other books that I think the Holy Spirit has guided me to. I thought i was a useless human until the Lord showed me , that whats impossible for man is possible with Him!!! I asked Him for understanding, and i have never understood life so much in my entire existance. God bless you, Mark! I love you brother!!

You maybe surprised at how much your life mirrors my own of many years ago
Only differnce is, I simply read the bible and a couple of books that were recommended to me

 

[Katy-follower]

I asked if there was a verse anywhere in the Bible that says that the Bible is the SOLE RULE of faith. clearly this DOES NOT state that. There are no words like "alone" or "only" used with respect to scripture

Reread the scripture I posted. How can one argue with the word of God? Especially when it says that the scriptures are able to make you wise for salvation through faith, which is in Christ Jesus.

Without scripture man would be (and is) deceived by the ways of the world, and would believe everything they hear from others. Everything must be tested against scripture, and if it does not match up with God's word it must be rejected. Paul said not to go by appearances because many deceivers will have the appearance of Godly men... it's not WHO is teaching, but WHAT is being taught.


1 John 4:1: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world"

1 Thess 5:21: "Test all things; hold fast what is good"


The Bereans.....

Acts 17:10-11: "Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so" (they checked everything with the word of God)



Ephesians 2:8-10: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (we are saved by grace through faith, nothing else... grace through faith... otherwise man would be able to boast about his achievements. It is a gift from God, not earnt, not achieved in any way)

 

[mark54]

Amen. And to think that prior to a year ago, i had never read a book in my life, was full of drugs and alcohol and sleeping around like a rabbit. And in the space of 11 months, i have read the Holy Bible cover to cover twice, and going through it again for study purposes, and read other books that I think the Holy Spirit has guided me to. I thought i was a useless human until the Lord showed me , that whats impossible for man is possible with Him!!! I asked Him for understanding, and i have never understood life so much in my entire existance. God bless you, Mark! I love you brother!!

One more thing, and it is meant in kindness for you. Never feel you are so secure you could not falter and fall back. Sometimes when we have been delivered of much and come through much we can have almost a complacency, we have made it. But satan is subtle, and he will hit you where you are most vulnerable, and we all have certain thinfgs that afflict us more than others
Every day ask God to keep you safe through His son, from returning to your previous life

He will keep you, but never be over confident in yourself and where you are at
God Bless

 

[7seven7]

You maybe surprised at how much your life mirrors my own of many years ago
Only differnce is, I simply read the bible and a couple of books that were recommended to me

Yeh, Mark, I love it. I love Him, I love what He showed me, I love doing the His will every day and living EVERY MINUTE of my life for Him. When i found out that He was real and true, the hunger to REALLY KNOW HIM just took over me body, mind, and soul. I had, and have, this hunger to learn about Him fully!!! To get to know Him as well as I can (which will take an eternity), which leads me to just read and read and read and listen. Not only to Catholics, but to all Christians. Like i said earlier, I go to praise God in any Christian Church I am invited to, because there is a beauty in EVERY CHRISTIAN CHURCH!! I celebrate Mass at my Parish every Sunday too. I just can't get enough of it. And I have been born again! I was dead, now I'm alive.

 

[mark54]

Yeh, Mark, I love it. I love Him, I love what He showed me, I love doing the His will every day and living EVERY MINUTE of my life for Him. When i found out that He was real and true, the hunger to REALLY KNOW HIM just took over me body, mind, and soul. I had, and have, this hunger to learn about Him fully!!! To get to know Him as well as I can (which will take an eternity), which leads me to just read and read and read and listen. Not only to Catholics, but to all Christians. Like i said earlier, I go to praise God in any Christian Church I am invited to, because there is a beauty in EVERY CHRISTIAN CHURCH!! I celebrate Mass at my Parish every Sunday too. I just can't get enough of it. And I have been born again! I was dead, now I'm alive.

It is great to read the above
God Bless

 

[7seven7]

One more thing, and it is meant in kindness for you. Never feel you are so secure you could not falter and fall back. Sometimes when we have been delivered of much and come through much we can have almost a complacency, we have made it. But satan is subtle, and he will hit you where you are most vulnerable, and we all have certain thinfgs that afflict us more than others
Every day ask God to keep you safe through His son, from returning to your previous life

He will keep you, but never be over confident in yourself and where you are at
God Bless

Oh you got that right my brother. Thankyou! The evil one tries to pull me away from our Lord every day of my life, ESPECIALLY NOW!!! Using my temper, or my past (past friends and aquaintances), or other weaknesses i had without God. So i know I need to tread very carefully, which is why i surround myself with rightousness in everything; music, friends, I dont watch TV (lol i know), but it's ok, cz its all for the GLORY OF GOD!!

