The False Teaching (& Truth) of what happens at the Rapture.
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Well, this comment proves that you aren't making any progress at all. I have already proved that it is from ALL the translations that say that.
Not difficult to ascertain. It occurs after the Trib.
Context does tell us. Sometimes the Bible speaks as if an event has already occurred but hasn't yet. Such as Rom 8:30 - And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.
Have you been glorified yet? That means receiving an imperishable body.
Only in your own mind.
Follow the Bible. Start with ch 19 and then just keep reading through at least v.6.
Not difficult to ascertain. It occurs after the Trib.
Context does tell us. Sometimes the Bible speaks as if an event has already occurred but hasn't yet. Such as Rom 8:30 - And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.
Have you been glorified yet? That means receiving an imperishable body.
Only in your own mind.
Follow the Bible. Start with ch 19 and then just keep reading through at least v.6.
How do we "see" that? The Bible only speaks of one resurrection for the saved and one for the unsaved.
So please explain how they cannot be the same.
And I also said this in the post you are referring to:
I've asked you to exegete the verses I've quoted over and over, but to no avail.
Why won't you address the verses that I have been sharing?
So please explain how they cannot be the same.
And I also said this in the post you are referring to:
I've asked you to exegete the verses I've quoted over and over, but to no avail.
Why won't you address the verses that I have been sharing?
That does not mean that the first resurrection (the resurrection of the righteous) cannot be in three phases. Why does the Bible compare the first resurrection to a Hebrew harvest? Because a Hebrew harvest was in three phases: (1) the first fruits, (2) the main harvest, and (3) the gleanings. And that is applied exactly to the first resurrection: (1) Christ the First Fruits, then (2) the Resurrection/Rapture which includes the entire Church, and finally (3) the resurrection of the Tribulation saints (Rev 20).
The reason why Revelation 20 connects the first resurrection to the martyred saints is because that chapter also includes the second resurrection (the resurrection of damnation) before the Great White Throne Judgment.
The reason why Revelation 20 connects the first resurrection to the martyred saints is because that chapter also includes the second resurrection (the resurrection of damnation) before the Great White Throne Judgment.
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please explain 1 Cor 15:23 then. But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
I see 2 resurrections here: Jesus as the first one, and specifically called "firstfruits", and then ONE MORE, placed "when He comes".
Are there verses that Jesus comes in phases? Please show me if you believe that.
Finally, "those who belong to Him" obviously refers to EVERY saved person in history, because He is the Savior especially of those who believe. That would include everyone from Adam forward.
It doesn't. You only imagine that was what Paul had in mind. Everyone in Paul's day understood what first fruits referred to. And Acts 26:23 specifically says that Jesus was "the first to rise from the dead", an obvious reference to receiving His imperishable glorified body.
Recall how many people were brought back to life BEFORE Jesus was resurrected: widow's son in 1 Kings 17:22, Lazarus, another widow's son, and lots of saints who came out of their graves at the crucifixion. Yet, Jesus is the FIRST human to receive a glorified body. None of the others did.
Nice try. But nope. Your 3 phases are not supported by Scripture. If you were right, the Bible would not refer to believers getting their glorified bodies in the singular.
There is no connection between "those who belong to Him" and the SECOND resurrection at all.
I see 2 resurrections here: Jesus as the first one, and specifically called "firstfruits", and then ONE MORE, placed "when He comes".
Are there verses that Jesus comes in phases? Please show me if you believe that.
Finally, "those who belong to Him" obviously refers to EVERY saved person in history, because He is the Savior especially of those who believe. That would include everyone from Adam forward.
It doesn't. You only imagine that was what Paul had in mind. Everyone in Paul's day understood what first fruits referred to. And Acts 26:23 specifically says that Jesus was "the first to rise from the dead", an obvious reference to receiving His imperishable glorified body.
Recall how many people were brought back to life BEFORE Jesus was resurrected: widow's son in 1 Kings 17:22, Lazarus, another widow's son, and lots of saints who came out of their graves at the crucifixion. Yet, Jesus is the FIRST human to receive a glorified body. None of the others did.
Nice try. But nope. Your 3 phases are not supported by Scripture. If you were right, the Bible would not refer to believers getting their glorified bodies in the singular.
There is no connection between "those who belong to Him" and the SECOND resurrection at all.
FreeGrace2 said:
Where do you get that the unsaved are "awaiting a resurrection"?
You missed my point. The word "awaiting" indicates an anticipation. No unbeliever is anticipating the GWT. Maybe after they arrive in Torments, but certainly not before.
Where do you get that the unsaved are "awaiting a resurrection"?
You missed my point. The word "awaiting" indicates an anticipation. No unbeliever is anticipating the GWT. Maybe after they arrive in Torments, but certainly not before.
FreeGrace2 said:
OK, I agree that there are just 2 resurrections; one for the saved and one for the unsaved.
To be clear, that has been my view for a long time. The way I phrased it above suggests I just changed my mind.
OK, I agree that there are just 2 resurrections; one for the saved and one for the unsaved.
To be clear, that has been my view for a long time. The way I phrased it above suggests I just changed my mind.
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That is not what was said. When Christ comes FOR His saints He does not come to the earth but comes "in the air" (or stays well above the earth) while all the saints rise to meet Him. But at the Second Coming He comes down to earth with His saints and angels. And in that coming He also stands on the Mount of Olives, which then splits in two.
And He also destroys those gathered at the battle of Armageddon. The Second Coming is to execute judgment.
And He also destroys those gathered at the battle of Armageddon. The Second Coming is to execute judgment.
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