 

[7seven7]

Reread the scripture I posted. How can one argue with the word of God? Especially when it says that the scriptures are able to make you wise for salvation through faith, which is in Christ Jesus.

Without scripture man would be (and is) deceived by the ways of the world, and would believe everything they hear from others. Everything must be tested against scripture, and if it does not match up with God's word it must be rejected. Paul said not to go by appearances because many deceivers will have the appearance of Godly men... it's not WHO is teaching, but WHAT is being taught.


1 John 4:1: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world"

1 Thess 5:21: "Test all things; hold fast what is good"


The Bereans.....

Acts 17:10-11: "Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so" (they checked everything with the word of God)



Ephesians 2:8-10: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (we are saved by grace through faith, nothing else... grace through faith... otherwise man would be able to boast about his achievements. It is a gift from God, not earnt, not achieved in any way)

Katy, are you trying to say that this is proving that the Bible states, that the Bible is the sole rule of faith? I think you might have gone a little off topic.

 

[7seven7]

It is great to read the above
God Bless

Thankyou brother! God bless you too.

 

[mark54]

Oh you got that right my brother. Thankyou! The evil one tries to pull me away from our Lord every day of my life, ESPECIALLY NOW!!! Using my temper, or my past (past friends and aquaintances), or other weaknesses i had without God. So i know I need to tread very carefully, which is why i surround myself with rightousness in everything; music, friends, I dont watch TV (lol i know), but it's ok, cz its all for the GLORY OF GOD!!

You know you have a testimony that people need to hear. Sadly, in most churches I have been to, few people have lived the life you have. And many who have lived your life, feel they would be out of place in most churches because they would not have anyone to relate to therW
We can give the pat answer and say
'We go to church to worship God and put him first'
But in practical reality we all need people we can relate to, have as friends who can understand us and where we are at
The churches neeed people like you in them
Satan will therefore give you a vey hard time, persevere, sadly, from the churches I have been to you are the exceptiion, rather than the rule

For I can asure you, if you did go back to your old life, it would be far worse fo you than when you previously partook of that life. I hope you blieve that, it is the truth
I will pray for you brother
God Bless
BTW

No one needs perfect theology to be a Christian, as I am sure you know

Just that Jesus died for us undeserving sinners at Calvary, and if we repent of our sin and ask him into our lives as LORD and Saviour that is enough for God to welcome us as his children

 

[7seven7]

You know you have a testimony that people need to hear. Sadly, in most cfhurches I have been to, few people have lived the life you have. And many who have lived your life, fell they wopuld be out of plasce in most churches vbecause they would not anyonev to relate to there
we can give the pat answer and say
'We gop to church to worship God and put him forst'
But in practical reality we all need people we can relate to, have as friends who can understand us and where we are
The churches neeed people like you in them
Satan will therefore give you a vey hard time, persevere, sadly, from the churches I have been to you are the4 exceptiion, rather than the rule
For I can asure you, if you did go back to your old life, it would be far worse fo you than when you previously partook of that life. I hope you blieve that, it is the truth
I will pray for you brother
God Bless
BTW

No one needs perfect theology to be a Christian, as I am sure you know

Amen, Brother! There's a difference between sinning ignorantly, and sinning with the knowledge of truth. We get judged much harder when we know the Truth, don't we? But I think more about the Glory in the end, then the rubbish in the past, Mark. And I can honestly say that i feel blessed to have the opportunity to encounter brothers like yourself in my life. Even if our friendship ended with this discussion, Mark, it would've been a more important friendship to me than most I've had in my life. And I thank Christ for guiding to this path and leading me to make friends like yourself, who REALLY CARE!! May the Holy Spirit watch over and guide you every step of your journey, Brother, and bring you ALL THE PEACE A MAN CAN HANDLE!! lol

P.S- No one HAS perfect theology, Mark, yet we are all Christians. If only we all saw it that way, eh?

 

[Katy-follower]

Katy, are you trying to say that this is proving that the Bible states, that the Bible is the sole rule of faith? I think you might have gone a little off topic.

No, I didn't go off topic. It may have seemed that way to you, but the scriptures and what I wrote very much applies to what we were discussing.

I already provided the Timothy scripture in the previous post and there are many more just like it (too many to post right now).

As I stated in my other post... without scripture there is no way to test anything, to see what is false and what is true. You cannot test something unless you have something to test it against. This is how people are easily deceived, because they just listen to men. God's word is true, yet many reject what God's word says, instead listening to what men say.

Paul said it is not WHO teaches, but WHAT they are teaching. This is very relevant, because many listen to men/teachers that have an appearance of Godliness, but they do not teach truth. People trust in men and do not test what they say against scripture.

I mentioned the Bereans, as they checked everything. We are to do the same.

God's word is true and everything must be tested against the bible, otherwise a person will be deceived by men.

Hebrews 4:12: "For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart"

 

[mark54]

Amen, Brother! There's a difference between sinning ignorantly, and sinning with the knowledge of truth. We get judged much harder when we know the Truth, don't we? But I think more about the Glory in the end, then the rubbish in the past, Mark. And I can honestly say that i feel blessed to have the opportunity to encounter brothers like yourself in my life. Even if our friendship ended with this discussion, Mark, it would've been a more important friendship to me than most I've had in my life. And I thank Christ for guiding to this path and leading me to make friends like yourself, who REALLY CARE!! May the Holy Spirit watch over and guide you every step of your journey, Brother, and bring you ALL THE PEACE A MAN CAN HANDLE!! lol

P.S- No one HAS perfect theology, Mark, yet we are all Christians. If only we all saw it that way, eh?

May the Holy Spirit watch over you too and keep you safe. I am so glad we are friends, and I have been blessed by reading what you have written

A famous Evangelist, who saw tremndous miracles of healing in their services believed.
If we believe Jesus is the Son of God, he died for our sins at Calvary, and we repent of our sin and ask him into our lives as Lord and Saviour that should be enough to unite all Christians
And they believed all Christians should be able to unite around that core truth of the faith
Their dream was to see people of all denominations worshipping together as one
In their services this happeneed, denominational barriers were put to one side, and though this person would have been considered, Evangelical, right wing in thelogy to much of an extent, they met the Pope and he encuoraged them to keep on with the work God had given them to do

Just wanted to share that with you

 

[7seven7]

No, I didn't go off topic. It may have seemed that way to you, but the scriptures and what I wrote very much applies to what we were discussing.

I already provided the Timothy scripture in the previous post and there are many more just like it (too many to post right now).

As I stated in my other post... without scripture there is no way to test anything to see what is false and what is true. You cannot test something unless you have something to test it against. This is how people are easily deceived because they just listen to men. God's word is true, yet many reject what the bible says, instead listening to what men say.

Paul said it is not WHO teaches, but WHAT they are teaching. This is very relevant, because many listen to men/teachers that have an appearance of Godliness, but they do not teach truth. People trust in men and do not test what they say against scripture.

I mentioned the Bereans, as they checked everything. We are to do the same.

God's word is true and everything must be tested against the bible, otherwise a person will be deceived by men.

Hebrews 4:12: "For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart"

Yeh, hey i totally agree! Amen! but we were discussing the fact about the Bible being the sole rule of faith, and if it says so in the bible. Not if we should cross reference with the Bible. But the Bible never states that It is the only rule of faith! Never. We need to rely on tradition aswell.
"Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ. I commend you because you remember me in everything and MAINTAINED THE TRADITIONS even as I have delivered them to you" (1Cor. 11:1-2).
"Now we command you, bretheren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you recieved from us" (2Thess. 3:6).

See Katy, its not a question of Scripture or Tradition, but rather Scripture AND Tradition. Christ Himself, as well as some of the Apostles referred to unwritten Old Testament Tradition too. They go hand in hand.

 

[7seven7]

May the Holy Spirit watch over you too and keep you safe. I am so glad we are friends, and I have been blessed by reading what you have written

A famous Evangelist, who saw tremndous miracles of healing in their services believed.
If we believe Jesus is the Son of God, he died for our sins at Calvary, and we repent of our sin and ask him into our lives as Lord and Saviour that should be enough to unite all Christians
And they believed all Christians should be able to unite around that core truth of the faith
Their dream was to see people of all denominations worshipping together as one
In their services this happeneed, denominational barriers were put to one side, and though this person would have been considered, Evangelical, right wing in thelogy to much of an extent, they met the Pope and he encuoraged them to keep on with the work God had given them to do

Just wanted to share that with you

Wow thats awesome. I wonder if the Pope would've encouraged them to carry on with their work if he was of the devil?? (like so many people believe) lol

 

[lost1972]

Why is there a multi page argument on this? Christ clearly says the cup represents his blood,and the bread represents his body, these are the greatest gifts ever given to mankind, they represent life, instead of endless debates, you should. Take some time and quietly ponder what he did for you, that blood and broken body were the most pure form of love. He could have stopped it any time but he did this for you

 

[7seven7]

Why is there a multi page argument on this? Christ clearly says the cup represents his blood,and the bread represents his body, these are the greatest gifts ever given to mankind, they represent life, instead of endless debates, you should. Take some time and quietly ponder what he did for you

You would be right if we were fighting, but its merely a healthy discussion, brother. And I ponder, EVERY DAY OF MY LIFE, what my Lord did for me. And you. God bless